IRC log of #schooltool for Wednesday, 2013-09-18

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th1ahi replaceafill, yvl.15:30
replaceafillgood afternoon15:30
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yvlgood afternoon15:31
yvland good morning replaceafill :)15:32
th1aWe're making replaceafill get up early.15:32
th1aOK so... Hopefully Glenda won't find a new bug today.15:33
th1aPerhaps we should debrief this process a bit.15:33
th1aSince I think we can all agree that it went pretty badly.15:33
th1aI would say one thing that made a difference compared to previous years, as much as I hate to say aelkner was right, was he always insisted on having the CanDo-ers working from a sandbox when they were testing.15:34
th1aAnd of course he was in the same time zone.15:35
th1aThe trunk packages are great in general, but we ended up in a situation where Glenda was giving us one bug at a time which we were, hopefully fixing overnight, and then getting a little feedback, finding another bug, etc.15:36
th1aThe turnaround was just too slow for all these small issues.15:36
replaceafillimho, the fundamental issue was us not paying attention to testing anymore15:37
th1aI'd say particularly if we have PAYING CUSTOMERS in the future, we'll need to be proactive about having times scheduled where we can quickly fix things.15:37
th1areplaceafill, yes, that too.15:37
th1aIn particular the permissions change would have always been a nightmare testing-wise, right?15:38
replaceafilltests warned us about all this forbidden exceptions left and right15:38
th1aWell... I don't know.15:38
th1aDid we write off real bugs as just testing cruft?15:38
replaceafillth1a, what do you mean?15:39
th1aWell, when you change the permissions, by definition you're going to throw a bunch of bugs which mostly mean you have to change the tests.15:39
th1aThey aren't really bugs, just obsolete tests.15:40
replaceafillwell, you need to extend them, right?15:40
replaceafillchanging permissions means modifying/adding functionality didn't exist15:40
th1aTo do it right would be a LOT of tests though, right?15:41
th1aLike four tests per object/action.15:42
replaceafillper role ;)15:42
th1aWhat would be the most efficient way to do that?15:42
replaceafillbut we'd have a stronger app15:43
replaceafillno clear idea from me, on most efficient way15:43
replaceafilljust do it!15:44
replaceafillat least for new functionality15:44
replaceafillcomboboxes, name change, etc15:44
th1aWell, it might be sufficient to use something selenium-based.15:44
replaceafillimho we already have a good infrastructure in place15:45
replaceafillwe just have to use it15:45
replaceafilli really enjoy using it, and keep saying "well done Justas"15:45
th1aShould these be unit tests?15:45
menesisunit tests are much faster to run15:46
menesisand testing methods of the views can be done15:46
menesisand there are many tests doing that15:46
menesisselenium tests are also needed, for the javascript, ajax stuff and integration in general15:47
menesisbut they are slow... we need some kind of fixtures, a basic school setup15:48
replaceafillwe need redundancy :D15:48
menesisso that each selenium script does not need to create users/years/terms/timetables15:48
replaceafilli created a dumb script that uses the screen command15:48
replaceafillto run stests "in parallel"15:49
replaceafillpretty dumb, but it saves me around 20 minutes when running the cando test suite15:49
replaceafillit'll burn my cpu at some point but... :D15:50
th1aI'm happy with an external fan running under my laptop replaceafill.15:50
menesis"bin/test -j 3" is supposed to run tests in parallel15:50
replaceafilldoes it work?15:51
menesisbut I haven't tried that15:51
replaceafilli remember trying it once and didn't15:51
th1aOK, so assuming we're focusing on permissions tests, how would we systematically throw these in for the additional roles?15:51
th1aAssuming we'd prefer to use unit tests.15:51
menesisno, unit tests won't help here15:52
menesisbecause problems arise like user can access section info page but not the name of the teacher15:52
replaceafilli can't imagine how to test a viewlet security for different roles using a unit test15:52
menesisso whole page is permission denied15:53
th1aOK, fine.15:53
th1aSo is this something to jam into the existing stests or is this a little side project?15:55
replaceafillin my head, it's like what we did a couple of years ago for the gradebook15:55
replaceafillin the old skin15:55
replaceafilla little side project15:55
replaceafillfor "extending coverage"15:56
th1aIt seems like you set up a basic school, create users that are in one of the key groups, and just blast through the basic objects.15:56
replaceafilland in this case, for actually fixing the tests!15:56
th1aOK.  We just can't do it *right now*.15:56
replaceafilland i've always thought we need a check list15:56
replaceafilla test inventory15:56
replaceafillor something15:56
replaceafillitem 31: test that clerk can access per skills report15:57
menesisa side project. a few new stests to check that a clerk can do what he is supposed to, including turning access options  on/off15:57
menesisor that an administrator only sees read-only views15:57
th1aWe can let replaceafill or menesis do that after the release.15:58
menesisalso we need tests for student views because they have been broken occasionally and no one noticed15:59
th1aI would point out though that a lot of what tripped up Glenda wouldn't have been found by tests.15:59
th1ai.e., the requirement to distinguish between two identical skillsets from different years.15:59
replaceafillthat was new functionality needed imho, not a bug16:00
th1aAlso there was a lot of Glenda and Dave feeling like things were difficult and spending time trying to figure out things that were just bugged.16:00
replaceafillwell... adjusting cando to their weird use case :D16:00
th1ai.e. that seems difficult because IT DOESN'T WORK.16:01
menesisyeah, sure, one can't think of every possible scenario. then you write/extend a test to check that particular case16:01
th1aIf it worked it would be much easier.  ;-)16:01
th1aThat's where we suffered from not having real time communication and quick fixes.16:01
th1aDave was also extra-heated over the duplicate skills thing because he felt it was only a problem because we'd blown off his recommendation to put skills in years.16:02
th1aGlenda has actually been pretty understanding about the whole thing.16:03
th1aShe did a great QA job too... it just unfolded painfully incrementally.16:03
replaceafillhopefully, we'll hear less from them during the next year, right?16:04
replaceafillit's not that i want to get rid of them16:04
th1aHopefully everything will work perfectly after today.  ;-)16:04
replaceafillit's just that she did a lot of testing!16:05
th1aShe also started a bit late.16:05
th1aBut I do think it is a good warning for how to avoid problems with *paying* customers.16:05
th1aOK, any other last words on this?16:06
th1aIt is good that all the bugs were pretty small, and we did have good turnaround fixing them.16:07
th1aOK, yvl?16:08
yvlI was not able to reproduce timetabling bugs16:09
yvlthe second one looks like a duplicate16:09
yvlalso there was a remake in that area of journal16:10
yvlwhat else...16:10
yvladded displaying of contact info if any is entered16:10
yvland looked at various bits and pieces16:11
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yvlalso, I'll commit extended traceback views today16:11
yvlwith plugins and their versions enumerated16:11
yvland some info like python version, OS, etc.16:12
th1aAh, good.16:12
yvlbug reports miss that info most often16:13
yvl"so what version of schooltool are you running"16:13
yvlalso, I'm adding a "Submit to Launchpad button"16:13
yvlthat will open proper project to report the bug16:14
yvland pre-fill tags with "auto traceback"16:14
yvland summary with the traceback16:14
yvlsorry, additional comments with traceback16:14
yvlit also makes user enter summary and search for similar bugs before submitting16:15
yvlbut traceback is not lost16:15
yvland... that's it.16:15
* yvl done16:15
th1aOK.  Yes, I don't see any other bugs that are low-enough hanging fruit for yvl to fix now.16:16
th1aSo you can get back to the relationship status thread when you're ready.16:16
th1aThanks yvl.16:18
replaceafillServer -> Settings -> Name Sorting16:20
replaceafillneed some wording there th1a16:20
replaceafillif you change the "Field", you'll see the different tables react accordingly16:21
replaceafillwell, most tables ;)16:21
th1aI'd say "Sort by:"16:21
replaceafillah ok16:22
th1aMaybe just that.16:22
th1aI don't know that the hint helps.16:22
replaceafilli just wanted to "warn" the user16:22
replaceafillcolumns may swap16:23
replaceafilli'll get rid of it16:23
replaceafillthen you can go to any section16:23
replaceafillfor example16:23
replaceafillclick the Gradebook link there16:24
replaceafillor the CanDo Gradebook16:24
replaceafilland the columns should also react16:24
replaceafilli have a question here th1a16:24
th1aI think trying to explain it would probably lead to more confusion than just doing it.16:24
replaceafilloh wait16:24
replaceafillthe section roster16:24
replaceafillit currently uses a full name column + username16:25
replaceafillshould we split that accordingly?16:25
replaceafillid cards use the sorting now16:25
th1aThe report?16:26
replaceafillyvl, menesis here's my diff so far:16:28
th1aI don't feel like it is necessary or desirable to change the layout of the report but you might want it to respect the sort preference.16:28
th1aOr, you WOULD want it to respect the sort preference.16:29
replaceafillth1a, it does respect the reference16:29
th1aIt is fine then.16:29
replaceafillbut again, it's unclear when you use the title16:29
replaceafilltitle of the person, i mean16:29
replaceafillon the gradebook16:29
th1aWill this be in the trunk PPA soon replaceafill?16:29
th1aIf you are looking at a printed roster you probably want it to be readable.16:30
replaceafilleehh i still need to work on the journal, virginia and intervention16:30
replaceafillso, the sorting question of the gradebook16:31
replaceafilldo we need the "Sort by" options in the two columns16:31
replaceafillthe original Name column had that option16:31
replaceafillthat allowed you to sort ascending/descending16:31
replaceafillon the column16:31
replaceafillif we want to keep it, i need to update that functionality16:32
replaceafillimho, just respecting the setting would be enough....16:32
th1aLet's say no and see if anyone complains.16:32
replaceafilland i also think we need to make the columns a little "wider"?16:33
replaceafillthis css is using the original widths16:34
replaceafillaround 180px for both columns16:34
replaceafillbut the activity/points part complicates it a little bit16:34
replaceafillsince you need more room for the second column16:34
replaceafillin this case i used a long first name and last name so you could see how the overflow is hidden16:35
replaceafillok, cando gradebook is mostly done16:35
replaceafillstill need to check the zillion reports :P16:35
replaceafillbut since they're based on the persontable, it shouldn't take long16:36
replaceafillso i'll work on that16:36
replaceafilljelkner requested an emergency fix for quiz16:37
replaceafillwhich i did last night16:37
replaceafillhe made a mistake16:37
replaceafillbecause he's now a site manager and a teacher in his instance...16:37
replaceafillhe created and deployed a course worksheet by accident16:37
replaceafillbecause he hadn't seen the option before :/16:38
* replaceafill done16:38
th1aThanks replaceafill.16:38
menesisI got a cold over the weeked, so was working from the bed16:39
menesisstill, I got something done16:39
menesismost of the time was spent tweaking the schooltool init script16:39
menesisso that it starts on a fresh install16:39
menesisand restart works16:40
th1aThanks for pushing the little fix last night.16:40
menesisI ended up adding a "sleep 5" before starting16:40
th1aI figured it needed something like that.  ;-)16:40
menesisto let the supervisor die16:40
menesisand I think it finally works well16:41
menesispart of this was testing and debugging on a virtual precise box16:41
menesisbut turns out the failure to start celery was local16:42
menesisand solved by a reboot16:42
menesisso I pushed 2.5 packages to precise dev ppa16:42
menesiswithout a warning notice and no announcement that this has been done16:43
menesisshould I do that?16:43
th1aI suppose we should!16:43
th1aIt is the *dev* PPA, so I'm not sure what the procedure should be.16:44
menesisthe release notes are updated and describe the new features and architecture16:44
th1aOK, I'll post a notice.16:44
th1aI'll handle it.16:45
menesisbut the conffiles have changed so the root might need to take manual action to resolve conflicts16:45
menesisthe advise is to anser Yes (install version provided by package)16:46
menesiswhat else16:46
th1aOh... Glenda needs to know that?16:46
th1aI guess that came up before.16:46
menesisthose questions arised when upgrading to trunk16:47
menesisand several times16:47
th1aI remember now.  ;-)16:47
menesisbut its not written what to do for others that use the ppa16:47
th1aYes, could you add that to the notes?16:48
menesisnext, I went over the projects in launchpad and set trunk as the development focus16:48
menesisshould have done that earlier16:48
menesissome of your branches may point to the wrong location on launchpad now16:49
menesisso if you get "diverged" error check where they are being pushed and push --remember ...trunk16:50
menesisalso I have upgraded a few libraries, made some zope releases that had accumulated fixes16:51
menesisnothing important, haven't seen anything break yet16:52
* menesis done16:53
th1aOK.  Thanks menesis.16:53
th1aNext week same time, gentlemen.16:54
th1aHave a good week/end.16:54
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.16:54
replaceafillthanks everybody16:54
replaceafillhave good week/end16:54
th1areplaceafill can crawl back into bed for a nap.  ;-)16:54
replaceafillbreakfast time ;)16:54
yvlsee you all next week :)16:56
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pablo___parent access?18:39
th1aHi pablo___.  Not really at this point.18:54
th1aThey can log in using the student account.18:54
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mibofrauhm.. hi :)23:03
mibofraI'm a student of an Italy scientific high school, my question is simple... is schooltool prepared to manage a school of 2000 students?23:06
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