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| dadeng | aelkner hi | 18:43 |
|---|---|---|
| th1a | dadeng: I'll get back to you about the particulars for payment next week. | 18:46 |
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| dadeng | ok | 18:46 |
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| replaceafill | th1a, zyt? | 20:10 |
| th1a | replaceafill, aye. | 20:13 |
| replaceafill | hey th1a quick gradebook question | 20:13 |
| replaceafill | we allow extra credits, correct? | 20:13 |
| replaceafill | i mean, an activity with 100 max points can have a score of 101, correct? | 20:14 |
| th1a | As I recall, yes. | 20:14 |
| replaceafill | well, i noticed the average column displays 101.0% because of that | 20:15 |
| replaceafill | can i fix that? | 20:15 |
| th1a | What would you expect it to display? | 20:15 |
| replaceafill | 100% | 20:15 |
| replaceafill | or not? | 20:15 |
| th1a | I think I'd rather have it unexpectedly retain information than hide it. | 20:16 |
| replaceafill | ah | 20:16 |
| replaceafill | cool, just seemed weird :) | 20:16 |
| th1a | One thing to check is if score systems don't expect scores over 100%. | 20:16 |
| th1a | We might not have thought about that. | 20:16 |
| replaceafill | custom score systems? | 20:17 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:17 |
| th1a | Or at all for that matter. | 20:17 |
| replaceafill | i'll check | 20:17 |
| aelkner | hey guys | 20:18 |
| replaceafill | hey aelkner | 20:18 |
| aelkner | custom score systems are discrete | 20:18 |
| th1a | How you feeling aelkner? | 20:18 |
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| aelkner | so that is not an issue | 20:18 |
| replaceafill | ah | 20:18 |
| aelkner | much better, thanks | 20:18 |
| aelkner | extra credit is for range values score systems | 20:19 |
| aelkner | and it is useful in that case | 20:19 |
| th1a | Maybe I'm forgetting the terminology. | 20:19 |
| th1a | Different scores correspond to percent ranges. | 20:19 |
| aelkner | no | 20:20 |
| th1a | ... | 20:20 |
| aelkner | ranged value score systems allow for any number from a to b | 20:20 |
| aelkner | plus any number over b as extra credit | 20:20 |
| aelkner | they use the range to determin the percentage | 20:20 |
| aelkner | discrete values score sytems only allow for specific scores | 20:21 |
| th1a | I'm thinking about when the average is converted to a grade at the end. | 20:21 |
| aelkner | no extra credit is even conceptuallu possible in those cases | 20:21 |
| aelkner | oh, that's different | 20:21 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:21 |
| th1a | That's what I meant. | 20:21 |
| aelkner | that's an interesting question | 20:21 |
| th1a | If you have 101% you should still get an "A" | 20:21 |
| aelkner | in the case of averages the percentage is reverse applied to the score system | 20:22 |
| th1a | Not a traceback. ;-) | 20:22 |
| replaceafill | you do, right aelkner? i mean, you set the lower percentage | 20:22 |
| aelkner | so yes, 101% is still an A | 20:22 |
| aelkner | as long as the logic is correct in the code :) | 20:22 |
| aelkner | are we experiencing a traceback? | 20:22 |
| th1a | As long as an "A" is defined as 95 and up rather than 95 to 100. | 20:22 |
| aelkner | right | 20:22 |
| aelkner | i'll check now | 20:23 |
| replaceafill | it works | 20:23 |
| replaceafill | i mean, you get an A with 101% | 20:23 |
| th1a | Do we have a test? | 20:23 |
| replaceafill | nope :P | 20:23 |
| replaceafill | i'll add one | 20:23 |
| th1a | Gradebook could probably use more tests. | 20:23 |
| replaceafill | i realized coverage lies some time | 20:24 |
| th1a | It is most sensitive to errors. | 20:24 |
| replaceafill | i mean, you cover statements | 20:24 |
| th1a | Yeah, that's a limited measure of something like the gradebook. | 20:24 |
| replaceafill | but maybe not logic | 20:24 |
| th1a | It doesn't mean you've covered every crazy ass way a teacher can screw things up. ;-) | 20:24 |
| replaceafill | :D | 20:24 |
| th1a | What if I set up my gradebook and delete it 20 times in a row. | 20:25 |
| th1a | Differently each time? | 20:25 |
| th1a | I have to go pay my babysitter. | 20:26 |
| aelkner | schooltool/gradebook/browser/gradebook.py (line 97) has converAverage | 20:26 |
| aelkner | f average >= score[3]: | 20:26 |
| aelkner | return score[0] | 20:26 |
| aelkner | if | 20:26 |
| aelkner | that means 101% WILL convert to A | 20:26 |
| aelkner | without crashing | 20:26 |
| * replaceafill hates those score[0], score[3]!!! | 20:27 | |
| aelkner | it's really old code | 20:27 |
| aelkner | we could re-write the gradebook :) | 20:27 |
| replaceafill | :D | 20:27 |
| aelkner | basically the scores of a discrete score system are kept as an array of arrays | 20:28 |
| replaceafill | yes | 20:29 |
| replaceafill | tuples, correct? | 20:29 |
| aelkner | if that were an array of objects, then those objects could have better names than score[3] | 20:29 |
| aelkner | yes | 20:29 |
| replaceafill | i remember i had to look that up >:( | 20:29 |
| aelkner | a smaller change that would not be a complete rewite would be to change just that aspect | 20:29 |
| aelkner | creating a new object called DscreteScore | 20:30 |
| replaceafill | to something meaningful like 'Score'! | 20:30 |
| replaceafill | right | 20:30 |
| aelkner | yeah, perhaps we could go over this together in more detail at the sprint | 20:30 |
| aelkner | and not do aything about it until we return | 20:30 |
| replaceafill | agree | 20:30 |
| aelkner | so as not to distract from the other sprint priorities | 20:30 |
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| replaceafill | aelkner, you still around? | 20:55 |
| replaceafill | the due filter widget of the gradebook only works when you hit 'Save' | 20:59 |
| replaceafill | while the Term and Section dropdowns update the gradebook instantly | 21:00 |
| replaceafill | maybe we could update the gradebook when the checkbox is marked... | 21:01 |
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| aelkner | replaceafill, perhaps | 21:05 |
| aelkner | could you form a list of gradebook issues for the sprint? | 21:05 |
| aelkner | put that one on the list | 21:05 |
| replaceafill | :) | 21:05 |
| replaceafill | will do | 21:05 |
| aelkner | it's great that tom is having you refactor | 21:06 |
| aelkner | it's long overdue | 21:06 |
| replaceafill | definitely | 21:06 |
| aelkner | especially the tests, i like that you broke up README.txt | 21:06 |
| aelkner | i hated making those comments (to make future tests pass) | 21:07 |
| replaceafill | me 2! | 21:07 |
| replaceafill | or having to check the whole readme to add something at the end | 21:07 |
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| fsufitch | aelkner, ping! | 21:28 |
| aelkner | hey there | 21:28 |
| aelkner | how goes the code reading? | 21:29 |
| aelkner | any questions? | 21:29 |
| fsufitch | not really, no, although it feels like my head's been filled with mush lately | 21:30 |
| aelkner | how so? | 21:30 |
| fsufitch | my sleep schedule's been off, i need to fix that | 21:31 |
| aelkner | i don't even have a sleep schedule :) | 21:31 |
| aelkner | but i can always target any specific hour range to be awake | 21:31 |
| fsufitch | that would actually be great if i could manage it | 21:33 |
| fsufitch | unfortunately i can't, as im at home with family | 21:33 |
| fsufitch | so i sort of have to conform to the day/night cycle... | 21:33 |
| aelkner | makes sense | 21:33 |
| aelkner | what do you think about what you;ve read so far? | 21:33 |
| aelkner | partivilarly schooltool.courseinfo | 21:34 |
| aelkner | did you branch it? | 21:34 |
| fsufitch | ive mostly been looking at person demos to see how a finished version of this looks | 21:36 |
| aelkner | i'd like you to do the branch of my branch followed by the push to your folder as i outlined in my email | 21:36 |
| aelkner | mostly to see if there are any issues to work out wth launchpad | 21:37 |
| fsufitch | ill do that right now | 21:37 |
| fsufitch | worked just fine | 21:39 |
| aelkner | good news | 21:39 |
| aelkner | try to make your comits/pushes as small as possible and ping/email me when you do | 21:40 |
| fsufitch | oaky | 21:41 |
| fsufitch | *okay | 21:41 |
| aelkner | also, we should meet after you have fully digested not only the code but David's doc | 21:41 |
| aelkner | in other words, when you think you understand the mission of the package | 21:42 |
| fsufitch | well i think i understand that now, i was just looking over the code to understand what was going on programatically | 21:42 |
| fsufitch | i met with david and talked with him about the doc a few weeks ago | 21:42 |
| aelkner | so you understand the basic idea of having a set of staging objects | 21:43 |
| fsufitch | yep | 21:43 |
| aelkner | that get deployed at the beginning of a school year | 21:43 |
| aelkner | it's nice to have a safe are to play | 21:43 |
| aelkner | without corrupting the current school year | 21:43 |
| fsufitch | yup | 21:43 |
| fsufitch | wait, this branch only contains your code, does the whole buildout system take care of using the rest of schooltool for when the code is run? | 21:44 |
| aelkner | yes | 21:44 |
| aelkner | schooltool will be downloaded as an egg | 21:44 |
| aelkner | did you do the make? | 21:44 |
| aelkner | that would be agood thing to try now | 21:45 |
| aelkner | ping me when make run is ready, ok? | 21:45 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, should fsufitch work with latest eggs? | 21:46 |
| replaceafill | that buildout uses 1.4 series | 21:46 |
| fsufitch | the make is being performed currently | 21:47 |
| fsufitch | i really need to learn how buildout works one of these days | 21:47 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, if you go to pycon, there's a talk about it :) | 21:48 |
| fsufitch | oh awesome | 21:50 |
| fsufitch | i will be at pycon, and likely at the talk :) | 21:50 |
| fsufitch | well this is bad, it couldnt install zope.ucol 1.0.2, whatever that is | 21:50 |
| replaceafill | paste the last lines somewhere | 21:50 |
| replaceafill | did you run 'make ubuntu-environment' before make? | 21:51 |
| fsufitch | oh duh, im dumb | 21:53 |
| aelkner | replaceafill, nice | 21:56 |
| fsufitch | so, no, still the same error after a make ubuntu-environment, make clean, and make | 22:04 |
| fsufitch | replaceafill, any other something i might have forgotten? | 22:06 |
| replaceafill | could you paste the traceback? | 22:06 |
| fsufitch | http://paste.lisp.org/+2JD1 | 22:09 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, you using ubuntu? | 22:10 |
| replaceafill | i guess you need python dev libraries | 22:11 |
| replaceafill | python-all-dev should have done it... | 22:11 |
| fsufitch | i am indeed using ubuntu | 22:11 |
| fsufitch | python-all-dev is already the newest version. | 22:12 |
| replaceafill | python2.6-dev? | 22:12 |
| fsufitch | already installed | 22:12 |
| replaceafill | you're on lucid? | 22:13 |
| fsufitch | 2.7-dev wasnt installed, hm | 22:13 |
| replaceafill | hhmm you should use python2.6 | 22:13 |
| replaceafill | not sure if everything goes right with 2.7 | 22:13 |
| fsufitch | er... it's telling me i'm using natty | 22:14 |
| fsufitch | that can't be right | 22:14 |
| replaceafill | try python in a terminal | 22:14 |
| fsufitch | no, it's 10.10, ok | 22:14 |
| fsufitch | it's 2.6.6 that runs | 22:14 |
| replaceafill | hhmm | 22:14 |
| replaceafill | afaik, Python.h: No such file or directory it's signal of missing python dev package | 22:15 |
| fsufitch | well yeah but i have the 2.5 2.6 and 2.7 dev packages installed | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | and it's not finding any of them | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | im trying a make clean again | 22:16 |
| replaceafill | i wonder if it's a maverick thing... | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | and um... schooltool is using python 2.5 | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | oh and there it goes, it works now | 22:16 |
| replaceafill | ah! | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | that was dumb. | 22:16 |
| fsufitch | oh yeah that's it | 22:17 |
| replaceafill | right! http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~fsufitch/schooltool/schooltool.courseinfo/annotate/head%3A/Makefile | 22:17 |
| fsufitch | python2.5-dev is NOT included in ubuntu's python-all-dev anymore | 22:17 |
| replaceafill | you will need to update that at some point | 22:17 |
| replaceafill | to match cando in lucid i think | 22:17 |
| fsufitch | i think i reported that as a bug a while ago | 22:17 |
| replaceafill | i guess the branch you branched is kind of old | 22:18 |
| replaceafill | right, march 2010! | 22:18 |
| fsufitch | heh | 22:19 |
| fsufitch | okay | 22:19 |
| fsufitch | well if it's fixed in trunk im not gonna mess with it | 22:19 |
| replaceafill | you should ask menesis about this versioning stuff, he's the expert :) | 22:20 |
| fsufitch | kay | 22:20 |
| fsufitch | oof, i forgot how long these makes took to run | 22:24 |
| fsufitch | i upgraded my computer's CPU recently, too | 22:24 |
| replaceafill | i7? | 22:25 |
| fsufitch | i don't use overpriced intel stuff | 22:26 |
| replaceafill | :| | 22:26 |
| fsufitch | amd phenom II x4 3.2 ghz | 22:26 |
| fsufitch | :) | 22:27 |
| fsufitch | i mean sure, intel might have a slight edge in performance, but it's really not worth paying 2x the price | 22:27 |
| replaceafill | wow, 2x!?!? | 22:28 |
| fsufitch | for similar performance, yes | 22:28 |
| fsufitch | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115224&cm_re=i7_3.2_ghz-_-19-115-224-_-Product vs http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103727&cm_re=amd_phenom_ii_x4-_-19-103-727-_-Product | 22:29 |
| fsufitch | i mean, come on | 22:29 |
| fsufitch | it's a bit better, but more than 2x the cost | 22:30 |
| replaceafill | 159 vs 579?!?!? | 22:30 |
| fsufitch | mhm | 22:31 |
| * replaceafill would like to run schooltool tests on one of those :) | 22:31 | |
| fsufitch | on one of what, those processors? | 22:32 |
| replaceafill | yes | 22:32 |
| replaceafill | the 579 one | 22:32 |
| fsufitch | oh yea | 22:32 |
| fsufitch | would run quite nicely | 22:32 |
| fsufitch | though what you REALLY want to run tests on is google's cloud computing system :) | 22:33 |
| fsufitch | i interned at them last summer, and it is the most wonderful thing ever | 22:33 |
| fsufitch | especially since i worked on their build system | 22:33 |
| replaceafill | :| | 22:33 |
| fsufitch | like, the amount of time this make is taking is horrendous | 22:33 |
| fsufitch | in the cloud system it would have been done in 2-3 minutes tops | 22:33 |
| fsufitch | 10 minutes for full compilation of a huge project like gmail | 22:33 |
| replaceafill | !!! | 22:34 |
| replaceafill | is there like an estimate on how fast that works? | 22:34 |
| replaceafill | i mean, like GHz or somethign | 22:34 |
| fsufitch | well no, because when it takes 10 minutes that's because it uses thousands of machines to do the work all at once :) | 22:35 |
| fsufitch | it's hyperparallel across a very large numbers of nodes | 22:35 |
| fsufitch | plus it's efficient too (which is what i worked on) | 22:35 |
| replaceafill | wow | 22:35 |
| fsufitch | it only compiles what's necessary, and even when some things need to be compiled, they are checked against a cache to possibly just use a pre-compiled version of the same code | 22:36 |
| fsufitch | along with a lot of other stuff similar to that | 22:36 |
| fsufitch | to ensure no work is done needlessly | 22:36 |
| fsufitch | it's pretty amazing :) | 22:36 |
| fsufitch | there is seriously something called an omelette in the egg structure? | 22:39 |
| replaceafill | :D | 22:40 |
| replaceafill | a useful one | 22:40 |
| fsufitch | sigh, if i try to make run, one of the config files fails | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | zope.configuration.xmlconfig.ZopeXMLConfigurationError: File "/home/fsufitch/schooltool.courseinfo/instance/school.zcml", line 4.2-4.44 | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | ZopeXMLConfigurationError: File "/home/fsufitch/schooltool.courseinfo/eggs/schooltool-1.4.3.1-py2.5.egg/schooltool/stapp2007/configure.zcml", line 10.2-10.60 | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | ZopeXMLConfigurationError: File "/home/fsufitch/schooltool.courseinfo/src/schooltool/courseinfo/plugin.zcml", line 4.4-4.27 | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | ZopeXMLConfigurationError: File "/home/fsufitch/schooltool.courseinfo/src/schooltool/courseinfo/configure.zcml", line 69.2-69.32 | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | ZopeXMLConfigurationError: File "/home/fsufitch/schooltool.courseinfo/src/schooltool/courseinfo/browser/configure.zcml", line 15.2-21.8 | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | ConfigurationError: ('Invalid value for', 'class', "ImportError: Couldn't import schooltool.courseinfo.browser.courseinfo, No module named courseinfo") | 22:42 |
| fsufitch | make: *** [run] Error 1 | 22:42 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, was that branch 'stable'? | 22:43 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, definitely, that module is missing :) | 22:45 |
| aelkner | i don't remember | 22:47 |
| aelkner | i'll try right now | 22:48 |
| fsufitch | it seems that a browser conf file is trying to import .courseinfo, which indeed does not exist | 22:48 |
| aelkner | we never got around to writing the browser code, so it could be in need of repair | 22:49 |
| aelkner | i'd remove aything you can't fix for now | 22:49 |
| aelkner | also, the buildout.cfg may need updating | 22:50 |
| aelkner | it dates back to the summer, and much has changed since then in the zope eggs | 22:50 |
| fsufitch | right | 22:50 |
| aelkner | try replacing 1.4 with trunk | 22:52 |
| aelkner | in base.cfg | 22:52 |
| fsufitch | ok | 22:52 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, i'd ask menesis about that first | 22:52 |
| aelkner | why wait? it's not live code | 22:52 |
| replaceafill | i mean, if this should work with cando, cando uses the 1.4 series | 22:53 |
| replaceafill | but, right, it's not live | 22:53 |
| aelkner | looking at my schooltool.niepa package, which uses cando, 1.4 is replaced with trnk | 22:53 |
| replaceafill | you can 'experiment' :P | 22:53 |
| aelkner | and there's the aditional link for cando | 22:53 |
| replaceafill | and backporting is also an option | 22:53 |
| aelkner | but filip doesn't need that | 22:53 |
| fsufitch | well, there chugs the make again... | 22:53 |
| fsufitch | too late, heh | 22:53 |
| aelkner | good news | 22:53 |
| aelkner | chugging is good :) | 22:54 |
| replaceafill | you'll get the same error :P | 22:54 |
| replaceafill | but with newer eggs ;) | 22:54 |
| fsufitch | at least they're not all in one basket | 22:55 |
| aelkner | :) | 22:55 |
| aelkner | still chugging? | 22:55 |
| fsufitch | yep | 22:56 |
| fsufitch | it's fetching all of zope again, after all | 22:56 |
| aelkner | i predict success | 22:57 |
| replaceafill | $100 | 22:57 |
| replaceafill | :D | 22:57 |
| aelkner | i said predict, not bet :) | 22:57 |
| replaceafill | ah! :( | 22:58 |
| fsufitch | make: *** [bin/test] Error 1 | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | :D | 22:59 |
| aelkner | ? | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | Got zope.event 3.5.0-1. | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | The version, 3.7.0, is not consistent with the requirement, 'zope.dublincore<3.7'. | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | While: | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | Installing package. | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | Error: Bad version 3.7.0 | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | make: *** [bin/test] Error 1 | 22:59 |
| fsufitch | wait... what? | 22:59 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, can you paste your base.cfg? | 23:00 |
| aelkner | btw, where are you getting these pastes? i haven't seen any notification in this channel | 23:01 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, does that still work? | 23:01 |
| fsufitch | http://paste.lisp.org/+2JD1/1 | 23:02 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, i'd "rm -r eggs/zope.event*" | 23:03 |
| replaceafill | and rerun make | 23:03 |
| replaceafill | oh sorry | 23:03 |
| replaceafill | dublincore :P | 23:03 |
| fsufitch | why does that sound like a genre of metal music? | 23:04 |
| aelkner | setup.py probably needs to be pdated | 23:04 |
| fsufitch | ruunning your rm didnt work... | 23:05 |
| fsufitch | sigh... | 23:05 |
| aelkner | i annotated your paste with niepa's setup.py | 23:05 |
| replaceafill | dependency_links=['http://ftp.schooltool.org/schooltool/1.4/'], | 23:05 |
| aelkner | right, that needs to change | 23:06 |
| aelkner | but i would look at all of the annotation | 23:06 |
| aelkner | fsufitch, or just replace it? | 23:08 |
| aelkner | probably easier | 23:08 |
| fsufitch | the setup.p? | 23:09 |
| fsufitch | *py | 23:09 |
| fsufitch | hmm okay | 23:09 |
| aelkner | yeah, but niepa would need to be changed to courseinfo | 23:10 |
| aelkner | a simple edit/replace | 23:10 |
| aelkner | cando could be removed | 23:10 |
| fsufitch | hmmo k | 23:10 |
| fsufitch | done | 23:12 |
| fsufitch | afk for a bit while make runs | 23:12 |
| replaceafill | fsufitch, that branch builds with this diff http://paste.lisp.org/display/118405#3 | 23:26 |
| replaceafill | it doesnt start of course ;) | 23:26 |
| replaceafill | but it does build | 23:26 |
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| fsufitch | replaceafill, it's aliiive | 23:44 |
| fsufitch | IT'S ALIIIIIIIIIIVE! | 23:44 |
| replaceafill | :)) | 23:44 |
| fsufitch | so, is it weird that this computer has about 4 different HTTP servers running on it currently? | 23:46 |
| replaceafill | ? | 23:46 |
| fsufitch | there's apache, schooltool (zope), pybookbuilder (web2py), and my blog (pythonpaste) | 23:47 |
| replaceafill | :) | 23:47 |
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