IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2010-12-06

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dadengHi aelkner00:58
aelknerdadeng, hey02:03
aelkneryou still there?02:03
aelkneri was hoping you could send me that screenshot02:03
aelknerso we can be looking at the same thing02:03
dadengwhich one? the earlier one?02:04
aelkneryou said, "the average column on the screenshot i sent to u is not displaying well"02:05
aelknerbut you never sent me the screenshot02:05
aelknermaybe you sent it to tom02:06
dadengok, i'll resend now02:07
dadengi sent it to your gmail02:13
aelknerok, i got, so you were asking about the Ave. column?02:15
dadengcan u see it?02:18
dadengis the display ok like that?02:20
aelkneractually, it looks backwards, like the total has the average and the average has the total02:21
aelkner77-100 means 77 out of 100 possible02:21
aelkner77.0 would be the average 77/10002:21
dadengsomehow, well, in that case there is a serious problem, because of other rows that display something different02:22
dadengbut i think it just need to display average total scores02:22
dadeng77 out of 100 is implied and well understood02:23
dadengbut it should display just 7702:23
dadengthere are other issues02:23
dadengcan we go on them?02:23
aelknergo on them?02:24
aelknerhow does one go on something?02:25
dadengok, do u have an instance running there?02:25
dadengok, try login as a teacher with username, AKINWALE, password adeyemi02:25
dadengwhat do u observer?02:26
aelknerlooks like you found a bug :)02:28
dadengbut were u able to eventually login?02:28
aelkneri logged in as you suggested and got the error that you got02:29
dadengi mean with this teacher?02:29
aelknerthat's what i meant by you finding a bug02:29
dadengif u click further, it will log u in02:29
aelknerit may be related to the custom button that we are putting in your package02:30
aelkneroh no, i don't have a problem logging in, i just see the system error when i log in02:30
dadengclick anyhting like session etc on that view and it'll log u in02:30
aelkneri thought that's what you were getting02:30
dadengno, i really went further with the teacher login02:31
aelkneri don't understand 'go further'02:32
aelknerif you log out, you see a login view02:32
aelknerif you enter the password, what happens02:32
dadengafter u got the error, just click on any link on that same view and it'll log u in02:32
aelknerthat's not true02:32
aelkneryou are already logged in when you got the error02:33
dadengtry it pls02:33
aelknerclicking on something else just gives you a page that doesn't have a bug02:33
aelknerbut the logging in part was accomplished on the same transaction that you got the error02:33
aelknerok, anyway02:33
aelkneri need to find out what causes the error02:33
dadengso let's click on journal02:33
dadengyeah, u'll do that later, i think02:34
dadengi still have some other issues02:34
aelknerso i clicked on the journal02:34
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aelknersorry about that, i hit alt-f4 when i was going for alt-f302:36
dadengok, click on basic technology(134) for example02:36
aelknerok, clicked02:36
dadengare u there?02:36
dadengafter term grading02:36
aelknerthe journal is in view02:36
dadengthose columns what do they represent?02:36
aelknerthe top number is the day of the month, the bottom one, the period id (first three chars at least)02:37
dadengok, like 04 is month while 13 is the day of the month?02:38
aelkner04 is the day of the month, 13 the period id02:38
dadengoh, period id02:39
aelknerthe the month is may, the higlighted tab02:39
aelknerthat's a relief, at least it's not a bug :)02:39
dadengand this take care of whether the student was in attendance or not?02:39
dadengok, good02:39
aelkneryou can enter a number too02:39
dadengthe number will be for what?02:40
aelkneractually, strike that02:40
dadengpls explain02:40
aelknerthat's an esoteric feature for some schools that grade and give attendance in one score02:40
aelkneryou won't want that02:40
aelkneryou have the gradebook for your grades02:40
aelknerand you can use the journal for your attendance02:41
dadengmay be it is needed let's leave it02:41
aelknerthat is the most common use cases02:41
dadengyes, that is if attendance carries some marks02:41
dadengand why should it not in a continuous assessment environment?02:41
dadengthe schools here operate on continuous assessment02:42
dadengbut i'm not sure marks are awarded for attendance02:42
aelknerso, do you have any other observations, bugs found?02:43
dadengbut can u explain to me how the grading works for schools that use that?02:44
aelkneruse what?02:44
dadengwell... i'll make my people in the office click as much as possible later today and i'll get back to u02:44
dadengu said the columns we talked about above are used for grading02:45
aelknerin the journal?02:45
dadengthat is each period is graded02:45
dadengi think i even can picture how it works now02:45
aelknerplease forget i mentioned grading in the journal02:45
aelkneri t only supports a single digit per cell02:45
dadengu just enter the graded for each period id02:46
aelknerfine for (a - absent, p - present)02:46
aelknerbut 1-9 is available02:46
aelkneri'm just saying, probably of no use for you02:46
aelkneryou want to grade activities in the gradebook02:46
aelknerthat's all i'm saying02:46
aelknerand why i'm sorry i mentioned it02:47
dadengoh, it good u mentioned it02:47
dadengit can serve this scenerio02:47
dadengok, but if the month is 04, and the period id is 13 for example02:48
dadengwhat about those ones showing something like 13 at the top and 10 below?02:48
dadengdefinitely there is no month that is 1302:48
aelkneryou forgot, 13 is the day of the month, 10 the period id02:49
dadengso 04 is the day of the month and not month per se02:49
aelknerlook up in the chat, we discussed this02:50
aelkneri said that the month is the highlighted tab, May02:50
dadengok, yes02:51
aelkneranyway, i need an idea of what your priorities are for the demo02:51
aelknerfor insance, i continue to note that you don't seem interested in the census demos i set up for you02:51
dadengthat means this subject was taken 6 times in may?02:51
dadenggood, i'm interested in this02:52
dadengbecause the average column means alot in terms of the sms feature02:52
dadengthis is the real class work scores02:52
dadengit is a good feature alan02:53
aelknerwhat are you planning on demonstrating with those fields?02:53
aelkneryou're not asking me anything about them02:53
aelknerso, i can't assume that you are even going to show them in the demo02:54
dadengmonthly, there is average score sent via sms for school inspection purposes02:54
dadengwe'll demonstrate that actually class work for students get stored within schooltool02:54
dadengdo u understand?02:55
aelknerand no demo of the census fields?02:55
dadengwhere is this census field on the journal?02:56
dadengi think it is a different thing all together02:56
dadengwe definitely need that done02:56
aelknerdadeng, please, forget the gradebook for a second, forget the journal02:56
aelkneryou sent us a census form02:56
aelkneri've worked for weeks now trying to get your custom schooltol02:57
dadengu have finished with this already02:57
dadengthere is no problem with it02:57
aelknerto allow for entering census data02:57
dadengyes, finish it up02:57
aelkneryou've been using that fields?02:57
dadengwell done!!!02:57
aelkneryou will be entering data and showing it in the demo?02:58
dadengwe have uptill 16th dec, for ur info02:58
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dadengoh, i dont understand02:58
aelknerthe 16th02:58
aelknerthat gives us more time02:58
aelknerwhat don't you understand?02:58
dadengthe fields u said i've been using02:58
aelknerthere are three key forms02:59
aelkneradd/edit teacher, student or location (think classroom)02:59
aelknerin those forms02:59
aelknerthere are fields sets that are entitled ... ddemographics02:59
aelknerall of those fields, on all three of those forms, added up03:00
aelknermake up the source of any census report we would write03:00
aelkneri've begun work on the actual report03:00
aelknerif we have to the 16th, i can get you something that looks reasonable03:01
aelknerand also fix these bugs you are finding03:01
aelknerbut anyway, regarding the census data03:01
aelkneri wanted you to look that over, and have your people clicking around that area03:01
aelknerand entering data that can later appear on the census report03:02
aelkneron report will return a pdf for the whole school03:02
aelknerah, i forgot03:02
aelknerone more form03:02
aelknerthe School Info lin k on the Manage tab03:02
aelknerthat has fileds that are for the census report as well03:02
aelknerthat makes four forms that have to do with the census03:02
dadengok, the meeting is on the 16th, so let say we have up till 15th03:03
aelknerafter looking those forms over, so you see how entering data in them would allow us03:03
aelknerto generate the one pdf census report03:03
aelknerthat could be sent to the ministries03:03
aelknerdoes that make sense?03:04
dadengpls pardon this serious omission03:04
aelknerserious omission, how so?03:05
dadengwe need a field where the geo co ordinate of the school will appear03:05
dadengthis is crucial for schools mapping03:05
dadengit was on that form03:05
dadengit was not on that form03:05
dadengit doesnt to link to anything yet03:06
aelknerhow many things were missing from the form you sent us?03:06
dadengto be frank i don't know but they will show up at the meeting03:06
dadengthis is the first time we are having the people together to give the real input03:06
dadengbut i know school mapping is a major requirement for any emis03:07
dadengpls how do i save this chat for future reference?03:08
dadengi need to keep this information for instruction to people who will do the clicking03:08
dadengare u there?03:09
dadengok, i figure that out myself03:11
dadengi'll soon go to bed is almost 3am here and i'm going to office by 8am03:12
dadengwe'll do what u requested and get back to you later in the day03:13
aelknersorry, i'm back03:15
aelknerdadeng, still there?03:15
aelkneri'll give a link to schooltool chats03:16
dadengok, good03:16
aelkneralso, can we meet tomorrow?03:16
dadengyes today later in the day03:16
dadengso, see u later03:16
aelknerok, cya soon03:17
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dadengand well done!!!03:17
aelkneroh, thanks03:17
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aksyvl: ping11:24
yvlpong, aks11:37
aksyvl: did you have had time to test my scripts?11:37
yvlsorry, no11:37
yvlI'm a bit stumped with other stuff11:37
yvlso only read the sources :)11:38
aksyvl: oh ok, did replaceafill test it? do you have any idea?11:38
yvlby the way - is it ok if we mirror your repo in Launchpad once it's "stable"11:38
yvlaks, I'll ask him in dev meeting today11:38
aksyvl: yes you can11:38
yvldev meeting is in 5 hours11:39
aksoh ok11:39
yvlit'll be early Monday morning for people in another continent ;)11:39
aksyvl: now that dev meeting should also consider packagers like me :D11:39
yvlof course ;)11:40
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th1aHi replaceafill, aelkner, yvl, menesis.16:30
replaceafillgood morning16:31
yvlgood morning :)16:32
th1aWell, thanks to everyone's good work we all have jobs for another year.16:32
th1aI appreciate that.  ;-)16:33
yvlgood news indeed :)16:33
th1aaelkner:  How was the weekend with David?16:34
replaceafillaelkner, i agree with menesis, it looks like a custom score system for the average16:35
replaceafillaelkner, do you have access to that database?16:35
aelknerok, i'll look into the custom score system idea16:35
aelknerdavid had a lot of things to ask about his schooltool instance, none of which had to do with census demos16:36
aelknerwhich was disappointing, but he did find some bugs16:37
th1aWe need them anyhow.16:37
aelknerthe first of which i reported, the second one is that the teacher's go view crashes16:37
th1aIn CanDo?16:37
aelknersomething about a component lookup error16:37
yvlI noticed that too16:38
yvlbut didn't check16:38
aelkneryvl, could you reproduce that and take a quick look for me?16:38
yvlbeing in teachers or students group usually means something in CanDo16:38
yvl(and I couldn't find a way to populate the instance with courses)16:39
replaceafillaelkner, i can help there if you want16:39
aelknerreplaceafill, that would be great, thanks16:39
aelknerthere's also another issue, and that is the custom viewlet managers16:40
aelkneri copied the concept from schooltool.cambodia, but i'm not sure i like it too much16:40
aelknerhaving a custom action viewlet manager means having to add each link back16:41
aelknerthat is already registered in all the packages in core16:41
aelkneryvl, that's why you could figure out how to add a course, becuase the link was gone16:41
aelkneri was thinking, is there any reason why we have to REPLACE the action viewlet manager?16:41
aelknerisn't there a way to keep the default action links and maybe slectively REMOVE them?16:42
aelknerin a rare case, i could see not wanting some of the person links anymore16:42
aelknersinve we have the special concept of adding teachers, students and administrators16:43
aelknerperhaps removing Add Person would make sense16:43
aelknerbut by simply replacing the action viewlet manager, we loose all those context links set up in all the packages16:44
aelkneranyway, any thoughts?16:44
replaceafillaelkner, i guess it's easier to add new buttons than disabling some16:44
replaceafillfor instance, the section action links are a lot16:45
aelknereasier to readd EVERY button defined in 100 different places throughout schooltool core?16:45
replaceafillaelkner, at least cambodia hasn't needed all of them16:45
replaceafillmaybe niepa is different16:45
aelknerperhaps so16:46
yvlok, first for the broken view problem16:46
th1aaelkner may want a different approach here, since Cambodia is a really minimal case.16:46
yvltrue, th1a16:46
yvlyou need to use INewCanDoSkin instead of INewCanDoLayer16:46
yvlsome of the content is registered for the layer, some for the skin16:47
yvl(skin inherits the layer)16:47
yvlcomments say it's BBB naming16:47
yvlwhatever that means16:47
aelknerdid you change that, and it worked?16:48
aelknerwhat files did you need to change?16:48
aelknerok, thanks, that helps a lot16:48
yvlas for removing links16:49
yvlreplaceafill and th1a are right16:49
aelknerth1a, so i could revert the custom action viewlet idea and try adding the links to the standard manager16:49
yvlif you want most (or all) of them16:49
yvlyou should keep the good old viewlet manager16:49
yvlit is possible to disable unwanted links IIRC16:50
replaceafillfor the class of the viewlet16:50
aelknerok, thanks, i can look into that16:51
aelknerso david also had confusions with the journal16:51
yvlyes, define the disabled viewlet for each of the unwanted links, on your own skin16:51
aelknerfiguring out what was a month, day of month, period id16:52
aelkneri helped him recognize the screen elements16:53
aelkneri was disappointed that he didn't mention the demo fields16:53
aelknerbut when i pointed them out, he liked what he saw16:54
th1aThat is probably just because he isn't a teacher.16:54
th1a(the journal questions)16:54
th1aIf you've ever done it on paper it wouldn't be confusing.16:54
aelknerso he said that the demo is postponed for dec 16th, one week later16:55
aelkneri can't say that i'm disappointed, there seems to be a lot to address16:55
th1aI don't know what to think, really.16:55
th1aBut as long as we're fixing things that need fixing anyhow, it is ok.16:56
aelkneri started working on the census pdf, but just started it16:57
aelknerthis week, i can get that done, in time for the supposed new demo date16:57
th1aIt is worth doing.16:57
th1aOK.  Thanks aelkner.16:58
th1areplaceafill?  We've been keeping you jumping.16:58
replaceafillit's fun though ;)16:58
replaceafillok, i'm still in the gradebook preferences work16:59
replaceafilli'm in the UI part now16:59
replaceafilli also tested the cando hiccup reported by dwelsh17:00
replaceafilltried some applications to 'simulate' the hiccup, but didnt get the same results17:00
replaceafillactually the apps simulate slow bandwith, not timeouts17:00
replaceafilli guess the ACC trouble are timeouts17:00
replaceafillbut as i reported, the gradebook template for cando can be cleaned17:01
replaceafilla little17:01
replaceafillalso, i tested the scripts aks created for building rpms for schooltool17:01
replaceafilli just sent him my findings17:01
th1aSo... are there separate requests taking place to load the comps?17:01
replaceafillth1a, ?17:02
th1aAre some parts being loaded separately by javascript requests?17:03
replaceafillah yes, two different views17:03
th1aHow does that work?17:03
replaceafillone for the view template and one for the javascript template17:03
th1aAnd the js one is timing out?17:04
replaceafillin the view, there's a <link ...> tag that calls another view that generates the javascript17:04
replaceafillthe first problem is that the javascript code uses onload on the body tag17:04
replaceafillbut the gradebook has TWO body tags!17:04
replaceafilland the onload=... is in the second one...17:04
th1aCould that be causing the problem in itself?17:05
replaceafillth1a, probably, that + slow bandwith17:05
replaceafillnot sure though17:05
th1aI mean, one reason the web works is that you generally don't render a page when it isn't complete.17:05
th1aOnce that starts happening on a form, you're screwed.17:05
th1aSlow would be preferable.17:06
replaceafilli'd like to at least move the onload to the right body tag and ask dwelsh to test it17:06
replaceafillbut, if i'm cleaning that little part, i could clean other parts of the same template?17:06
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replaceafillwill ask dwelsh for permission on the acc server to set a testing instance17:07
replaceafillso they have the same setup17:07
replaceafillor almost17:07
th1aAt this point don't spend two days trying to recreate the bug.17:07
th1aJust do the obvious fixes and let them try it.17:07
replaceafilloh ok17:08
th1aIf it is still broken, then we may need to figure out how to replicate it.17:08
replaceafillwill do that then17:08
th1aOK, sounds like you're set for the week then, replaceafill.17:08
replaceafillbtw, just to point out, no news from javier yet17:09
replaceafillth1a, that's all from me17:09
th1areplaceafill:  Thanks!17:10
menesislast week did a few things17:11
menesisinvestigated the cando issue that teachers names are not accessible17:11
menesisreverted that change in schooltool/1.4 and re-released17:12
menesisthat fixed cando failure that was happening for a week17:12
menesisthen updated release notes in the book and sent an announcement17:12
menesislater, worked on ubuntu packages17:13
menesisupdated status page that is published to print less noise17:13
menesisadded links to ppa and status pages to the wiki, emailed Daniel & Co17:14
menesisthey uploaded a few packages, still sitting in the NEW queue17:14
menesisDaniel pointed out some problems, mostly about licenses17:14
menesiswrote email to zope-dev about that17:15
menesisgot a few replies, a couple packages were fixed17:15
menesisupdated schooltool versions to use them17:15
menesissplitted schooltool/1.5 for maverick versions and releases17:16
menesisschooltool/trunk now points to 1.6 (on ftp.s.o)17:16
menesisUploaded some 30 packages to the PPA17:17
th1aWhat is the NEW queue?17:17
menesiswhen someone uploads a package, either me or a sponsor, it first goes to the NEW queue17:18
menesisthey have to be reviewed by archive admins, only then they go on and are built and published17:18
menesisnew packages take some time to go through17:19
th1aAt that point it is pretty much out of our hands, correct?17:19
th1aAnd the problems that have been pointed out have been caught prior to that point, correct?17:20
menesisthis time, yes17:20
menesisbut some times archive admins can reject an upload17:21
th1aDo you know if the archive admins are looking for anything in particular?17:21
menesisI know that they carefully check licenses and copyrights17:22
menesismaybe something else, but I try to check everything myself17:22
th1aOK, well, keep at it.17:23
th1aI'll try to not throw more distractions at you.17:23
th1aAnything else?17:26
menesisthat's it17:26
th1aOK, a couple words about bonuses next year.17:26
th1aEveryone is eligible for bonuses.17:26
th1aThey'll be based on roughly three week's worth of work.17:27
th1aYou won't always be working on a bonus project, as there will be transition time between.17:27
th1aYou won't end one on June 30 and start a new one on July 1.17:27
th1aAnd we'll be planning and discussing these targets publicly (here).17:28
th1aSo you might have 10 bonus opportunities a year.17:28
th1aDoes that generally make sense?17:29
th1aMaybe 8.17:29
th1aAnd slightly bigger ones for the releases.17:29
yvlbonuses for smaller time frames make sense to me17:30
th1aOh... yvl!17:31
yvlhi :)17:31
th1aYes, and your report?  ;-)17:31
yvlslow progress on timetable UI last week17:31
yvldevelopment seems to be picking up the pace though17:32
yvlz3c.form is a real disappointment when it comes to something more complex than a trivial form17:32
yvl(to be fair - formlib is disappointing there also)17:32
yvlI'm actually afraid to give any estimates now17:33
yvlas in - scared to the bones :)17:33
th1aWell, please wrap it up before the end of the year.17:34
yvlI understand why17:34
yvlmy target is to wrap it up until Christmas17:34
th1aMake it so.17:34
yvlhence - should be in somewhat usable shape untill 19th17:35
yvlwell, that's that17:36
th1aOK then.  Thanks yvl.17:36
th1ayvl, menesis and I are going to have a conference call on Thursday with the Critical Links guys.17:37
th1aHave a great week gentlemen!17:38
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.17:38
yvla great week for you all!17:38
replaceafillthanks everybody17:39
aelknerthanks all17:40
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replaceafillth1a, i was able to reproduce the 'undefined' problem (changing the competency group in the gradebook quickly several times)21:03
th1aAh, good.21:03
replaceafilland after moving the javascript code into the template i cannot reproduce it anymore21:03
th1aFixing that "body" problem?21:03
replaceafillthat too21:03
th1aOK, cool.21:03
th1aThat's probably the problem.21:04
replaceafilli think there are javascript functions that can be loaded from external src=... script tags21:05
replaceafilland maybe the dynamic parts of javascript should be put in the same template21:05
replaceafillthat way, we guarantee that the dynamic parts are calculated *before* the template rendering21:05
th1aThat sounds right.21:06
replaceafillfunction setWarning(text, bg){21:06
replaceafill    document.getElementById('warningtext').innerHTML = text;21:06
replaceafill    document.getElementById('warning').style.backgroundColor = bg;21:06
replaceafillfor example21:06
replaceafilli'll wait for matt's reply to my sudo request and will set up a testing instance21:06
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aelknerdadeng, hey23:28

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