IRC log of #schooltool for Thursday, 2005-04-14

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bskahanis there any benefit to exposing last modifying principal and last modified time in the UI?15:48
bskahanI'm leaning towards exposing it for events in group calendars and exposing it for persons,groups, resources, and events if the principal is manger15:49
bskahanI'd say exposing it generally might be good, except that the username is ugly15:49
* bskahan assumes everyone checks IRC logs15:50
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Velmontbskahan: What about making it depend on a variable? So that one can choose if one want to see it. (If that is doable :] )19:10
bskahanVelmont: that's doable19:17
bskahanI'd rather avoid a preference option if possible though19:17
bskahanrather put it in the places where people need it by default19:17
bskahanth1a: will a section ever be a section of multiple courses?20:10
th1aI mean, it isn't a huge burden to allow it, is it?20:11
bskahanno, not at all20:11
th1aOne of the primary advantages of using our directed graph model is that it is easy to allow multiples of all this kind of stuff.20:12
* bskahan nods20:12
th1aWhereas in your database tables, it is a pain.20:12
bskahanif it was a use case that would never happen then a course could be a container of sections rather than a group of sections20:12
bskahanneither is easier and making it a group of sections is more flexible20:12
th1aThis is the kind of edge case we want to allow.20:13
th1aNon-traditional schools are a target audience.20:13
bskahanthere won't be UI for doing at this point...20:14
bskahanthat's not true20:14
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th1aIt isn't a big deal UI wise at this point.20:15
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bskahanSections can be subclasses of Group, they get stored in the GroupContainer20:24
bskahanall participants in the section, meaning teachers and students, get membership in the Section20:25
bskahanthen I'll add new SectionInstruction and SectionParticipant relationships to seperate out the teachers from the students20:26
bskahanadding a user to the SectionInstruction relationship with SectionInstructor Role would a "Teacher" annotation to the person20:27
bskahanand the opposite for "Student"20:27
bskahanthat's an RFC, if anyone was wondering who I'm talking to ;)20:28
bskahanUI wise, this poses only one problem, if someone uses the generic membership forms to add a person to a group as member20:30
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FarcePestmembership relationship is seperate from teacher/student relationship?20:30
bskahanmembership is generic20:30
bskahanthe alternate way is to just make everyone a member and use annotations only to decide who is a teacher and who is a student20:31
th1abskahan:  catching up...20:31
bskahanthat sounds better20:31
bskahanth1a: you can skip it, writing it out made me realize it was crack20:31
th1aMake sure and give me a chance to think about the terminology -- or at least be prepared to change it.20:32
bskahanyou can change it, I was just trying to decide how I would know who was in charge20:33
th1aActually, I'm going to go get lunch and hit some baseballs, and then I'll really, truly, for real work on the glossary for  few hours.20:33
* bskahan cheers20:33
bskahanI won't have to commit my """Course TODO: add description from glossary""" docstrings20:33
* tvon thinks relationships is better than annotations20:36
tvoneasier to get the info (as opposed to looping through all members of the group), and what would the annotation hold?20:37
bskahantvon: you may be right, once I started writing, I realized that the teacher would have to have a teacher annotation for each class20:40
tvonYou'd still need a relationship for each class though, wouldn't you?20:40
bskahanthe annotations could be a dict though20:40
tvonrelationships seem more fitting though20:40
bskahanits alot more code20:41
bskahanI'm not sure if there are any real world benefits to one way over the other20:41
tvonit seems to me to be a fairly exact example of what relationships are for20:42
tvonand wouldn't it be a lot easier to go between the two if they were linked with relationships instead of the info being stored just in a dict on the teacher?20:43
bskahanusing 3 types of relationships doesn't fix the issue of people being added as members20:43
bskahanknow what I mean?20:44
bskahanthe section will show up in the Group forms, so you could add someone to the section20:45
bskahanas a member, but without setting their student/teacher status20:45
tvonDo they have to use the exact same form?20:46
tvon(as normal groups)20:46
bskahanthere will be a different for specifically for Sections20:46
bskahanbut i believe they will show up in the generic group form20:47
tvonbecause of the zcml?20:47
bskahanbecause of the way that group form works20:48
bskahanbut, UI asside, I need a way to prevent people from being added as members directly20:48
tvonwon't that have to change anyways?20:48
bskahana slightly related question, should we create a direct relationship between student and a teacher if the teacher teaches the student?20:53
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tvonmhm... maybe, unless it's reliable to go from student->class->teacher of class20:54
tvonprobably should20:54
bskahanwe can always trace relationships through sections to find all the students teachers, or the other way20:54
* bskahan agrees20:54
tvonsections are like individual classes, right?20:55
bskahansection = "the algabra class that meets at 11am"20:55
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tvoncourse == "Earth Science" and section == ... yeah20:55
tvonthen yeah, I don't think the direct relationship is needed20:56
bskahansections are defined by (teacher, time, course) iirc20:56
bskahanyou don't think the direct relationship is needed?20:56
bskahanI guess finding the student's teachers is less common than finding the students sections20:57
tvonif each section is going to have members with student and teacher relationships, then I think a direct relationship is redundant20:57
bskahanI think that't the way it goes then20:57
tvondamn, see Joe Hildebrand's thing on AOL and jabber?20:59
tvonerm.. not as exciting as I thought.. nm21:00
mgedminth1a, when do you arrive to oxford?21:23
bskahanmgedmin: is there any way to constrain membership in a group?21:30
mgedminyou can write an event subscriber that raises exceptions21:32
bskahanI hadn't thought of that21:33
mgedminsee enforceMembershipConstraints in
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bskahanthat would be cool for DayView22:07
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