IRC log of #schooltool for Wednesday, 2013-10-02

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th1ahi menesis, replaceafill, yvl.15:30
replaceafillgood afternoon15:31
yvlgood morning / afternoon15:32
th1aFirst off, we got a small journal bug regarding the end of the month?15:33
th1aDid you see that yvl?15:34
yvldid not look into it yet15:34
yvlwill do15:34
th1aOK, I'll assign that to you yvl.15:36
th1aThe relationship status work seems good so far.15:36
th1aAny questions about the next steps?15:37
yvlwell, there are things to do for at least several days15:38
yvlI think it would be good to go through all of schooltool15:38
yvland ask a question "if a student is in section, but pending/withdrawn, should he be here?"15:39
yvlpretty sure I'll miss many places like that15:39
th1aOK.  Showing them by default would probably be better than silently hiding them.15:40
th1aFor the places you miss.15:40
th1aWe'll need checkboxes some places.15:40
yvland what of other places?15:40
th1aCheckboxes in the gradebooks, that is.15:40
yvlare there places where showing data from withdrawn students would be wrong?15:40
th1aIt is very much a business logic issue.15:41
th1aSo maybe we'll need a lot of checkboxes.15:41
th1aBecause some people will require them on reports, some won't want to see them.15:41
yvlor maybe there are some sensible solutions15:41
th1aFor example, this was an issue in Jennifer's evaluation last year.15:42
th1aThey now have to do these things where they set specific goals for their students and have to pre and post test them for the teacher's evaluation.15:42
th1aAnd Jennifer's results were a bit short, until she learned that she could exempt anyone with a certain number of absences.15:43
th1aIt isn't exactly the same, but similar.15:43
th1aAnyhow, there is no standard way of doing it.15:43
th1aFor reports.15:43
th1aBut basically for just the section index, etc., you want to label them.15:44
yvlthere are also permissions15:44
yvlneed revisiting15:44
th1aFor the gradebooks and reports you'll have to be able to select.15:44
yvlsince we now have "persons who have access today" "had access earlier" "will have access some day"15:44
th1aLike the CanDo reports will be a little tricky.  We should have replaceafill do those.15:45
th1aYes, yvl.15:45
th1aNow... is that stuff done now by active year?15:45
th1aOr date?15:45
yvlby active date15:45
th1aOr just kind of fudged?!?15:45
th1aWhich year is set as active.15:46
th1aOr the actual date?15:46
yvlto be clear, it works like this:15:46
yvlthere's a flag "active"15:46
yvlthat currently works like adding or removing person before15:47
yvlthere are dates, "state applicable since X"15:47
yvland that is that15:48
yvlyou can query (in code)15:48
yvlwhat was/will be the state on date15:48
yvldid X have state Y at some point15:48
yvlIMHO this should be enough15:49
yvlmaybe add "states in date range"15:49
th1aThis is how it works in your new branch currently?15:50
yvlfor permissions, it now works very simply15:50
yvlare you an active student of this section NOW?15:50
th1aYes, that's correct.15:50
yvlfor reports and other things... well.15:50
yvlI sense a bunch of new features coming up :)15:51
th1aI guess you *might* want a special state for people who once were in a section or who have a preliminary enrollment, but that's a low priority I'd say.15:51
yvlwe can add that as we have actual use cases15:52
yvlas in views or reports that need this15:52
yvlsince if it's only some specific view or report15:52
yvlyou can just, well, query15:52
yvllike... we query15:53
th1aIt doesn't strike me as a big deal.15:53
th1aIt is certainly not a standard feature.15:53
yvlcando things for reports15:53
yvl"display all competent or above"15:53
yvljust to be extra clear :)15:55
yvlI'd really like to keep active flag mimicking current schooltool behaviour15:55
yvlpersons who are not active today, are excluded from reports, gradebooks, security and so on15:56
yvland then fix those views15:56
th1aYes, that should be fine.15:57
yvlas opposed to "persons who are active/pending/withdrawn or anything else" are included by default15:57
th1aIt also depends on how we want this to interact with year statuses.15:57
yvlmakes my life easier ;)15:57
th1aBecause that's going to be another layer.15:57
yvlplease explain a bit15:58
th1aIn case you haven't been thinking about that yet.15:58
th1aSo the active year machinery is going to need to do more.15:58
th1aAlthough maybe it doesn't really need to be as complicated.15:58
th1aEssentially we need setup > active > archived workflow for years.15:59
th1aAnd hm...15:59
th1aWe just have to consider if we want to do some kind of mass change to, say, section statuses when we do that.16:00
th1aI guess we probably don't.16:00
th1aOne way to look at it is that when you archive the year, everyone is flipped to an inactive status in all the sections.16:00
th1aOTOH, that's a massive irreversible change with one click, so probably not.16:01
th1aBut the two do interact.16:01
yvlmaybe we could start by adding a simple flag to a year16:02
yvlthat means "this year does not count as is for experimentation"16:02
th1aIt isn't as complicated I guess since you don't need to, say, track the dates of the changes of states.16:03
yvland keep the "active year" thing16:03
th1aThe year statuses may just be a couple flags and a lot of permissions fiddling.16:03
yvllooks like it16:04
yvlif student is enrolled in Math 2012 fall,16:04
yvland now is 201416:04
yvlhe should be still an active member of Math 2012 fall16:05
yvljust the records locked16:05
yvlmaybe his state can be switched to active / completed course16:05
yvlbut that's another matter16:05
th1aWell... I'd say in a perfect world his status would be "completed" or something like that.16:05
th1aYes, it is not what I want to bite off atm.16:06
th1aBut it is clearly useful.16:06
yvlfunny thing16:06
th1aIf you want a transcript, for example!16:06
yvlusers can do that now :)16:06
yvl(in my branch)16:06
yvljust Edit Memberships, create a completed state...16:06
th1aWe should consider a hardwired "Completed" or "Passed" state.16:07
th1aSuccessfully Completed.16:07
th1aSomething like that.16:07
th1aIt would probably be worth throwing that in because then we can rely on it being there for a lot of future business logic.16:08
yvlhmm, ok16:08
yvlgood point16:08
yvlvery good point16:08
yvlalso, there may be more than one success state I guess16:08
yvlSuccessfully Completed With Honors16:09
yvlto reflect in transcripts and whatnot16:09
th1aYeah, but we don't need to over-do it.16:09
th1aRight now.16:09
yvlit's one of those situations16:09
yvl"we need a completed state"16:09
yvland my question16:10
yvlis will we ever need more than one?16:10
yvlor we can safely say: we will never ever need more than one.16:10
th1aIt is certainly plausible, yes.16:10
yvlthat's what I needed to know, thanks :)16:11
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th1aok thanks yvl.16:12
th1areplaceafill has a backlog of client work now...16:12
th1aSomeday these people may pay us...16:13
replaceafillok, th1a, i guess we're going to look at those views together?16:14
th1aWhat about the student detail report?16:15
replaceafilloh, that's done16:15
replaceafilland merged16:15
th1aOK, send me a copy of a report so I can see it.16:16
replaceafilli used the same table format of the absences by day report16:16
replaceafillhold on, let me generate one16:16
replaceafillth1a, sent16:19
replaceafilli added a lot of columns to the grid btw16:19
replaceafillto see how the widths and splitting reacted16:19
replaceafilldoesn't look too bad imho16:20
th1aWe should just tone down the header a bit.16:20
replaceafillah ok16:21
th1aI forwarded a copy to yvl.16:21
th1aThe gradebook grid looks pretty good now yvl.16:21
replaceafilloh, sorry i didn't cc yvl16:21
th1aDo you want to talk abou this a bit after the meeting?16:22
th1aAnd start on the Autism?16:22
replaceafillgetting autism to work will take a little16:22
replaceafilli need to get the right branches with the right revisions16:23
replaceafillbut yes, we can start after the meeting16:23
replaceafillbtw, i was able to reproduce this:16:24
replaceafillnot sure if it's the right way to reproduce though16:24
replaceafillit happens when you add grid items and you delete the term16:24
replaceafilland you visit the layout view again16:24
replaceafillsince the view tries to get the term to show the title in the grid items16:24
replaceafillso i was thinking, in that case the view should show, TERM MISSING or something?16:25
replaceafillthe term is used like this:16:25
replaceafillS1 - Report Sheet A - A [pencil]16:26
replaceafillterm title - report sheet title - activity title16:26
replaceafillsince you can't delete deployed sheets (and activities) the other two are safe16:26
th1aUsed for what?16:27
replaceafillin the grid columns table16:28
th1aI looked in the book.  ;-)16:28
th1aIf the term is deleted, just delete the column?16:29
replaceafillwith an event subscriber?16:29
th1aWell, I guess?16:30
th1aI mean, there's a hackier way to do it, of course.16:30
replaceafilland the view for deleting terms has a huge warning anyway ;)16:30
th1aif term not found, just delete this column16:30
replaceafilli'd use the subscriber16:31
th1aHopefully it doesn't take a day and a half to code.16:31
th1aAnything else, replaceafill?16:31
replaceafill1.25 day :P16:31
replaceafillhold on16:31
replaceafilllet me get my notes16:31
replaceafilli reviewed some bugs16:32
replaceafilli wanted to ask menesis how to mark them correctly16:32
replaceafillthat's done16:32
replaceafilli guess i'll just change the status for now to fix committed16:32
replaceafilland about this:16:33
replaceafillthe sort order part is done16:33
replaceafillbut the clean up for the table header is not16:33
replaceafilli suggested using the same layout we use for cando16:34
replaceafillbut the gradebook has comments16:34
replaceafilland i'm not sure how should we handle that16:34
th1aIf you send me a screenshot I'll let you know.16:34
th1aIs menesis here?16:34
replaceafillah ok16:34
menesisth1a: yes16:35
replaceafillmenesis, is marking the bugs as fix committed good enough?16:35
replaceafillor should i set milestones on them?16:35
* replaceafill doesn't understand milestones very well :(16:36
menesisthis was fixed long ago?16:36
replaceafillno, recently16:36
menesisok, so set to Fix Committed16:36
replaceafillbut we coded a new report16:36
replaceafillit's not like there's a specific revision with the fix16:36
replaceafilland the last thing on my notes: tests16:37
menesisI will fill in milestones when I see an email that status was changed16:37
replaceafillmenesis, ah ok16:37
menesisor when I write release notes16:37
replaceafillth1a, i guess it's not the time for fixing tests yet, right?16:38
replaceafillautism is first16:38
* replaceafill done16:39
menesiswhat tests, replaceafill ?16:39
th1aThanks replaceafill.16:39
replaceafillmenesis, gradebook's16:39
replaceafilli get 18 failures, ftests and stests16:39
replaceafillselenium extension for scoring is broken in some cases by autocomplete for example16:40
menesisI have been fixing stests broken by name column changes16:40
replaceafilland the extension to print the worksheet needs to be updated, to include first name, last name columns16:41
menesisI have done that16:42
menesisfixed the selenium extension16:42
menesiswell, in progress16:42
replaceafillah ok16:42
th1areplaceafill:  You're also going to have to check on the NIEPA instance at some point here.16:43
replaceafillah ok16:44
th1aI can never tell whether David Ally is serious.16:44
th1aOK go ahead menesis.16:45
menesisI have renamed to Default Manager16:46
menesisfixed tests/ftests16:46
menesisalso ran selenium tests and saw that some were broken16:48
menesisby name/column order changes16:48
menesiswas fixing them today16:48
menesisalso reviewed what has been done for this release, updated CHANGES16:49
menesisboth still in progress16:50
menesishaven't looked at translations yet16:51
th1aI guess the question is do you want to "offically" release this on Monday.16:51
th1aI hate the end of week releases.16:51
menesisI usually target releases for Thursday16:52
menesisnext Thursday is the final freeze16:52
th1aOK, so Thursday should be comfortable for you?16:53
menesisbut yes the issues that were raised on Monday were all resolved yesterday16:53
menesisThursday is tomorrow16:54
menesisand I will be working on the release16:55
th1aMaybe push it to the PPA on Monday.16:55
menesisand universe16:56
th1aI just was thinking getting it in universe is the only thing were earlier is better, and no real production users are conceivably going to have problems.16:57
menesisso you want me to push 2.6.0 on Monday?16:57
th1aSo saucy universe > thursday; PPA's Monday.16:57
th1aOr is that crazy for some reason?16:57
menesisthat's reasonable16:57
th1aOK, cool.16:58
th1ayvl are you going to look at the journal bug tomorrow?16:59
th1aI don't know if it might be practical to slip that in.16:59
menesisyes any bugfixes are welcome17:00
th1aHopefully that's easy.  I wonder if it is a timezone thing.17:01
menesisbut I am not waiting for anything now17:01
th1aOK, anything else menesis?17:01
yvlth1a, yes, sure17:02
yvlearly morning tomorrow17:02
menesisshould I simply rename to 2.6?17:02
th1athanks yvl.17:02
th1aOh, yes, I need to check in my revisions.17:03
th1aI was thinking this needs to just be a separate version of the book.17:03
th1aThat is, we'll probably need to keep both on the web, with the new one as the default.17:04
menesisyes, probably17:04
th1aI was confused about where to push it at
menesisthere is only one branch, trunk17:05
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th1aYeah... can I make another?17:06
menesisof course17:06
menesisbut trunk is the current book17:07
th1aI ended up spending too long this morning trying to get a new key set up on Launchpad because I forgot to bring my old one.17:07
th1aAnyhow, I don't know if I don't have permission or they changed the ui or what but I don't see how to push a new branch to LP.17:08
menesisbzr push -r 307 lp:~schooltool-owners/schooltool-book/2.417:09
menesisto create a branch for the older version of the book17:10
menesisand push your new work to trunk17:10
menesisyou simply push a branch and it appears on launchpad17:11
th1aOK, why don't you create the new branch then and I'll push to trunk.17:11
menesisok I'll take care of that17:12
menesisyou found where to add the ssh key?17:13
th1aYeah.  My problem was the encrypted confirmation email in GMail.17:13
th1aI've just copy/pasted it into a text file and should be able to finish it with regular gpg command line.17:14
menesishmm. to push you only need a ssh key17:15
th1aOK, I'll get it sorted.17:15
th1aThat's my problem.17:15
menesisI only plan to add 2.6.0 changelogs to the book17:16
menesisso that will be easy to merge17:16
menesisand that's after I've done the releases, on Friday17:17
menesisOK so we agreed on everything17:17
menesislet's do it17:18
sumithello all, I am looking for some documentation/guidance in installing schooltool in a centos 6 server.  Can anyone help on this ?17:18
th1ahi sumit.17:18
th1aOK, thanks guys.17:19
th1aHave a good week/end.17:19
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.17:19
th1aHi sumit.17:19
sumithi thla17:19
th1aWe had .rpm packages for a while thanks to a third-party contributor, but they are now very out of date.17:19
th1aWhy do you need to use centos, sumit?17:20
sumitI am trying to use it with schoolserver xs version 0.7, which is based on fc 15 and centos 617:23
th1aAh, right.17:24
th1aWho is Jeff working with on XS server?17:25
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th1aAh, now we lost sumit.17:27
th1aWell, if he comes back we'll have to figure out who he is.17:27
th1aOK, "Period Number" can just be "Period"17:29
th1aOr maybe it can go away?17:29
th1aOr move into the same line as the periods?17:29
th1aJust making that row go away is probably sufficient.17:30
replaceafillok, let me try doing that17:30
* replaceafill is concurrently setting up the autism instance ;)17:30
replaceafillth1a, reload17:33
th1aWe need some space under "Attendance Detail" and it probably doesn't need to be that bold.17:34
replaceafillthat's using the same header for the report card comments17:35
replaceafilla sec, setting some comments17:35
replaceafilladding more space under attendance detail17:38
th1aWe probably don't need bold in the comments either.17:39
replaceafillreload them all :)17:41
th1aI think that's fine.17:44
th1aDo you like it better now?17:44
replaceafillthat gray was too much17:44
replaceafill(in the header)17:44
th1aOK, cool.17:45
replaceafillok, autism?17:48
replaceafillinstance is running17:48
replaceafilllet me get steven's user17:49
th1aOK so at this point we have the score(social skills) option?17:51
th1aAnd then some reports?17:52
th1athat's their custom code?17:52
replaceafillyes, basically17:52
th1aThey don't have a gradebook view though.17:52
replaceafillgradebook view?17:53
th1aIt is just the per-student scoring view.17:54
th1aOK, so we need to get that working with multiple score systems.17:55
th1aAnd give it a new name.17:55
replaceafillbut this is the part i don't understand17:56
replaceafillthis score student view17:56
replaceafillknows about 1:1, S, N and G17:56
replaceafillthe columns you grade17:56
replaceafilland it works because of the way we've set up the skills17:57
th1aWhat am I supposed to be looking at?17:57
th1aRight... but what are those things?17:58
replaceafilland the rows are skillsets17:58
th1aSo... just generically you have each row a skillset, and each column a skill.17:58
th1aThe problem is we have to label each cell, right?17:59
th1aI was thinking of trying to do that in gray when the cell is empty.18:00
th1aJust put the skill label in the cell in gray.18:00
replaceafillhold on th1a i'm catching up with the parts here18:01
replaceafillthe grouping is done by node18:01
replaceafillwe get all the nodes that contain the same skillsets assigned to the section18:04
replaceafilli understand the row = skillset, column = skill18:04
replaceafillbut i don't understand the grouping part18:04
th1aOh... you mean how can we assume it?18:05
th1aWhat are the nodes now?18:06
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replaceafill_sorry th1a i was disconnected18:07
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th1aWhat are the nodes now?18:07
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replaceafillthey are 9 groups they grade18:08
replaceafillfor each course18:08
th1aYeah but internally?18:08
replaceafillassociated with the group layer18:09
th1aMaybe another approach.18:10
replaceafillin my head, the skills layout is too specific for autism18:11
th1aLet me think about it.18:11
th1aWell, it might have to be specifically configured by the admin.18:11
th1aYou still just have to try to upgrade it, right?18:11
replaceafillfirst thing imho is18:12
replaceafillthe bug about grading every term independently18:12
replaceafillthat's supposed to be fixed by evolution18:12
replaceafillcopying the skills to each section, etc18:12
replaceafilli can start with that18:12
replaceafillSummary Form on the left of the grading view is the only report we have18:13
th1aMaybe we can just do a more general version of the report.18:14
th1aEsp. since there is the opportunity to have some controls there.18:15
th1aSet which nodes are used to group, etc.18:15
replaceafillok, when do you want us to meet again?18:16
replaceafilli need to go to class18:16
replaceafilltomorrow, meeting time? later today?18:16
th1aTomorrow meeting time is good.18:17
replaceafillkk, that will give me time to update18:17
replaceafillsee you tomorrow th1a18:17
th1aThanks replaceafill.18:17
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