IRC log of #schooltool for Wednesday, 2012-12-12

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th1ahi menesis, aelkner, yvl, replaceafill.16:31
yvlgood morning guys16:31
replaceafillgood morning/afternoon16:31
th1aI have a meeting this morning with a friend who runs a digital portfolio service.16:32
th1aI'm going to try to help him with a technical issue that I may pass on to you guys.  ;-)16:32
th1aHe's going to explain how one structures a service contract with a school district.16:32
th1aIt is a trade.16:33
th1aI sent your invoices in last night.16:33
th1aOK, aelkner?16:33
aelknerok, i went over the bugs at the top of y queue16:34
aelkneri added a person, but no schoolyear to recreate16:34
aelknerit didn't crash to visit the intervention link for the student with no year16:35
aelknerso i'm going to mark that one as fix committe16:35
aelkneri guess i never got around to doing that when i fixed it16:36
th1aYou already fixed it?16:36
aelknerthe first one, yes16:36
aelknerok, the second one16:36
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aelkneri think jelkner got confused by the ui for intervention inbox16:37
aelkneri added an intervention and it appeared in the inbox of the advisor as expected16:38
aelknerif you click on the goal or message, you see it no problem16:38
th1aCan the advisor add them?16:38
th1aIsn't that the bug?16:39
aelkneri guess jelkner didn't see the breadcrumb that one sees above for the student's intervention center16:39
th1aSo it is a usability bug then?16:39
aelknerbecause if he had asked his advisor-only collegue to click it, he would have seen the student center16:39
aelknerso yes, it just may be16:40
th1aYes, if "click on the breadcrumb" is the only answer, that's a bug.16:40
th1aIs there a done button that takes you to the intervention center?16:40
aelknerwell, considering that the user got to the message or goal from the inbox16:41
aelknerDone should take you back to the inbox16:41
aelknerperhaps we could screenshare after the meeting to look at the usability together?16:42
th1aOK, why don't we screenshare this later, yes.16:42
th1aWe just may want to add a link.16:42
aelknerok, next,
aelknerlet's look at that screen together when we screenshare to double-check what you want made optional16:43
aelknerok, this one:
aelkneri added the hint to the interface for persons_responsible, and it shows up in the form16:44
aelknerso that one i committed the fix16:44
aelknerwe already agreed that i would add subject to IMessage16:44
aelknerbut i want to discuss the logic in sendmail and how it currently forms the subject16:45
aelknerbecause you may want part of the logic to apply even when the user supplies the subject16:45
aelknerok, anyway, that's it for the intervention bugs16:46
th1aA prefix, essentially, to the title?16:46
aelknerwell, i'll show you after16:47
aelkneranyway, i saw you started to discuss with replaceafill the case sensitive core entry16:47
th1aAnything else?16:47
aelknershall we talk about that now?16:48
aelknerand what we want to do with a+ and pass16:48
aelkneri was thinking that we should let the user enter pass, but the ui should change it to Pass16:48
yvlumm, th1a, could I be excused a bit earlier today?16:48
aelknersame with a+ of b, change them to A+ of B16:49
th1aI'd like to be excused earlier too.  ;-)16:49
th1aHowever, let's discuss this quickly.16:49
th1aWe have case sensitive discrete score systems.16:49
th1aWe really should want them to be insensitive, at least when you're entering them in a gradebook.16:50
th1aThere would seem to be a variety of strategies.16:50
th1aaelkner, do you have a proposal?16:51
aelkneri thought i just suggested it, accept pass but convert to Pass16:52
th1aOh, sorry.16:52
aelknerdoes that make sense, replaceafill?16:52
replaceafillaelkner, in user created score systems i'm fine with that16:52
replaceafillusing lower() or something to compare16:53
aelknerbut otherwise?16:53
replaceafilli think my main concern is the journal approach, which we probably won't modify anyway16:53
th1aWe may need some protections in the score system creation process to make sure you don't try to use "A" and "a"16:53
aelknerth1a, yes, the check for duplicates need to compare lower() not just straight compare16:54
aelknerreplaceafill, but in the journal, the same applies16:54
aelknerok, maybe not16:54
replaceafillaelkner, not really16:54
aelknerthere is no scoresystem there16:54
replaceafilljournal scores are fixed16:54
replaceafilland they're translatable16:55
aelknerbut do we accept a and t as well as A and T16:55
replaceafillwe do, but only one is valid16:55
aelknerbut not convert them to either case?16:55
replaceafilllowercase i think16:55
aelknersounds right16:55
aelknershould we accept A and convert to a16:55
replaceafilli think so16:55
th1aa and t in the journal is probably a separate case anyhow.16:56
aelknerit's definitely separate in that there is no discrete scoresystem the user know about16:56
aelknerbut we can have the behaviour be consistent with pass/fail16:56
aelkneroh, and there is a legend, or at least there was on, i don't rememebr16:57
aelknerone that shows a, t, 0-9, i believe16:57
replaceafillthere is16:57
replaceafillunder Help16:57
aelknerso anyway, we could accept A and convert to a, agreed?16:57
replaceafilli think there's a bug already for that16:57
* replaceafill looks16:57
th1aYou don't need to mess with it aelkner.16:58
aelknerthat's it for me, we can discuss more when we screenshare16:58
th1aThanks aelkner.16:59
replaceafilli made good progress now on iep16:59
replaceafilli think i'll be done today with it16:59
th1aThank God.17:00
replaceafilli just have the va section report and the completion report to make iep aware17:00
replaceafillthe completion report has no stest at all17:00
replaceafillso i need to write one17:00
replaceafilli have a quick question for yvl17:00
th1a(not that you've been slow, we've just had so many distractions)17:00
replaceafillyvl, for storing the iep for the student17:01
replaceafillth1a, both ;)17:01
replaceafillyvl, i mean, the iep skills17:01
replaceafilli'm using a similar approach to last version17:01
replaceafillyou recommended using section_int_id17:01
replaceafillto get into the section17:01
yvlI may have...17:01
replaceafillthen i store worksheet + skill id17:01
replaceafillto get to the skill17:01
replaceafillthat works fine17:02
replaceafilli just wonder17:02
replaceafillwhy can't i just store a single skill_int_id?17:02
replaceafilland get to the skill directly17:02
replaceafilland if i need the worksheet do, skill.__parent__17:02
replaceafilland so on17:02
replaceafillsince these are section skills17:03
yvlwell, you can17:03
replaceafillit's the first approach cleaner? do you think?17:03
yvlif you clean up the customized skills when they are removed from section17:03
yvland make sure there's no funny business with skill object being recreated in section17:04
yvlor removed and then added17:04
replaceafillgot it17:04
replaceafillwell, i'd need to test that17:04
replaceafillbut i'll keep the current approach :)17:04
replaceafilli was just wondering ;)17:05
replaceafillthanks yvl17:05
replaceafillth1a, last question17:05
yvlcurrent approach will likely be less hassle17:05
replaceafilli noticed we have some "XXX Report description XXX" in virginia17:05
replaceafillyvl, true17:05
replaceafillth1a, i think you told me to ask dwelsh for descriptions for the virginia reports, correct?17:06
th1aTheyre not mine.17:06
* replaceafill done17:06
th1aI'd suggest something like "An ill-designed piece of shit."17:07
replaceafillah come on!17:07
th1aThanks replaceafill.17:07
th1aUnreadable forest of numbers?17:07
th1aThat's more polite.17:07
th1aOK, yvl?17:08
yvlI'll keep short17:08
th1aYou can skip any unnecessary pronouns.17:08
yvldid font resizing when gradebook does not fit, split to separate tables with "Continued ..." if font resizing does not help17:08
yvlhad to refactor a bit17:09
yvlnow finishing style customizations17:09
th1aDoes it look like a plausible strategy?17:09
yvlit looks plausible...17:09
yvlstyle customizations also add fun features17:10
yvllike "join these three cells as one"17:10
th1aOK.  You'll have to send some examples.17:10
yvlI'll attach it to some gradebook first17:11
yvlis there something specific you'd prefer me to work on after?17:11
* yvl has a pile of stuff to work on, so not like my queue is empty or anything17:12
th1aWell... can you do a complete example of a printout of a gradebook worksheet?17:12
th1aBasically, some finished applications of what you've been working on.17:13
yvlyes, that's exactly what I planned to do17:13
th1aDo you want to do a "print this table" thing?17:13
yvldo you have any tables in mind?17:13
yvlmaybe something basic?17:13
yvljust resources and see how it looks?17:14
th1aWell... yes.  In theory it could be generic, right?17:14
yvlin theory17:14
th1aAnyhow, sure, try resources.17:14
yvlin reality you still have to attach it everywhere17:14
yvl(attaching is easier than "implementing")17:15
yvlallright then, I'll have stuff to do for now17:15
th1aOK.  Basically I'd just like some examples of this stuff you've been working on that replaceafill and I can start tweaking.17:16
yvla reminder - I'll need a week or so before sprint to work on celery at least17:16
yvlah, I think we're on the same page then17:16
replaceafillyvl, will you land it in trunk when you're done? or should i check out your branch?17:17
th1aYeah.  Well, it looks like replaceafill is ready to shift onto this, more or less, so we can have some overlap at the beginning of the week.17:17
yvlreplaceafill - was not planning to, probably my branch for now17:18
yvlI can merge it to trunk if it's "dev" now17:18
th1aYes, we need a "dev"17:18
th1aThanks yvl.17:18
th1aThat's a good transistion for menesis...17:18
menesismerge what? reports?17:19
th1aThis is all 13.04 stuff at this point.17:20
menesisyeah, go ahead17:20
yvlwill land in trunk then17:21
th1aaelkner, that's your green light too.17:21
aelkneri had given up on merging to trunk :)17:21
aelknerbut seriously, if you'd like me to merge my stuff to trunk going forward17:22
aelknerinstead of making merge requests as i had planned, i can do that17:22
menesisit's the same in the end, no?17:23
menesiseither you ask for review or not17:24
aelknerreview?  we don't need no sticking review!17:24
aelknerwhat was that movie?17:25
th1aStinking badges?17:25
th1aAnyhow, continue menesis.17:25
menesiswe can fix later17:25
menesisthere are a handful of outstanding merges17:26
menesisso something will break inevitably17:26
menesisI only have one request17:27
menesisplease don't "sync with trunk" your branch before merge17:28
menesisgo to trunk and merge your branch into it17:28
aelknerah, ok, will do17:29
menesisif there are conflicts you'll have to solve the same ones17:30
aelknerand i'll have to run the tests in the merge sandbox17:31
aelknerbut that's ok17:31
menesissame work, different branch17:31
menesisbut this leaves the feature branch open for additional fixes17:31
aelkneri won't bother doing wider net testing in my own sandbox, an even trade17:32
menesisand easier to mix and match branches when merging later17:32
aelkneryeah, sounds like a plan17:32
menesisof course you may need something from trunk or another branch, feel free to merge then17:33
menesisbut pick what earliest revision you need17:33
menesisI was merging some branches, too17:34
menesisthe celery work is quite old by now17:34
menesisthere were conflicts only in the importer, though17:34
th1aYes, it is definitely time to pull it all together.17:34
th1aBefore we all go off for the holidays.17:35
menesisI have been resolving them before meeting17:36
menesisbut not finished yet17:36
yvlprobably I should have done that17:36
yvlwell, conflicts should not be too bad there17:37
menesisit's ok17:37
menesisso I just started looking at changes in celery branch today17:38
menesisbefore that, merged some cleanup and forward-compatibility fixes17:39
menesisnothing else interesting to report17:39
th1aOK.  Cool.17:40
th1aI need to run to this meeting.17:40
th1aThanks guys!17:40
yvlthanks guys17:40
th1aHave a great week/end.17:40
yvlsee you Mon :)17:40
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.17:40
replaceafillthanks everybody17:40
th1aaelkner: 2:00?17:44
aelknerth1a, ok, 2:00 it is17:46
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th1areplaceafill: ayt?20:16
replaceafillth1a, yes20:16
th1aMy friend seems to be running into the same kind of SSL proxy timeout as APS was.20:17
replaceafillrunning ST?20:17
th1aI suggested he try to debug it by using the network timeline tool on a browser.20:18
th1aNo, his application.20:18
th1aThe portfolio thing.20:18
replaceafillgot it20:18
th1aWe also discussed what he charges schools.20:18
replaceafilli was never able to understand Matt's explanation of the issue in ACC20:19
th1aI think there is a timeout in the span of the actual response.20:20
th1aOnce you start the reply, if you have too long of a gap in the middle, it can timeout, based on some obscure setting in the proxy.20:21
replaceafill"n chrome and recent versions of firefox, many requests can be  made per page. This leads to an issue where in even moderately high traffic the number of requests per page is higher then the number of threads a single process can spawn."20:21
replaceafill"However this issue comes to light when a school network has a very short timeout for connections on port 443"20:22
replaceafillbasically you need to encrypt only stuff you want to20:24
replaceafillnot images, css, js20:24
th1aThat probably helps.20:24
replaceafillor at least come in ssl from *another* server20:26
th1aI'm not sure if once the "secure data flow" is established if it is especially sensitive to delays.20:27
th1aBecause we've had some forms which were slow, but still worked.20:27
th1aiirc, the problem is once you start loading the page, THEN there is a shorter timeout somehow.20:27
th1aaelkner:  I'm having a late lunch, catch you in a few minutes.20:58
* replaceafill goes to get lunch21:00
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th1aI'm here aelkner.21:12
aelknerok, ready when you are21:13
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