IRC log of #schooltool for Wednesday, 2011-03-23

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th1areplaceafill:  Ah... I see.  I guess the first time I tried to export a test case I hadn't actually selected one, or something.19:22
th1aBecause it came out blank.19:23
th1aNow this makes more sense.19:23
replaceafillyou selected python output?19:24
th1aYes.  I think I hadn't actually clicked on a specific case the first time.19:24
th1aOr something.19:24
replaceafillso, you're converting the old selenium tests for the book to python code?19:25
th1aNow that I can export them, yes.19:25
th1aI think I'm just going to cut and paste into a bunch of functions.19:26
replaceafilli went to the "document driven development" talk in pycon and ask the guy about my dream of merging ftests and user docs19:27
replaceafillhe told me "keep them separated" :(19:27
replaceafillme: "but how do i keep them sync'ed"19:28
replaceafillhim: "make the commitment..."19:28
th1aProbably correct.19:28
replaceafillme: ¬¬19:28
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fsufitchaelkner: ping!20:50
aelknerhey fsufitch!20:51
aelknersince you and david are physically together, why don't we start with a status check20:52
aelknerdoes he have anything he wants to point out20:53
aelkneroh, and tell him i'm available to sprint, but the when should be the start of your summer, right?20:53
aelknerwhen's that?20:54
fsufitchi talked to him already, he would like us to use today to figure out what progress i can make before the sprint20:54
fsufitch3rd weekend of may, iirc20:54
fsufitchlet me check for sure20:55
fsufitchthe weekend of the 27th of may20:55
fsufitchwait no20:56
fsufitchas per dave's email20:56
fsufitchyeah, that's it20:57
aelknerso starting may 20, you will be 40 hrs/week?20:58
fsufitchbrb, moving location so losing internet20:59
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fsufitch1aelkner: back21:02
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fsufitch1aelkner: can you read this?21:04
fsufitch1connectivity problems...21:04
aelkneri can see that :)21:05
fsufitch1great :)21:05
fsufitch1okay so... we were talking about sprint and summer work times21:05
aelkneryeah, so i can agree to come down may 2021:06
aelknerand until then there is stuff that we can do to get you started21:06
aelknerit's important that we set you up with a branch of your own that you push to21:06
aelkneri'll be able to monitor your progress by looking at your commits21:07
aelkneralso, it will generally be productive for you to send me an email when you make a commit21:07
aelknerunless it's just a trivial change, of course21:08
aelknerbut if you send me an email saying, 'i commited changes to do X'21:08
aelkneri can look and give you feedback in a timely way21:08
aelknerto avoid that you go down any wrong paths and all21:08
fsufitch1sounds good21:08
aelknerso you have the code in a sandbox, right?21:09
fsufitch1yes i do21:09
aelkneryou ran make and make run and everything works?21:09
aelkneri know it doesn't do anything yet21:09
aelknerbut it's important to get the development environment set up21:09
fsufitch1oh i had already made some changes since last time i started working21:09
fsufitch1but yes the dev environment works21:10
aelknerwhat kind of changes?21:10
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fsufitch1i started writing schooltool.courseinfo.browser21:10
fsufitch1i... forget how extensive they were21:10
fsufitch1hang on21:10
aelknerok, so i want to make sure we remember to keep commits as small as possible21:11
aelknerso if working on the browser means many steps21:11
aelknerand it does21:11
aelknerthen do the simplest steps first and get them commited21:11
fsufitch1heh, this is already too many steps i have in this diff :)21:11
fsufitch1i think im just going to save the diff and revert21:12
fsufitch1just so i dont lose my work, but so i can start from a clean slate21:12
aelknerok, good idea21:12
aelkneryou can always extract code from the diff later21:12
aelknerok, another thing21:13
aelkneri have a good example for you to follow for overall package design21:13
aelkneri've been cleaning up schooltool.intervention in a big way lately21:14
aelknerand it has many similarities to schooltool.courseinfo21:14
aelknerit has it's own content that hangs off of application root in its own folder21:14
aelknerand i've broken out the code into separate files and zcml to make it simpler to follow21:15
fsufitch1do you have a branch for me to look at?21:15
aelkneryou will be able to do the same with yours21:15
aelknerso create a new samdbox to keep it separate21:15
aelknerand bzr branch lp:~aelkner/schooltool.intervention/test_coverage schooltool.intervention21:16
aelknercd schooltool.intervention21:16
aelknermake run21:16
aelknerget that going while we discuss other things21:16
fsufitch1fsufitch@callisto:~$ bzr branch lp:~aelkner/schooltool.intervention/test_coverage schooltool.intervention21:17
fsufitch1bzr: ERROR: Invalid http response for Bad status line received21:17
aelknercould be a connectivity problem, i don't know21:17
aelknercould you try again?21:18
fsufitch1keeps happening21:18
fsufitch1might be the restrictive network of arlington public schools21:18
aelknercould you try bzr branch lp:schooltool.intervention (which is trunk)21:19
fsufitch1im checking it out to my webserver, then i'll pull it from there into my computer21:19
fsufitch1no, it's just lp:* that doesn't work21:20
fsufitch1i'm going to get it via my webserver via bzr+ssh21:20
aelknerbut it works on your webserver?21:20
fsufitch1it's the stupid network here :-/21:20
aelkneri'll say it's stupid :)21:20
aelknerbut schools have many needs to block content, so...21:21
aelknerare you within earshot of jelkner?21:22
fsufitch1launchpad's bazaar branches are clearly a risk to the school system21:22
fsufitch1no, i am not21:22
aelknerbecause you could ask him to try the same command and see if he can't help you21:23
aelknermaybe he can push some buttons with people who administer the network21:23
fsufitch1one sec, i think i got this working21:23
aelknerwhat did you do?21:23
fsufitch1via my webserver :)21:24
fsufitch1no, for some reason it's not tunneling stuff that my terminals do21:24
aelknerideally, you want an envoronment where you have the code locally21:25
fsufitch1i got it locally21:25
fsufitch1there is a copy of the branch residing in /home/fsufitch/schooltool.intervention on my webserver21:25
fsufitch1which i can access directly via my VPN21:25
fsufitch1via SSH21:25
aelknerok, sounds good21:26
aelknerso you've branched it?21:26
aelknerare you running make, make run21:26
fsufitch1it's still fetching the files21:26
aelknerok, another thing21:26
fsufitch1ok, make is running21:26
aelknerin the meantime, what dd you branch to get schooltool.courseinfo21:27
aelknerbzr info21:27
fsufitch1  parent branch:
aelknerok, great, so i see you already have a branch that you pushed commits to21:31
aelknerboth are for make and build issues21:31
fsufitch1i made sure to commit whatever i did to make it work :)21:31
aelknerone thing, you replaced a line that now says Niepa21:31
aelkneryou should change that back to courseifo21:32
aelknerbut otherwise, yes, good work21:32
aelkneralways commit things that make things work :)21:32
aelkneryeah, i remember you needed to change to the updated environment21:33
fsufitch1oh actually that says Niepa because i copied a different setup.py21:33
aelkneryeah, i know21:33
aelkneri can't believe it's almost a year since my sprint with Dave's brother21:33
aelknerand my last commit21:33
fsufitch1time passes quickly21:34
aelknertoo quickly21:34
aelknerso there's two levels that you should operate on21:35
aelknerthe unit level and the functional level21:35
fsufitch1you have much of the unit level already21:35
aelknerso far, that is all we really did21:36
aelkneri think it wouldn't be a bad idea to revisit it21:36
fsufitch1i have looked at it, and it looks fine21:36
aelknerand looking at my new schooltool.intervetnion branch, you can see the separation the code has21:36
aelknerit can help you get started with a better app design paradigm then i knew to do originally21:37
fsufitch1what i had started working on last time was an adapter to adapt ICourseInfoSchoolYear to ISchoolYear21:37
aelknerfor instance21:37
aelknerthe configure.zaml includes other zcml files that split out the concepts a bit21:37
aelknerintervention.zcml corresponds to intervention.py21:38
aelknerthat's where all the content objects are defined21:38
aelkneri split out the adapters into and adapters.zcml21:38
aelknerthose, as you know, are important conceptually21:38
fsufitch1i see21:38
fsufitch1those sound like good ideas21:39
aelknerthe adapters allow you to go easily from one object to another using IThisInterface(that_object)21:39
aelknerand you can see various types of adapters there21:39
aelknerlike the AppInit one that creates the root folder21:39
aelknerthe adapter that takes you from app to the root folder21:40
aelkneryou'll have CourseInfoSchooYear objects21:40
aelkneryou should adapt from IShoolYear to them21:40
fsufitch1shouldnt there be two adapters, for adapting to and from ISchoolYear to ICourseInfoSchoolYear?21:42
aelkneryes, good idea21:43
aelknerstart with small commits21:43
aelkneri'd make the change to create
aelknermoving everything that already exists there21:44
aelkneralso create courseinfo.zcml and move context registration there21:44
aelknerconfigure.zcml should get a lot smaller then21:44
aelknerthat would be a small enough commit21:44
aelknerit won't mix reorg with adding new features21:44
fsufitch1anyway, so, before i get started actually editing code, we should get to the today's objective of sorts21:45
fsufitch1it being, jeff and dave want to know how much could get done before the sprint21:45
aelknerit depends on how much time you have21:46
fsufitch1i have this 2-7 time on wednesdays, and maybe a bit of time on weekends21:47
aelknerright, so at most 10 hrs/week21:47
aelknerso four weeks is like what a month will bring in the summer, but a little less21:48
fsufitch1you mean what a week will bring in the summer21:49
fsufitch1this feels a bit futile...21:49
aelkneri just realized that21:49
aelknerwhat's futile?21:49
fsufitch1doing a week's worth of work in 4-5 weeks21:51
fsufitch1but hey, if it helps the sprint get started more easily, im all for it21:51
aelknerdefinitely helps21:51
aelknergetting you up and running with the environment21:51
aelknermaking small commits21:51
aelknerit will definitely help us start faster at the sprint21:52
aelkneralso, i'm going to have you start organizing the package after schooltool.intervention21:52
aelknerdoin so over the next two onths will get you reading a lot of code21:52
fsufitch1that sounds good :)21:52
aelknerand modeling the package to accept the code that you will write21:52
aelkneryou need to get used to how we write nit tests in more ways than just README.txt21:53
aelkneri tend to think of README.txt as the place where the most basic things are sown21:54
aelknercontext objects and some adapters can be proven there21:54
fsufitch1um, sidenote, 'make' failed on schooltool.intervention because of some problem when easy_install was installing mechanize21:54
aelknerreplaceafill just sent a note to the developer's list about that21:54
aelknerbtw, are you on the developer's list?21:55
fsufitch1let me check21:55
fsufitch1i should be21:55
aelkneri don't think you are, but i definitely think you should be21:56
fsufitch1i'm part of schooltoolers21:56
fsufitch1is there another group i should be part of?21:57
replaceafillfsufitch1, add:21:57
replaceafillallow-hosts =21:57
replaceafill    *.python.org21:57
replaceafill    *.schooltool.org21:57
replaceafillto your [buildout] section in buildout.cfg21:57
aelknerreplaceafill, is that something that we are going to have to do for all packages?21:57
replaceafillaelkner, yest to all of them!21:58
replaceafillaelkner, kidding...21:58
aelknerbut fsufitch1 is having a problem building my branch21:58
aelknerand your'e suggesting that he change buildout.cfg?21:58
aelknerthat would suggest that all our branches would need such a change, no?21:58
replaceafillonly if he wants to build his instance21:59
replaceafillaelkner, nope21:59
replaceafillaelkner, it's a problem with the sourceforge servers21:59
aelknerso it's temporary?21:59
fsufitch1yeah, it was getting some weird Content-Length21:59
replaceafill+ setuptools21:59
replaceafillthe day one of the two gets fixed, we're good :)21:59
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fsufitchaelkner: alright, 'make' worked, running 'make run' now22:01
fsufitchaelkner: so i think an appropriate goal for my work until the sprint would be to restructure the code already in place, and to add basic web interface for adding/editing CourseInfo objects22:02
fsufitchas in to make the frontend work on top of the backend that's there22:02
aelknerall sounds good22:03
aelkneryou need to write up some small steps before you do studd22:04
aelknerrather than just diving in and coding22:04
aelknerin order to have small commits, you need a plan22:04
fsufitchwell first it's the code restructuring22:05
fsufitchthen some adapters?22:05
aelknereven the restucturing can be broken up22:05
aelknerif you move code and create zcml file, that's a small commit22:05
aelknerif you create a tests directory and ove tests to it, that's one22:06
fsufitchi see, so small commits for each zcml22:06
aelknerif you create ftests directory in the browser package and move tests to it, that's another one22:06
aelknerjust try to keep concepts in separate commits22:06
fsufitchi dont think there are ftests yet22:06
aelknerno browser/README.txt?22:07
fsufitchoh yeah there is22:07
aelknerremember to follow my branch as a guide22:07
fsufitchthere already is a browser/tests/ though, even though the README.txt isn't in it22:07
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aelknerbut you get the idea with the small tasks/commits22:08
fsufitchalso i should avoid breaking the branch with commits, right?22:08
aelknersmall commits usually are safe commits22:08
aelkneronce in a while, very rarely, i break someting with a commit22:09
aelknerfor instance22:09
aelknerwhen i refactored some attributes recently in my branch22:09
aelkneri changed the unit level and made sure bin/test -u worked22:09
aelknerand committed it even though bin/test -f still failed22:10
aelknerit was a large enough set of changes that i felt it was better to break up the commit22:10
aelknerbut you won't need to do that very often22:10
aelknerbecause you will be careful to make small changes to the model at a time22:11
aelknerusually, you will be adding comething to the model that isn't used in browser yet22:11
aelknerso you won't have that problem of breaking functional tests with model changes22:11
aelkneryou'll see, it will work out fine22:11
aelknerso i'd say continue the reorg, getting to know the intervention branch for conepts22:12
aelknerif you're curious about something in the intervention branch, put a pdb trace in it22:13
fsufitchokay :)22:13
aelkneralso, you can add manager.serve() to functional tests to play around with the UI22:13
fsufitchoh right, there's that option22:13
aelkneri use manger for the browser instance in this case, of course, that varies22:14
fsufitchim on the Schooltool Dev list now22:14
fsufitchalright, so i've got longterm and shortterm plans, and the intervention code for inspiration22:14
fsufitchanything else needing doing?22:15
aelkneri think that should do it22:15
fsufitchi'm itching to go get myself some food, i'm a bit ravenous :)22:15
aelknerconsidering we only have you for 10 hrs, that should hold you until next week at this time22:15
aelknerremember to email me once in a while when you push code22:15
aelkneryou don't have to after every commit, but form time to time22:16
aelknerjust to keep me in the loop22:16
fsufitchsorry for sort of dropping out last time22:16
aelkneri'm not sure what you mean, last time22:17
fsufitchlast time i started getting to work on schooltool.courseinfo22:17
fsufitchi got carried away by pybookbuilder22:17
aelknerthat was my brother's fault, wasn't it? :)22:17
fsufitcha bit :-P22:18
fsufitchalso web2py is more exciting than Zope22:18
aelkneryeah, well22:18
aelkneri can't argue with that, but the hard stuff is what pays :)22:18
fsufitchtrue 'nuff22:19
fsufitchanyway, i really need to go get food22:19
aelknergo for it22:19
fsufitchi'll be back in a bit22:19
aelkneri think our work is done for today22:19
aelkneryou have lots to look at/reorg22:19
Lumierehi fsufitch22:29
Lumierehow goes?22:29
fsufitchLumiere: ohai23:09
fsufitchwas out getting food23:09
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replaceafillaelkner, zyt?23:27
aelknerreplaceafill, yes23:38
replaceafillhey aelkner, quick question23:38
replaceafillhow difficult would it be to use the custom fields work you did on "random" objects23:39
replaceafilllike a school year for example23:39
replaceafillas far as i understand, they work on person groups and resource types, correct?23:39
aelknerso far, yes23:40
aelknerexpanding custom fields for all objects is on my table23:40
replaceafilli could use it now :P23:41
aelknerit depends on when th1a wants me to do it23:41
replaceafillok, i'll discuss it with yvl first23:41
aelknerperhaps he will push it up hig on the list23:41
replaceafilljust wanted to know how difficult it would be23:41
aelkneri would have to discuss it with yvl myself to determine that23:42
aelknerbut i don't think it is too big a project23:43
aelknerjust depends on how yvl would want me to design it23:43

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