IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2010-09-13

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aelkneryvl: ayt?10:09
yvlgood evening, aelkner10:10
aelkneri was wondering10:10
aelkneri'm about to push a branch of changes to schooltool.gradebook10:11
aelknerwould you be able to give them a quick review in the next half hour?10:11
aelknerit has three changes in it, two of which are linked to bug reports10:12
aelkneri was hoping that we could get them into the next release10:13
aelkneri didn't change anything without having tests10:13
aelknerbtw, do you see the CHANGES.txt changes10:13
aelkneri was sure to be good about doing that :)10:14
yvljust gimme a sec10:18
yvlI'm still missing some software after reinstall10:19
yvllike bzr visualize10:19
aelknerdo you need to 'visualize' my changes? :)10:19
aelkneri thought you could just imagine them10:20
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yvlby the way, I still don't get the reason behind maxPassingScore change10:27
yvli.e. I don't get how some schools work :)10:27
aelkneryou'll need to ask tom about that tomorrow morning10:28
aelkneror later today for you10:28
aelknerbut a school in africa needs it10:28
aelkneryvl, i just pushed a small addition to the last visited section tests that makes it better, more thorough10:31
yvlok, I'll bzr up10:31
aelknerbtw, to explain about the failure report10:32
aelknerswe want to retain the user's option to change what the cutoff grade for failure is10:32
aelknerthey can change from the score system's understanding of that value in the report request form10:33
aelknerso the failure report needs the additional logic of checking failures10:33
aelknerrather than add a parameter to the isPassingScore method, like (..., cutoff = None)10:34
yvlI was going to ask about thaqt :)10:34
aelknerfor practical purposes, i decided not to complicate the interface10:35
aelknerand implementation of the score system just for a rarely used feature on one report10:35
aelknerdoes that make sense?10:36
yvlthey wanted a feature "I want to be able to override settings of ss in certain reports"10:37
yvlif we have more reports like that, then sure, it makes sense to build it into scoresystem10:37
yvlor maybe create some other scoresystem, that inherits the score values, but let's us override certain settings10:38
yvlbut that would be overkill now :)10:38
aelknerthe old 'two instances is a case for generalization' rule, eh? :)10:38
yvlyep ;)10:40
yvlwell, thanks for the work10:41
yvland the tests, and changelog!10:41
yvlI'll merge them today10:41
aelkneri'm trying to make it easier for you guys10:41
aelknerthanks for getting the changes in!10:42
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th1aHi yvl, replaceafill, aelkner.16:30
yvlhey th1a16:30
yvl(menesis will be joining us shortly)16:31
aelknermorning/afternoon all16:31
th1athanks yvl.16:31
replaceafillgood morning16:31
th1aSo, one more week until our feature freeze, right?16:32
yvlpreferably, yes :)16:33
yvlMaverick final release is scheduled for Oct 1016:33
th1aI filed a bunch of bugs last week, mostly small things that could be fixed pretty quickly.16:33
th1aLet's see what aelkner and replaceafill have on their lists -- perhaps we might have everyone fixing small pre-release bugs this week.16:34
th1aGet some polish in.16:34
th1aSo we'll start with aelkner.16:34
* th1a will not distract matters by mentioning Donovan McNabb.16:35
aelknerbgo, you mentioned him16:35
aelknerso i found yvl on irc last night16:36
aelknerand he was nice enough to review my gradeook branch and merge it today16:36
aelknerit includes the folowing:16:36
aelknerthe CSV view we did for SLA16:36
aelknerthe last visited section bug fix and better tests16:36
aelknerthe min/max score system changes, including score system views16:37
aelknerfailure report request changes and failure report calculation changes16:38
aelknerall with tests16:38
aelknerso my plate is free for small bug fixes this week16:39
replaceafilli finished the gradebook work for cambodia16:40
replaceafilli just got a reply from keng piseth16:40
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replaceafilli made an error trying some things16:40
replaceafillwill fix it and send him a reply16:40
replaceafillth1a, can you remind me of this one:
replaceafillalso, yvl about this one:
th1aOh, maybe I was talking to someone else about that...16:41
replaceafilli noticed some unit tests output translates the error messages16:42
yvlId like to see 635212 back in... Buildings/locations as resources seems like a desirable feature :)16:42
th1aaelkner, were we talking about specifying the building as an attirbute of a room?16:42
replaceafillth1a, probably, i honestly don't remember about that one16:43
th1aNow that I think about it, I remember talking about that on the phone, so it probably wasn't you.  ;-)16:43
aelknersounds familiar to me16:43
yvlso, what about the i18n registration?16:44
replaceafillyvl, the zcml works for the functional testing layers, correct?16:44
replaceafillfor the unit test i need to set setUp,tearDown functions?16:45
yvlsome doctests run on the functional layers though16:45
yvl(and they're in unit test folders IIRC for that extra confusion ;) )16:46
replaceafill!!!16:46 for example16:46
replaceafillunittests show the compiled translation problem16:46
yvlFWIW, I consider this wider problem than few-line-fix16:47
yvlfrom functional test perspective - we don't have a way to register i18n correctly16:48
yvl(if we want to include common.zcml)16:48
yvlfrom unit test perspective - there are no helpers for that16:48
th1areplaceafill, did I just assign that to you?16:48
replaceafillth1a, yes16:48
yvlgive it back to me :)16:48
th1aMaybe we should give it to yvl.16:48
replaceafillah ok16:48
yvlI'd like to fix that in Natty16:49
th1aIt sounded like a small one to me.16:49
yvlI made it sound that way :/16:49
replaceafillth1a, we can discuss cando's long term memory leak later, correct?16:50
yvland anyway - this is not visible to the end-users, so - I vote for procrastination16:50
th1areplaceafill:  Yes.16:50
th1aSo replaceafill, Cambodia is your first priority this week.16:51
th1aDo you know what caused that error adding a year?16:51
replaceafillah ok, i'll try to have the gradebook story finished16:51
replaceafillyes, i made a typo on a date(...) call16:51
replaceafilldate(*alist[:4]) instead of date(*alist[:3])16:52
th1aI guess we have fewer tests on the Cambodia skin.16:52
replaceafillth1a, i worked on that this week too, trying to have more16:52
replaceafilli'd like to learn to use coverage reports16:53
replaceafillyvl, also, cambodia was updated to use trunk's version.cfg16:53
replaceafillsince the old version gave me conflicts16:53
yvl(make coverage-reports-html)16:53
yvlwell done16:54
replaceafilldamn! we have that?!?!16:54
yvl( :D )16:54
replaceafilli'll definitely look at it!16:54
replaceafillth1a, that's it i guess16:54
yvl(umm, coverage has outdated Makefile rules everywhere except ST core, I think)16:55
th1aOK, so we won't pile bugs onto replaceafill.16:55
th1aHow does your queue in LP look, aelkner?16:56
th1aI think I added some for you.16:56
aelknerthere is the inconsistent rounding bug at the top of my queue16:56
aelknerblueing buttons in the intervention system16:57
yvl( replaceafill, coverage for checkouts might be a bit broken right now.  as in - not working :) )16:57
aelknerdifferent css with report sheets16:58
aelkneralso, any schooltool bugs you'd like to throw my way16:58
th1aIs 541498 still a bug?17:00
aelkneryes, jelkner added a lot of wish list type bugs17:01
th1ayvl:  Did I give you the bug about adding students from previous linked sections?17:01
yvlthank you!17:01
th1aPerhaps you should give that to aelkner.17:02
aelkneryvl, what did you think of my and th1a's comments on the landscape issue?17:02
th1aaelkner:  Can you send me the URL you're using to view your bugs?17:02
aelknerth1a, i private chatted it to you17:03
yvlsorry, aelkner, haven't read them :|17:03
yvlsomehow missed some mails during few last days17:04
yvl(or on 2009-09-09, to be precise)17:04
jelknerth1a, not just students, but times, and teachers17:05
* Lumiere looks around ('morning everyone)17:06
th1aHi Lumiere, jelkner.17:06
jelknerwhen a real section that spans 4 ST "sections" is created17:06
yvlmorning guys :)17:06
jelknergood morning!17:06
yvlaelkner, have you tried playing with report margins?17:06
jelknerand let's take a moment to celebrate Donavan McNab17:07
yvlsee schooltool/app/browser/report.py17:07
yvlReportPDFView base class17:07
* replaceafill wonders what happend to McNab17:07
aelknerreplaceafill, boo17:07
th1ayvl:  We'll explain it after the meeting.17:07
jelkneranyway, when a "section" is created17:07
jelknerit should copy teacher and timetable data across all 4 quarters by default17:07
th1aYes, we could do that too.17:08
jelknerand students should be copied at the end of each quarter17:08
th1aNot so much at the end of the quarter as the beginning of the next one.17:09
th1aBut we're not good at that kind of automatic, particularly if you want it now.17:09
th1aBut we could do the timetable + teacher right at the beginning now, I think.17:10
yvlat the beginning of what?17:11
jelkneryes, the beginning of the next17:11
th1aWhen the linked sections are being created.17:12
jelknerthat's the right way to do it17:12
yvldo you mean "when the section is linked" or "when multiple sections are created" ?17:12
jelknerlater (i'm trying to take this step by step ;-)17:12
jelkneri'll ask for graying out of withdrawn students in a given quarter17:13
jelkner(but not now!)17:13
th1ayvl:  Well, what I need to do is look at exactly what the interface looks like when we create linked sections.17:13
th1aBut I mean when multiple linked sections are created through the web.17:14
yvljelkner is really good at pointing out obvious flaws in ST, thanks!17:14
yvlyeah.  That's a tough one.17:15
th1aWhy is it tough?17:15
yvl- sections are separate from the code's point of view (and the UI!)17:16
yvl- sections are created in a batch with *only* description and course info available at the time17:16
yvl- section timetables are bound to the sections17:16
yvlwe *really* need to straighten that out.17:17
yvlfrom the teacher's perspective - it's the same section17:17
yvland the teacher is right :)17:17
th1aYes, in general, we need to hide that implementation detail.17:17
th1aBut also, from the teacher's point of view, they're just using the gradebook, the journal, their calendar and interventions,17:18
th1aand it is already relatively well hidden there.17:18
th1aThe administrator is the one who sees the ugly.17:18
yvlas usual, all the crap is put under the administrator's carpet :)17:18
th1aSo basically, we need to add a checkbox to the schedule view that says "apply this timetable to all linked sections."17:19
th1aWith a more comprehensible phrasing.17:19
yvlthe thing is17:19
yvlit shouldn't matter to which sections17:19
yvltimetables live in a time span of a school year17:19
yvlsections live in a time span of a term17:20
yvlwe should discuss that a bit later17:20
th1aWell, we don't have much else to talk about -- can we fix this this week?17:21
yvlwhat I wanted to say - is that user's shouldn't care that timetables are bound to *that specific* section17:21
th1aI don't understand.17:21
* menesis :X17:22
yvlfrom the user's perspective - it's a same section17:22
* yvl waves hands rigorously17:22
th1aBut the whole point is that someone might WANT to have different schedules in different terms.17:23
yvlso you apply the timetable to a period of time in a section17:23
yvlwell, timetable start/end times should be sane17:23
yvllike, the term17:23
yvlof the section you are looking at now17:23
yvlI'd like to postpone the timetables/section thing until later on...17:24
yvlalong with other sections work17:24
th1aI see what you mean.  ;-)17:24
yvland do at least the student import part of it17:25
th1aI don't want to re-do the implementation of multi-term sections.17:25
th1aWe just need to smooth it out in the interface.17:25
th1aWe need lots more convenience for the user -- like jelkner is asking for.17:25
yvlno, we won't change the multi-term sections17:25
th1aAlso, I suppose this is affected by the changes to timetabling in general.17:26
yvlyes, that :)17:26
th1aBut it does seem to me that a checkbox that lets you schedule all linked sections at the same time might not take long.17:26
yvlgood point17:27
yvlI will add that17:27
th1aSo you want that bug?17:27
yvlyep :)17:27
th1aDo you want to make it or shall I?17:28
yvlI can make it17:29
yvlif you want17:29
aelkneri'm back17:29
th1aI can do it.17:29
yvl(now the bug is more of a placeholder really)17:29
yvlthanks :)17:29
th1amenesis:  Anything to report this week?17:30
* yvl poked menesis17:32
th1aSo, replaceafill -- turn around that Cambodia ASAP so they can try again.17:32
menesisnot much17:32
replaceafillth1a, will do17:32
menesisI have made the schooltool 1.5.1 release17:32
menesisnot yet packaged17:32
menesishave not released gradebook or other plugins yet17:33
th1areplaceafill:  You might also want to make a simple selenium test to catch simple things.17:33
th1amenesis:  You should have a bit of a break now until we make a beta next week.17:33
th1a(I would imagine...)17:34
menesismore work than expected, have to make gradebook compatible with schooltool 1.4, or make two releases17:34
th1aMake it backward compatible?17:34
menesisso the plugins release is scheduled for today/tomorrow17:34
menesisyes, if there are only bugfixes I would prefer to have one release for both maverick and lucid17:35
menesisalso last week, I have uploaded a few last packages to maverick17:37
th1aaelkner:  I'm going to go through your bugs and re-prioritize a bit.17:37
th1aaelkner:  Make sure you do the Maverick beta bugs first, even if they're medium priority.17:37
th1aStart with the rounding one though.17:38
th1aok, thanks menesis.17:38
th1aAll right, I think we're done here.17:38
th1aLet's squash some bugs this week.17:39
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.17:39
aelknergreat week everyone!17:39
th1aHave a great week, gentlemen!17:39
replaceafillthanks everybody17:39
yvlhappy coding :)17:39
yvlabout that PDF rotation17:39
yvlI assumed that if you set the margins to 0, they are 0?17:40
yvland that would give you the desired results?17:40
yvlor am I missing something.17:40
aelknerwhere do you mean to set the margins?17:40
aelkneri don't see the class attribute in ReportPdfView17:41
yvlin the view17:41
aelkneroh, sorry17:41
aelkneri see it now17:41
th1aWhat are these "margins" you speak of?17:41
aelkneryou're saying i should override those to be zero in my view?17:41
* yvl was just rummaging for the "see schooltool/app/browser/"17:41
yvlyes, sure17:42
aelknertrying now...17:42
aelkneri set the margines to zero, and the report comes out with no margin17:44
* yvl confesses that this was a crappy way to implement configuration17:44
aelknerthat isn't exactly what a user would want though17:44
aelknerhow do you mean?17:44
yvldon't mind that, I'm just rambling17:44
aelkneranyway, changing the margins to zero only makes the pdf worse17:45
yvlthen I don't get what you meant by "getting rid of the top margin"17:45
aelkneri'm gong to undo my changes to the margins and mail you a pdf17:46
yvlok, thanks17:46
aelkneremail sent17:49
* replaceafill is checking the coverage reports...17:49
aelknerth1a, i tried calling your home phone17:50
replaceafillyvl, what are the advantages of ftests written as unit tests? speed?17:50
aelknerreplaceafill, the setup for those types of tests are a real pain, would you agree?17:51
yvlok, I see the problem17:52
yvlreplaceafill, a moment :)17:52
replaceafillaelkner, they must have a meaning17:52
yvlyes, they do have a meaning ;)17:53
replaceafilli mean, why did they use them like that17:53
yvlaelkner, how do you want your report to look like?17:53
yvlI mean - how should the table behave?17:53
yvlbe split to the next page?17:53
yvlor... ?17:53
aelkneryvl, just like it does, but without missing Friday and the total column at the ed17:54
yvlto put bluntly, you need a bigger sheet of paper, or a smaller table17:54
aelknerLEGAL is supposed to be 8/12 x 14 inch17:55
yvla bigger sheet of paper isn't the best idea IMHO17:55
yvl(think about printing such things)17:55
aelknerthis report needs to be wide17:55
aelknerit contains 9 period columns per day, five days a week17:56
yvlwell, I was thinking about calculating the estimated width a day takes in the table17:56
yvland then splitting it to several pages17:56
aelkneri don't think that would make the customer too happy17:57
aelknerthey want to be able to see the whole week at a glance17:57
yvlthen you need to resize the table somehow17:57
yvlto fit to a single page17:57
aelkneri don't think they would mind using legal size paper though17:57
aelknerwouldn't it fit as is with legal paper size?17:58
aelknertell you what17:59
aelkneri could play around with a different font size and column widths17:59
yvlok, it seems to be rendered as A4, and this is bad17:59
aelknerto see if i can't get it to fit in standard A417:59
aelknercan that be fixed?17:59
replaceafillaelkner, you just fixed the gradebook to remember the last section viewed, correct?18:00
yvllooking at it...18:01
aelknerreplaceafill, yes, it was never properly tested18:02
replaceafillaelkner, i guess jelkner is refering to the same bug here:
replaceafillaelkner, the new egg will fix it, right?18:02
aelknerreplaceafill, yes, i'll mark that one as fix committed18:03
replaceafillyvl, thanks for changing ...source to ...vocabulary ;)18:08
replaceafilli was having mental conflicts :P18:08
* yvl too18:09
yvland it somewhat conflicted with newer z3c.form, so there you go :)18:09
* th1a returns.18:15
th1aThe sizing of the report we can work out (we probably shouldn't count on people having access to legal size paper though...)18:16
th1aThe immediate problem is getting landscape to work.18:16
yvlit's working as it is supposed to18:16
yvljust the legal size is not set18:17
yvlaelkner, if you want to try it out immediatly:18:17
yvlin src/schooltool/skin/templates/rml_macros.pt18:17
yvl+<document tal:attributes="pagesize view/pageSize">18:17
yvlyou'll need the trunk, not eggs, though18:17
th1aWell, it needs to be A4.18:17
yvlthen we either need smaller fonts18:18
yvlor split the table18:18
yvlor find a "drawable" that resizes it's contents18:18
th1aSmaller fonts is probably fine for now.18:18
yvl(I guess reportlab has one)18:18
yvlthere should be a thing that would allow drawing table on itself18:19
yvlsomething like canvas or picture or something18:19
yvland then just set it's size18:19
yvlreportlab is full of hacks like this18:19
yvl(some of them not working)18:19
aelknerth1a, so it's A4, landscape, i just need smaller fonts18:19
yvlI'd need to experiment...18:19
aelknerremember when i said it worked before by manually changing the print settings in the PDF viewer?18:20
th1aFor the moment I just want this particular report to work for this particular customer.18:20
aelknerwell, 'Fit to prinable are' means that the viewer changes the size of everything18:20
aelknerusing printer math, very complex18:21
aelknerbetter would be for me to use a smaller font size18:21
aelknerand get used to how it looks in the viewer18:21
aelknerthen i can email everyone a copy of the PDF18:22
aelkneryvl, you don't need to do anything new18:22
th1aSo, problem solved?18:22
aelknerthe rotation fix that you got into the egg helps a lot18:22
aelknerso, i'd say sure18:22
aelknerth1a, can i call you?18:23
th1aYou just hung up before I could get to the phone.18:23
yvlok, thanks aelkner  :)18:24
yvlreplaceafill... I'll chat about why we ran unit tests in a functional layer some other day, ok?18:24
replaceafillsure, np18:25
yvlok guys, see you around18:25
yvland happy fixing! ;)18:25
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replaceafillwow, big jump in the z3c.form versions!18:54
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replaceafillth1a, u around?23:04
replaceafillth1a, ah, never mind, i figured out!23:06
th1areplaceafill, how's the Cambodia bug?23:06
replaceafillth1a, fixed23:06
replaceafilli was thinking about teachers and students23:07
replaceafilli know it's a question for them but23:07
replaceafilli mean, students can be easily assigned to a "class" through the form23:07
replaceafillthis put the student in all the appropriate sections23:07
replaceafillbut there's nothing like that for teachers23:08
replaceafillalthough i guess teachers assigment has to be more flexible, right?23:08
th1aWell, it would be nice if the instructor add/edit form let you select all linked sections.23:09
th1aAdd, at least.23:09
th1aThe problem is that form might be standard and changing it at all a pain.23:10
replaceafillwell, it's a pain assign the same teacher to 7 different sections too23:11
replaceafillgoing to each section and using the instructors view23:11
replaceafillbut i'll wait for them to make that call23:12
th1aNo, the call is clear.23:12
th1aThe question is, how hard would it be to just add a checkbox to only the instructor add form?23:12
replaceafilli'm using selenium as you suggested and noticed that im going left and right because of teachers mostly23:12
th1aLeft and right?23:13
th1aIs that a Spanish idiom?23:13
replaceafillwell, we had to "manipulate" the student forms23:13
replaceafilli mean, going everywhere23:13
replaceafilland i see it's so easy for students now23:14
replaceafillbut then use cases come to mind: what if tom teaches 1st grade AND two subjects in 3rd grade23:15
replaceafillwhat if tom only teach 5/7 subjects in 1st grade, etc23:15
th1aSo... could you add a checkbox to instructors.html?23:20
th1aCan you subclass the view?23:20
th1aOr something?23:20
replaceafillyou mean a checkbox for each level?23:21
replaceafill1, 2, 3, 4, ..., 12?23:21
th1aI'm thinking of regular SchoolTool...23:22
th1aPerhaps we've been talking about entirely different subjects all along.23:22
th1aActually, we have.  ;-)23:22
th1aMy fault.23:23
th1aThat's just what I was thinking about before we started chatting.23:23

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