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| ignas_ | th1a: i am looking at the code written by our new friends from germany | 17:48 |
|---|---|---|
| ignas_ | th1a: seems that it's not as shiny as I expected :( | 17:48 |
| aelkner | ignas: ayt? | 18:25 |
| aelkner | ignas_: ayt? | 18:25 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: yes | 18:25 |
| aelkner | i'm having a problem with my edit form for ReportActivities | 18:26 |
| aelkner | it wants to adapt a field to the context, and I can't figure out why or what I should do aboit it | 18:26 |
| aelkner | the same field works on the add form | 18:26 |
| aelkner | could you please take a look at my branch | 18:27 |
| aelkner | i'll give you the url in a sec | 18:27 |
| aelkner | bzr+ssh://schooltool.org/aelkner/schooltool.gradebook/schooltool.gradebook_report_cards/ | 18:27 |
| aelkner | if you put >>>manager.serve() at the end of report_card.txtx | 18:27 |
| aelkner | txt | 18:27 |
| aelkner | you'll be in the right place to reproduce the error by clicking on the only activity in the list | 18:28 |
| aelkner | also, are you around at all this weekend? | 18:28 |
| ignas_ | hmm | 18:29 |
| ignas_ | maybe ;) | 18:29 |
| aelkner | it's not a request | 18:29 |
| aelkner | you need time off, too :) | 18:29 |
| aelkner | i was just wondering | 18:29 |
| aelkner | problem is, I'm about to head down to virginia for the weekend, so I won't be able to discuss this with you | 18:30 |
| aelkner | unless you think you'll still be there say four hours from now | 18:30 |
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| aelkner | i'll have a chance to discuss this with you when I arrive before we start cando meetings | 18:31 |
| ignas_ | four hours since now | 18:32 |
| ignas_ | yeah - i will be online | 18:32 |
| ignas_ | with some breaks | 18:32 |
| ignas_ | got to run to do some shopping in 30 minutes, but that won't take much time | 18:32 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: well duh | 18:34 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: in add form - you are not using the witgets applyData function | 18:35 |
| ignas_ | and that function is the one that tries to do the adaptation | 18:35 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: hmm | 18:36 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: why are you using an extra interface for that field? | 18:36 |
| ignas_ | oh | 18:36 |
| ignas_ | you want to have it a dropdown | 18:36 |
| ignas_ | well - the simplest way to do it is to handle the field manually | 18:37 |
| ignas_ | just like you did it with groups and advisors in person form | 18:37 |
| ignas_ | aelkner: so override the applyChanges function | 18:38 |
| ignas_ | and pop the scoresystem field from data before calling super().applyChanges | 18:38 |
| ignas_ | though - I have a feeling that there should be a better way to do this, i mean - if you want to limit the choices of a scoresystem for reportcards | 18:39 |
| ignas_ | you probably should add the scoresystem field (dropdown one) to the IReportCardActivity interface | 18:39 |
| ignas_ | in interfaces.py | 18:39 |
| ignas_ | this would make the code work, as ReportCardActivity implements IReportCardActivity | 18:40 |
| ignas_ | so yeah - remove the IExistingScoreSystem interface | 18:41 |
| ignas_ | and move the scoresystem field to: | 18:41 |
| ignas_ | IReportActivity | 18:41 |
| aelkner | ignas: thanks, i'll those things out | 18:42 |
| aelkner | cya | 18:42 |
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| th1a | ignas: They sounded like they knew what they were doing. | 18:49 |
| ignas | th1a, they kind of know. Will try and post them a comprehensive review of their code if you don't mind me spending some time doing that. | 19:28 |
| th1a | It is worth spending some time on. | 19:28 |
| th1a | Use your judgement about how much. | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | there was an interesting article about code reviews | 19:29 |
| mgedmin | study data indicates that reviewers don't find any defects after 60-90 minutes of reviewing | 19:29 |
| th1a | The reviewers brains give out? | 19:30 |
| mgedmin | something like that | 19:30 |
| ignas | mgedmin, it's 2k lines of code, but most of it is not needed ;) and the difficult part is explaining them why | 19:30 |
| mgedmin | one of the pdfs here: http://smartbear.com/codecollab-code-review-book.php | 19:30 |
| ignas | and recommending them an alternative course of action | 19:30 |
| th1a | I think you can go longer than that mgedmin. | 19:30 |
| ignas | can - yes, but does he want to ;) | 19:31 |
| ignas | and yes - doing a good code review drains you out... | 19:31 |
| mgedmin | I know that the parts about reviewing up to 200-300 lines of code are true | 19:31 |
| * mgedmin has to go now | 19:32 | |
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| th1a | I was wondering how much Zope 3 experience those guys have. | 19:32 |
| ignas | not much | 19:32 |
| th1a | Well, that's lead to some... suboptimal code then. | 19:33 |
| th1a | Until you get used to it. | 19:33 |
| ignas | they have a knack of making it work ;) | 19:34 |
| ignas | or should it be "for making it work" | 19:34 |
| * th1a imagines ignas reviewing his Zope 2 applications. | 19:35 | |
| th1a | They worked! | 19:35 |
| ignas | th1a, yeah, looked at some Zope2 code being written, very difficult to review, as a lot of things that are plain wrong are the way they are supposed to be | 19:35 |
| ignas | also - functional test startup time of 40+ seconds discourages writing tests at all | 19:36 |
| th1a | I can't really believe people are still using Zope 2. | 19:37 |
| ignas | the layers of api spanning jurasic to XXI century do not help either | 19:37 |
| ignas | Plone is the killer application, even if it hurts | 19:37 |
| th1a | Yes. | 19:37 |
| ignas | drop in a component, do a magic search and replace on some XML and have mailing list integration with your application is kind of nice, as Zope3 does not have any modules of this magnitude... | 19:38 |
| ignas | Zope3 components are small usefull thingies most of the time ;) | 19:38 |
| ignas | not "Wiki" "Mailing list" "File upload manager" kind of things... | 19:39 |
| th1a | I lost my Covops and got podded last night. I'm feeling kind of sad. | 19:40 |
| ignas | well - last 2 weeks cost me an abaddon and a curse | 19:41 |
| th1a | What did the abaddon set you back? | 19:41 |
| ignas | it was 3xrigged | 19:41 |
| ignas | and it was FC's fault anyway ;) | 19:42 |
| ignas | popped 2600m from the gate :( | 19:42 |
| th1a | Eek. Yeah, I can absorb losing the CovOps. That was my first experiment with a solo roam in hostile gerritory. | 19:42 |
| th1a | Doing what? | 19:42 |
| ignas | flying through a bubble | 19:43 |
| ignas | it was a major evacuation | 19:43 |
| ignas | had like whole fleet shooting me, and nearly made it ... | 19:43 |
| ignas | nearly | 19:43 |
| ignas | got podded, because I could not jump through the gate after losing a ship | 19:44 |
| ignas | "session change" stuff | 19:44 |
| th1a | Did you get pulled out of warp that far from the gate? | 19:44 |
| ignas | 15 km | 19:44 |
| th1a | Ah. | 19:44 |
| ignas | full plated + 5 level amarr bs + afterburner | 19:45 |
| ignas | would have definitely made it if not 2x webs on me | 19:45 |
| th1a | Yah. | 19:46 |
| ignas | waiting for corp mates to haul me a sniping zealot now | 19:47 |
| ignas | http://www.foundati0n.com/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=40414 | 19:48 |
| th1a | Took a lot of people to bring you down! | 19:52 |
| ignas | some of it is from a battle in the same system that was there before | 19:55 |
| th1a | Ah. | 19:55 |
| th1a | Still, that's a lot of DPS. | 19:55 |
| ignas | I was primaried twice, but got repped | 19:55 |
| ignas | yeah, 5% res bonus x 5 levels in bs really helps | 19:56 |
| th1a | Yes. | 19:56 |
| ignas | one of the toughest ships really | 19:56 |
| th1a | Have you been on SiSi any more? | 19:56 |
| ignas | yeah | 19:56 |
| ignas | reported like 5 bugs | 19:56 |
| ignas | forgot to report the sixth one while doing the first five ;) | 19:56 |
| th1a | What do you think? | 19:57 |
| ignas | very nice, needs polish ;) | 19:57 |
| ignas | putting all the modules offline when loading a fit from your fit library - *is* annoying | 19:58 |
| ignas | 1 bug - cannot repro, 1 bug - new, 1 bug duplicate, 2 bugs not processed yet ;) | 19:58 |
| th1a | Speaking of bugs, we need to figure out why Phillip's server won't start. | 20:01 |
| ignas | link? | 20:01 |
| ignas | oh, the paster one? | 20:01 |
| th1a | https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/334365 | 20:01 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:01 |
| ignas | ok, asking for more info | 20:05 |
| ignas | though - the problem seems to be with pastescript not schooltool... | 20:06 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:06 |
| th1a | I wonder if he could have accidentally deleted a file. | 20:24 |
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| ignas_ | maybe, no idea really | 20:29 |
| ignas_ | I don't even know which ubuntu release he is running | 20:30 |
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| jstraw | ignas: he updated the bug a couple minutes ago | 20:53 |
| ignas | ok, so this is jaunty | 20:56 |
| ignas | jstraw, do you have access to any jaunty systems by chance? | 20:56 |
| jstraw | nope | 20:57 |
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| replaceafill | ignas, if i do "make ubuntu-environment" in ubuntu, does it automatically ask my root password? | 21:24 |
| ignas | don't know ;) | 21:25 |
| ignas | i think not | 21:25 |
| replaceafill | because debian tells me youre not root | 21:25 |
| ignas | in that case - do sudo make ubuntu-environment | 21:25 |
| replaceafill | ignas, i was reading the cando installation procedure in the book | 21:25 |
| replaceafill | and says that i will need my sudo password | 21:25 |
| replaceafill | but the command is "make ubuntu-environment" | 21:25 |
| replaceafill | maybe it should be changed to "sudo make ubuntu-environment" | 21:26 |
| replaceafill | just a thought | 21:26 |
| ignas | are you using cando or schooltool? | 21:26 |
| ignas | because it might be | 21:26 |
| ignas | that cando has sudo in their makefile | 21:26 |
| ignas | while schooltool does not | 21:26 |
| replaceafill | i was testing cando's installation procedure | 21:26 |
| replaceafill | :O | 21:26 |
| th1a | Should I change it? | 21:26 |
| ignas | file complaints to jstraw ;) | 21:26 |
| replaceafill | let me see | 21:26 |
| replaceafill | ah ok | 21:26 |
| jstraw | what did I screw up? | 21:27 |
| replaceafill | :D | 21:27 |
| ignas | cando installation procedure is telling users to do make ubuntu-environment | 21:27 |
| jstraw | file non-existent bugs to ignas ;) | 21:27 |
| ignas | while it should be sudo make ubuntu-environment | 21:27 |
| jstraw | I'm not perfect | 21:27 |
| ignas | :) | 21:28 |
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| th1a | jelkner: I missed the email about how you're famous in Cambodia. | 21:37 |
| jelkner | me too. | 21:39 |
| jelkner | what's that about? | 21:39 |
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| th1a | "First Contact from CIST-Cambodia" | 21:40 |
| th1a | jelkner: Do you have that email? | 21:42 |
| jelkner | th1a: no | 21:43 |
| jelkner | i just had lunch with dwelsh | 21:43 |
| jelkner | virginia doe has a need for guidance software | 21:43 |
| jelkner | and apparently a big budget for it | 21:44 |
| th1a | I think that should be our NSF grant. | 21:44 |
| th1a | Or... Virginia can pay for it ;-) | 21:44 |
| jelkner | yes! | 21:44 |
| jelkner | it is interesting | 21:44 |
| th1a | My reading of the SGER and ATE grants on the NSF site is we should just write an ATE. | 21:45 |
| jelkner | apparently dwelsh had at least some discussion with them about having it be part of schooltool | 21:45 |
| th1a | Write a preliminary ATE proposal instead of trying to get a planning grant. | 21:45 |
| th1a | I just talked to Welsh on the phone an hour ago. | 21:45 |
| jelkner | the thing they liked about that is that it would make deployment simple | 21:45 |
| jelkner | since everyone would *already* have schooltool | 21:45 |
| th1a | YES. | 21:46 |
| th1a | Funny how that works. | 21:46 |
| jelkner | very cool! | 21:46 |
| jelkner | and now that we have the developers we need for big projects | 21:46 |
| jelkner | the possibilities are real | 21:46 |
| jelkner | th1a: can i call you to talk about the grant process? | 21:47 |
| jelkner | i want to work on that this weekend | 21:47 |
| th1a | I will permit a call. | 21:47 |
| jelkner | and i'd be happy to have some direction | 21:47 |
| jelkner | ok | 21:48 |
| * jelkner heads for his office to make the call... | 21:48 | |
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| jelkner | ok, log in as the teacher | 22:24 |
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| jelkner | View Sections --> "Ancient Observatories" | 22:25 |
| jelkner | --> Enrollment | 22:26 |
| jelkner | r u there? | 22:26 |
| replaceafill | yes | 22:26 |
| replaceafill | our inet connection is slow :) | 22:26 |
| replaceafill | there | 22:26 |
| replaceafill | 385 pages! | 22:27 |
| jelkner | notice how the form gives no indication of which course into which students are being enrolled? | 22:28 |
| replaceafill | yes | 22:28 |
| replaceafill | it should say "Ancient Observatories" somewhere | 22:28 |
| replaceafill | Students of Ancient Observatories at the top maybe? | 22:29 |
| aelkner | replaceafill: this is the first user story: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335592 | 22:30 |
| replaceafill | cool | 22:30 |
| replaceafill | understood | 22:30 |
| jelkner | question: there are two launchpad users | 22:31 |
| jelkner | douglascerna and replaceafill | 22:31 |
| jelkner | which one is you? | 22:31 |
| replaceafill | really!!??! | 22:32 |
| jelkner | yes | 22:32 |
| jelkner | really | 22:32 |
| jelkner | i guess replaceafill is certainly you | 22:32 |
| jelkner | right? | 22:32 |
| replaceafill | yes | 22:32 |
| jelkner | ;-) | 22:32 |
| replaceafill | i wonder if i joined lauchpad in 2006 :\ | 22:33 |
| jelkner | ok, get ready | 22:34 |
| jelkner | your bug list is about to grow fast! | 22:34 |
| replaceafill | :D | 22:34 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335602 | 22:34 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335592 | 22:36 |
| jelkner | aelkner and dwelsh are chatting about each of these as they type them in | 22:36 |
| jelkner | let me know if they are clear to you | 22:36 |
| jelkner | since i can stop them now and get them to explain | 22:36 |
| replaceafill | ...marked as "CORE"... | 22:37 |
| jstraw | replaceafill: welshism <_< | 22:39 |
| jstraw | replaceafill: you can import exactly 1 full course | 22:40 |
| jelkner | "CORE" has some history with it | 22:40 |
| jstraw | those are the only competencies that can be required | 22:40 |
| jelkner | required and optional are different | 22:40 |
| jelkner | both of those count as CORE | 22:40 |
| jstraw | jelkner: when did this change | 22:40 |
| replaceafill | i know one type is displayed green and the other black :) | 22:40 |
| jelkner | this is a feature that justas added last summer | 22:40 |
| jelkner | no, both of those are still core | 22:41 |
| jstraw | I need to look back over the data model again | 22:41 |
| jstraw | jelkner: what would CORE imply | 22:41 |
| jelkner | core means "on the state list for that course" | 22:41 |
| jstraw | core is a poor way to call it | 22:42 |
| jelkner | we want a new mark, "supplemental" | 22:42 |
| aelkner | there's a difference between core vrs non-core (suuplimental) and required vrs optional | 22:42 |
| aelkner | supplemental | 22:42 |
| jelkner | for competencies teachers add themselves | 22:42 |
| jstraw | this is all UI I assume | 22:42 |
| jstraw | we shouldn't need any new data in the backend | 22:43 |
| jstraw | and... before anyone works on it... it needs to be mocked up | 22:43 |
| jstraw | there is a LOT of data currently in the system | 22:43 |
| jstraw | s/the system/those views/ | 22:43 |
| aelkner | jstraw: yes, the discussion is UI | 22:44 |
| replaceafill | jelkner, aelkner, but i dont want to slow down the creation stories procedure with my questions | 22:45 |
| replaceafill | i know i have to understand the stories well | 22:45 |
| aelkner | no prob | 22:45 |
| replaceafill | but maybe i can ask later | 22:45 |
| aelkner | feel free to ask as we go | 22:45 |
| jstraw | aelkner, jelkner: I am hoping to feel well enough to join you tomorrow | 22:45 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, ok thanks | 22:46 |
| jstraw | I'm laid up at home with something | 22:46 |
| jelkner | replaceafill: if you don't understand the bugs | 22:49 |
| jelkner | you won't be able to squash them | 22:50 |
| replaceafill | jelkner, i know :) | 22:50 |
| jelkner | so we need to make sure that is clear | 22:50 |
| jelkner | so to continue with the history | 22:50 |
| jelkner | the va doe (virginia department of education) | 22:50 |
| jelkner | has a list of competencies for each course (some required some optional) | 22:51 |
| jelkner | those are all "core" | 22:51 |
| jelkner | local systems and individual teachers may choose to *add* (not subtract) competencies of their own | 22:51 |
| jelkner | we would like to call them "supplemental" | 22:51 |
| jelkner | but that doesn't happen yet | 22:52 |
| jelkner | though a teacher can remove any competency they themselves added | 22:52 |
| jelkner | (the supplemental one) | 22:52 |
| jelkner | ones | 22:52 |
| replaceafill | i see | 22:52 |
| jelkner | but they can *not* remove the core competencies | 22:52 |
| jelkner | the current ui hides this functionality | 22:53 |
| jelkner | we need to reveal it | 22:54 |
| jelkner | so, is that enough? | 22:54 |
| replaceafill | yes | 22:54 |
| replaceafill | thanks | 22:54 |
| jelkner | cool, two down ;-) | 22:54 |
| replaceafill | :D | 22:54 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/316412 | 22:56 |
| jelkner | replaceafill: any questions on that one? | 23:00 |
| replaceafill | reading | 23:00 |
| replaceafill | if i get a bug assigned does launchpad automatically subscribe me to that bug? | 23:01 |
| replaceafill | because im subscribing to every bug :) | 23:01 |
| jelkner | yes | 23:01 |
| replaceafill | the batch enrollemnt is from an external file? | 23:02 |
| jelkner | once a bug is assigned to you | 23:03 |
| jelkner | you are automatically subscribed to it | 23:03 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335616 | 23:05 |
| replaceafill | jelkner, batch enrollment means import an external file, right? | 23:06 |
| aelkner | replaceafill: yes, and also straight from a tex box in the view | 23:07 |
| replaceafill | aelkner, ah ok | 23:07 |
| aelkner | both are done for importing courses, for instance | 23:07 |
| replaceafill | 335616 understood | 23:07 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335618 | 23:15 |
| replaceafill | understood | 23:16 |
| replaceafill | (i have to seet it but i understand it) :D | 23:17 |
| jelkner | th1a: what is the status of https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/schooltool/+bug/314159 ? | 23:20 |
| ignas | jelkner, you have your own csv import form | 23:26 |
| ignas | jelkner, that handles this for cando | 23:26 |
| jstraw | ignas: they're thinking of something else | 23:27 |
| jstraw | imo we need to ditch both our CSV importer and this batch enrollment thing | 23:27 |
| jstraw | and make a cando version of the xml import | 23:27 |
| ignas | xml import? | 23:27 |
| jstraw | err xls | 23:27 |
| jstraw | that other x importer | 23:28 |
| ignas | :) | 23:28 |
| th1a | Can we import our customizable demographics now? | 23:28 |
| ignas | th1a, yes | 23:29 |
| ignas | not in trun yet | 23:29 |
| ignas | but yes | 23:29 |
| th1a | So that's the answer? | 23:29 |
| aelkner | dwelsh says: we need a user-friendly way to import a whole list of students into a section | 23:30 |
| aelkner | csv import would not be that way, I don't think | 23:30 |
| ignas | yeah, I think cando can just use schooltool basicperson, they will just have to set up the demographics schema and that's all | 23:30 |
| ignas | section student import should probably be a separate task from the full system import/export | 23:31 |
| aelkner | rdw: I agree; section student import should be different; not an admin/manager command | 23:31 |
| jstraw | ignas: the xls covers student section import I thought | 23:33 |
| th1a | I guess it depends on what kind of friendly you're going for. | 23:33 |
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| ignas | jstraw, now that i think of it - yeah, it does | 23:33 |
| th1a | Do you mean, friendly to the list of student ID's I have? | 23:33 |
| th1a | Or friendly to me typing in names? | 23:33 |
| ignas | jstraw, but we probably don't want users having to fill in all the fields that they don't care about | 23:33 |
| jstraw | ignas: we need to reduce the number of importers | 23:34 |
| jstraw | we shouldn't have 5 importers in system for people/courses/sections | 23:34 |
| ignas | yes we should | 23:34 |
| ignas | having users type in term, school year, section id, teachers, courses and then a list of students would be too much | 23:34 |
| ignas | they only want to enter a list of student ids | 23:35 |
| ignas | and that's all they should do | 23:35 |
| ignas | actually - doing it in a web form is probably easiest way to do it | 23:35 |
| ignas | perfect task for some ajax magic | 23:35 |
| replaceafill | ignas, ajax = jquery? | 23:37 |
| replaceafill | i mean, what library does schooltool use? | 23:37 |
| ignas | yeah jquery | 23:37 |
| ignas | though - even that is not needed | 23:38 |
| ignas | i mean - what kinds of student lists to teachers have? | 23:38 |
| ignas | when they do quick entry... | 23:38 |
| ignas | first/last names? usernames? ids? | 23:38 |
| ignas | a list of them in their PC's? a list of them on paper? | 23:38 |
| ignas | if it's first/last names on paper - enhancing our membership forms would be the best way to approach the problem, if it's ids in some file - who gave that file to a teacher anyway? ;) | 23:39 |
| th1a | You don't literally want teachers typing names. | 23:40 |
| th1a | That's actually less friendly than searching. | 23:40 |
| th1a | Also, we do need to add switches to allow teachers to add students and teachers to enroll sections. | 23:40 |
| th1a | That has to be site configurable. | 23:40 |
| ignas | th1a, i always thought teachers can add members to their sections | 23:41 |
| ignas | and what do you mean by "enroll" | 23:41 |
| ignas | create ? join ? | 23:42 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335622 | 23:44 |
| th1a | Well, if they can there should be the option to not allow it. | 23:44 |
| jelkner | replaceafill: here is another one for you to chew on ;-) | 23:44 |
| th1a | Add to the section. | 23:44 |
| jelkner | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/cando/+bug/335631 | 23:45 |
| replaceafill | jelkner, :) | 23:45 |
| th1a | I don't remember the current behaviors right now. | 23:45 |
| jelkner | is this last bug a cando or schooltool bug? | 23:47 |
| jelkner | ignas: can teachers see their students login id and change their passwords? | 23:48 |
| jelkner | in schooltool ? | 23:48 |
| jelkner | because in cando, they can not | 23:48 |
| ignas | jelkner, nope, they can't | 23:48 |
| jelkner | ahh | 23:48 |
| jelkner | so it is a schooltool bug | 23:48 |
| ignas | jelkner, it's not a bug | 23:49 |
| ignas | jelkner, it's a feature | 23:49 |
| aelkner | ignas: it's not the case at sla | 23:49 |
| ignas | we can allow seeing the data, strange it's not that way already | 23:49 |
| jelkner | not if you work with high school students it ain't! | 23:49 |
| ignas | but allowing teachers to reset passwords | 23:49 |
| aelkner | they rely on the ability for teachers to visit student pages | 23:49 |
| aelkner | that way they can call the parents, for instance | 23:50 |
| ignas | yeah, visiting is ok | 23:50 |
| aelkner | but in cando they can't visit | 23:50 |
| ignas | as I said - strange you can't do that in cando/schooltool | 23:50 |
| aelkner | so there must be security in cando | 23:50 |
| ignas | not sure if it's schooltool problem | 23:50 |
| aelkner | visiting is a cando problem | 23:50 |
| ignas | but password reset is a separate issue | 23:50 |
| aelkner | right | 23:50 |
| th1a | I'm very dubious about password reset. | 23:50 |
| dwelsh | hmmm. the one good thing about password reset is that teachers can unstick students | 23:51 |
| th1a | I mean, I understand why you want it. | 23:51 |
| dwelsh | without figuring out their password | 23:51 |
| dwelsh | so that's pretty important for when you are trying to help a student logon | 23:51 |
| jelkner | of course the proper answer solution to this policy question is that it can be set at the school level | 23:52 |
| ignas | that opens a can of worms | 23:52 |
| ignas | if teacher can add anyone to his section | 23:52 |
| jelkner | well, in our case, we want it | 23:52 |
| ignas | and he can set password for anyone in his section | 23:52 |
| ignas | ... | 23:53 |
| dwelsh | teachers are responsible professionals | 23:53 |
| dwelsh | only students need to know their passwordsd | 23:53 |
| dwelsh | a teacher would not reset it without the cooperation of the student | 23:53 |
| th1a | jelkner: We need to think about it a bit. | 23:53 |
| dwelsh | otherwise, password reset is the least of the school's problems:) | 23:53 |
| ignas | teachers are, but giving out keys to all the data in schooltool to 20 people is not too good | 23:54 |
| ignas | dwelsh, students can sometimes get passwords from teacher accounts | 23:54 |
| ignas | dwelsh, believe me - I know | 23:54 |
| dwelsh | right, which is why teachers should not be able to see a student's password | 23:54 |
| ignas | and when every teacher password is equal to admin password | 23:54 |
| dwelsh | they only can reset it. | 23:54 |
| ignas | vector of attack is this - log in as a teacher, add user dwelsh to the section of the teacher, set password for dwelsh to 123, log in as dwelsh | 23:55 |
| ignas | mwahahaha I am the principal of the school and can see everything | 23:55 |
| dwelsh | another job of teacher is to secure their terminals | 23:56 |
| th1a | No... it is bad. | 23:57 |
| jelkner | how does a teacher become a principal? | 23:57 |
| dwelsh | I don't get the problem yet. | 23:57 |
| aelkner | yeah, me netiher | 23:57 |
| ignas | jelkner by adding someone to his section, because well - he can add anyone | 23:57 |
| dwelsh | then they are student, not a teacher | 23:57 |
| ignas | which gives the teacher access to the password of the section member | 23:57 |
| th1a | Our role system is not strict. | 23:58 |
| aelkner | no it doesn't | 23:58 |
| th1a | So we can be hippies. | 23:58 |
| dwelsh | again, teachers will NOT see passwords. they only have ability to reset | 23:58 |
| ignas | what does it mean "RESET" ? | 23:58 |
| aelkner | being able to change a password is not the same as seeing a password | 23:58 |
| ignas | if I can RESET your password to "123" | 23:58 |
| jelkner | reset means create a new one | 23:58 |
| ignas | i can log in as you | 23:58 |
| dwelsh | right | 23:58 |
| jelkner | not see the old one | 23:58 |
| jelkner | like in unix now | 23:58 |
| ignas | so what if i don't know your password, i can still spend quite some time using your account | 23:58 |
| aelkner | yeah, a teacher can log in as the student | 23:58 |
| jstraw | that isn't ok | 23:59 |
| aelkner | that doens't make him a princial | 23:59 |
| ignas | the teacher can make the principal his student | 23:59 |
| th1a | Yes. | 23:59 |
| aelkner | aaaaah | 23:59 |
| dwelsh | that's a system bug. | 23:59 |
| jstraw | no | 23:59 |
| dwelsh | the highest role should prevail | 23:59 |
| jstraw | that's a data model bug | 23:59 |
| th1a | It is a feature! | 23:59 |
| jstraw | that you're introducing | 23:59 |
| ignas | there is no hierarchy of roles | 23:59 |
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