IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2008-09-15

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th1aHi ignas, aelkner, yvl.16:31
th1aAfter the meeting I'm going to send Aiste a proposal to switch yvl to working on SchoolTool and put aelkner on CanDo half time.16:33
th1aI'm not sure if anyone has discussed this with yvl...16:33
th1aBut basically it is to get around the fact that school districts aren't set up to pay contractors outside the US.16:34
yvlDavid talked to me about this a little16:35
th1aAssuming POV ok's the numbers of the proposal, and I don't see why you wouldn't, we'll have to decide (in the near future but not now) when the transition should happen.16:36
th1aSo we should be thinking about a non-disruptive point for that.16:37
th1aThe first thing yvl would be doing for SchoolTool is creating some reports for SLA.16:37
th1aFrom the narrative report system aelkner wrote.  We have copies of their current reports (from Word or something) so gathering specifications shouldn't be a problem.16:38
th1ayvl: Are you in the middle of anything now for CanDo?16:39
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th1ahi jstraw.16:41
yvlI'd like to do 20-40 hours of dev before switching16:41
jstrawhi all16:41
th1aThat's about what I figured.16:41
th1aWhat are you working on, yvl?16:41
* th1a is curious.16:41
aelknerso am i16:42
yvlseveral simple features to do - reports, etc.16:42
aelknercouldn't i take some of those off your hands?16:42
yvlbut the main thing I'd like to do is to fix the remaining broken tests (as the release was made in a hurry)16:42
yvland clean up some of the code so it would be clearer to understand16:43
aelknerthat would help me with the transition16:43
th1aThere is no rush.16:43
aelknerbut could you leave some to the features for me?16:43
yvlstill, I'd like to do the cleanup before switching16:43
th1aI'm sure there will be things to do.16:43
yvlit will be easier to switch without the 'clutter'16:44
yvland I think I spotted at least one gotcha related to competency deletion16:45
yvlit would be good to investigate16:46
yvlit involves competency reference deletion16:46
aelkneri saw the checkin you made16:46
aelknerregarding competency deletion16:47
aelknerthey found a bug?16:47
yvlgood - competencies are now unlinked manually in the code;16:47
yvlthey should get unlinked upon deletion, but it seems that deletion event is not fired if compref is deep in the tree16:48
aelknerwell, at some point, yvl and i shoudl meet to discuss details16:48
aelknerbut i won'16:48
aelknerwon't ask for them now16:48
yvldeal :)16:48
th1aI'll get the proposal to Aiste today.16:49
th1aaelkner: How is your cleanup coming?16:49
aelknerit's done16:49
aelkneri just two things16:49
aelkner1) to discuss merging with ignas16:49
aelkner2) to discuss cando's need to decouple from inheritance16:50
aelknerfor the second one, it's important NOT to create the egg with my changes BEFORE we remove inheritance from cando16:50
aelkneri know exactly what needs to be changed in cando16:50
aelknerso it16:51
aelknerit's all a matter of timing between us16:51
aelknerthat's the deal16:51
ignasi mean - eggs are produced automatically16:52
ignasso we have 2 ways of doing it16:52
ignasok, only 116:52
th1aaelkner: How much work is this on the CanDo side?16:52
ignasbecause cando is using schooltool trunk16:52
aelknerjust a matter of removing code, no tests16:53
aelknerthe code to remove is simply this16:53
aelknerthere are stale references to the inheritance classes16:53
aelknerand tests for provideBys that need removing16:53
aelkneralso the unwrapRequirement can be removed16:53
aelknerin short, it won't take more than a half day to do it carefully16:54
th1aPerhaps you should just do that then so we can put the whole thing behind us.16:54
aelkneri was just going to say :)16:55
aelkneryvl: the refactopring-6 branch is still what they use, right?16:55
yvlthat's one more thing I'd like to do - merge it to *trunk*16:55
aelknerso are you ok with me making those changes there today16:56
aelkneri could wait for that16:56
yvlas trunk is tracked by launchpad, AFAIK16:56
yvlgo ahead!16:56
aelknerwhen?  now?16:56
aelkneri couldn't tell if you wanted me to wait16:57
yvlwhen it is convenient for you16:57
aelkneri'll do it today16:57
yvlok :)16:57
yvlbut keep in mind that tests are broken, so it might give some additional trouble...16:58
aelknerth1a: would it be better for me to wait until tests are fixed?16:58
th1aYour call.16:58
aelkneri would prefer to be able to have working tests before and after16:59
th1aI mean, you could just do this in another branch.16:59
aelknergood point16:59
th1aThat's really the model we're trying to move toward anyhow.16:59
aelkneryou'll be happy to n=know that i got around to reading the bzr users guide17:00
yvltrue, I can backport the changes later17:00
aelknerso i understand the model you're referring to17:00
aelknerbranching from a branch with broken tests yields broken tests17:00
aelknerso ideally, i would wait for the tests to pass17:01
aelkneri could help make them pass17:01
aelknerin other words17:01
th1aI meant branch from trunk.17:01
yvlor you can branch from an older stable version17:01
aelkneroh, well, that would be problematic17:02
yvltrunk is seriously outdated17:02
aelkneryvl: correct me if i'm wrong17:02
yvllatest stable is competency-refactoring-3 if I recall correctly17:02
aelknerthat's closer to -6 then trunk ism right?17:02
aelkneri mean a lot closer17:03
yvlby roughly a year?..17:03
aelknerhere's my point17:03
th1aOK, maybe not "trunk..."17:03
aelkneri don't know how much code has been moved around17:03
aelknerso changing code could be a waste of time17:03
th1aIn that case I guess we should just wait.17:03
aelknercould i help make the tests pass?17:04
th1aDon't go there.17:04
th1aSo, in that case, what's next on your queue, aelkner?17:04
aelkneri was kind of helping you would know :)17:04
aelkneri mean SLA hasn't spoken up17:05
th1aI was thinking I could send Chris and Marcy an email about the gradebook requirements.17:05
th1aI mean, I think they are really simple, so I should be able to write a paragraph and have them say, "yes, that."17:05
th1aAnd then you can do that.17:05
th1aAnd hopefully get things rolling with them now that things should have settled down a bit.17:06
aelknerwhen you think they are ready to meet with me, let me know that it's a good time to contact them17:07
aelkneri don't even want to bother them17:07
th1aWell, they are going to have to soon, but having something else done for them to check will make things go more smoothly.17:08
th1aSo, I'll send that email right after the meeting.17:08
th1aignas: How is the great rearrangement coming?17:09
ignaswell - a bit slowly, had a really slow week17:09
ignasand on top of it - group rearangement is a bit tricky17:09
ignasso i had to kill group calendar overlays17:10
ignassome more REST views17:10
ignasand even when I will get it working, i won17:10
ignaswon't be sure17:10
ignasit is perfectly fluent...17:10
ignasbecause some things are a little bit tricky when you got more than 1 group container...17:11
ignasthough - i mostly got all the current functional tests passing17:11
th1aWe could punt on making groups tied to terms at all.17:11
ignasit's the new tests that have not been written yet that are difficult17:11
ignaswell - not really, because that would add different kinds of problems and would make the switchover difficult17:11
ignasso i am trading off complexity in one part of the system17:11
ignasfor simplicity in another part...17:11
th1aJust checking.17:12
* ignas thought about just dumping the groups in schoolyears idea too17:12
ignasalso - i think i'll investigate the courses import bug17:12
ignasthat  Brian Lockwood has encountered17:13
ignasand see if I can help him out with it17:13
ignas1000 courses is fun though17:14
th1aYes.  I'm a little confused about his status with it.17:14
th1aBut it needs to work.17:14
ignasother than that - as soon as i'll get done with groups i'll tackle "school timetables"17:15
ignasand then add some UI things17:15
ignasnot sure what we should do with testing17:15
ignasbecause I can't really merge to trunk before cando get's settled17:15
ignasthey are using trunk, so suddenly having schooltool.gradebook that only works with school years would mess everything up for them17:16
ignasoh, and i guess i should do the person add form fixes either today or tomorrow to get them released17:17
ignasmaybe with the course import fixes if I'll need any17:17
th1aYes, I guess we will need to coordinate this with CanDo.17:17
ignasso we have to fix gradebook, release gradebook, update cando to use the new gradebook17:18
ignasand only then I can merge all the stuff to schooltool/schooltool.gradebook/schooltool.lyceum.journal trunks17:18
th1aWill we ultimately have to pin CanDo to a pre-school years version for a while?17:19
ignaswell - they have promissed me that they won't do any updating after they deploy it17:19
th1aIs CanDo deployed with .debs?17:21
aelknerit's a buildout, so can't we control which grade book it uses there?17:22
th1aSo as long as it takes a 'bzr up' and not just an 'apt-get update' they should be ok.17:22
ignas"CanDo is deployed with great care. -- yvl"17:22
aelknerwhat i mean to say is17:22
aelknercouldn't we set the version of gradebook to use in the setup.py17:23
ignasas long as they do not run "bin/buildout -n"17:23
ignasit should keep working17:23
aelknerto be a version that doesn't have schoolyears17:23
ignaswell - as soon as we have a version17:23
ignasthat is final and has no school years17:23
ignaswe probably can17:23
ignasi could even make an interim release17:23
ignaslike schooltool.gradebook0.2 and schooltool.gradebook0.317:24
ignasso we could do fixes17:24
ignasjust that schooltool itself would have to get tied down to some version17:24
ignasin there as well17:24
ignasi'll have to think about how to do it17:24
ignasthough - CanDo should not get into these kinds of messes :/17:25
ignasi mean - they could have stayed with 2008.04 and it would have worked fine...17:25
ignasbut no one fixed and related deployment infrastructure in the buildout integration branch17:26
ignasbefore it was too late...17:26
aelknerwhy is it too late?17:26
ignaswell - because it is already deployed and because it would/might take an effort to make cando work with schooltool 2008.0417:27
ignasand because someone would have to update deployed instances17:27
ignasand development sandboxes17:27
ignaswhich is a tricky thing to do17:27
th1aWe've gotten a lot better at having a stable base for CanDo this year.  It isn't perfect, but it is way better than before.17:29
th1aAny last words?17:29
ignasgood luck, have fun ;)17:30
th1aHave a great week!17:30
* th1a drops the bag of gravel.17:30
ignasyvl:                       'schooltool >= 2008.04, < 2008.10',17:33
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th1aaelkner: One thing we'll definitely need is a script to add a worksheet with pre-populated activities to each section.18:04
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aelknerth1a: i read your note.  could you explain why assignments are automatically created?18:34
aelknerand what about worksheets?18:35
th1aFor each section, the teacher needs to assign a quarterly grade.18:35
th1aSo in each section there needs to be a worksheet to do this.18:35
aelkneryou know that worksheets have no time right?18:36
th1aThis is a job that could be done equally well with a piece of paper put in someone's mailbox.18:36
aelkneri think you mean that we'll have one worksheet containing one activity per quarter18:37
th1aDid I say something else?18:37
aelknerwell you didn't say that18:38
aelknernever mind that18:38
aelknerthe only part you ledt out was the worksheet part18:38
aelknerso i didn't understand what you intended18:38
th1aWe've got the A-F score system built in, right?18:41
aelkneri can check18:43
th1aIt might make sense to make this not completely hardwired.18:44
aelknerwe do have AmericanLetterScoreSystem A,B,C,D,F18:44
aelknerbut even if what we have doesn'18:44
aelknerdoesn't fit be can create a custom one no problem18:45
th1aWhat do you think about making a simple web form to generate this?18:45
th1aAllow the user to pick a score system and then automatically create the worksheet with a column for each term.18:45
aelkneri'm not sure18:46
aelknerdo you have a moment for a phone chat?18:46
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jelkneraelkner: ping23:12

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