IRC log of #schooltool for Thursday, 2008-09-11

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dwelshyvl: a question re: delete competencies...14:23
yvllistening :)14:23
dwelshI see the confirmation list of competencies to be deleted...14:24
dwelshdoes the command also remove the list name and group names14:24
dwelshsecond question, just to confirm...14:26
dwelshif I have a list associated with a course and remove it14:26
yvlalso it automatically removes empty program areas, etc.14:26
yvlit gets de-associated14:27
dwelshthe association will go away, without breaking anything?14:27
dwelshok.  I'm going to give the command a shot.14:27
dwelshyvl:  my updated list will not reimport... not enough data on line 014:46
dwelshemailing list to you14:46
yvlok, thanks14:48
yvlhmm, I can import it on my instance14:50
dwelshyes, I now can too.14:50
dwelshlist MUST be imported from root level14:51
dwelshthat's an important point14:51
yvlahm here's the problem14:51
yvlit seems you used "Import competencies" instead of "Import competencies from xml"14:51
yvlthe first one is a CSV importer14:52
yvlI doubt that it is usable anymore...14:52
yvlor necessary14:52
yvlby the way, I did some testing - you can import competency xml not on the root level, but it is a tricky business currently14:53
yvlthe xml content must match the level you are importing in, and it is not obvious14:53
yvlso it would be good to add some safeguards in the future14:53
yvland use only root-level importing for now14:54
dwelshok.  looks good.  reassociated comps, and they appear to work in teacher gradebook14:54
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aelknerhey ignas16:13
aelknerhow's it going?16:13
ignaseh, tasks are piling up time is running out ;)16:13
aelknersounds familiar16:14
aelknerquick question16:14
aelknerhow do i get my gradebook branch registered?16:14
ignason launchpad?16:14
aelkneri have a branch that i created locally off of schooltool.gradebook16:15
aelknerso it's just on my machine16:15
aelknerno,not true16:15
aelkner push branch: bzr+ssh://
aelkner  parent branch:
aelknerso the branch already exists16:16
aelknerat, not bazaar.launchpad.net16:16
aelknerso is there a step that i need to take to get it to show up in launchpad?16:17
ignaswell - you just go to launchpad16:18
ignasgo to ~aelkner branches16:18
ignasand add a branch16:18
ignaswhere you fill in the information needed for launchpad to mirror your branch16:18
ignasis the url you want to put in16:18
ignasto make launchpad able to mirror your branch16:19
aelknerso launchpad mirror's our branches16:19
aelknerit doesn't house the originals?16:20
ignasnope, our branches are on schooltool.org16:20
ignasthough -16:20
ignasif you want to you can store your branch directly on launchpad16:20
ignasI would do that too16:20
ignas but at the moment it just takes too long16:20
ignasbecause launchpad is still implementing shared repositories for projects16:21
aelknerno need16:21
ignasthat would allow bzr push to take only 30-40 seconds instead of 40-45 minutes16:21
aelkneri was just curious16:21
aelknerbefore when you said add a branch, you mean click the 'Register a branch' button?16:22
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aelknerignas: that worked, thanks16:27
aelknerbtw, how long do i have to wait until it mirrors?16:28
ignasdon't know - a few minutes, maybe an hour16:28
aelknerok, cool16:28
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aelknerhey th1a17:50
aelknerstatus on the cleanup17:51
aelknerso i made a careful study of the code17:51
aelknerand I also checked for dependencies in cando17:51
aelknerand schooltool.gradebook itself17:52
aelkneras it is, ther is no code that depends on inherited competencies other than asking if an object is one17:52
aelknerboth in schooltool.gradebook and cando, there are cases17:52
aelknerwhere a studpid always false question is asked17:53
aelknerso i can safely get rid of those, but17:53
th1aa stupid always false question?17:53
aelkneri would need cando to have removed references to that class before i remove it from the gradebook17:53
aelknerif IInheritedRequirement.providedBy(obj)17:54
aelkneris aloways false becuase we dont' use inherited comps17:54
aelknerbtu the question and its import is a dependency nonetheless17:54
aelknerso we need to time up the change to cando17:55
th1aWhich class needs to be removed?17:55
aelknerto happen before the schooltool.gradebook egg that cando uses is updated17:55
th1aThe interface?17:55
aelknerthe implementation classes17:56
aelkneri will be getting rid of them17:56
aelknerwithout causing any problem to cando17:56
th1aignas: Do you have any thoughts about how to do the transition here?17:57
aelkneranyway, the good news is that i can get rid of inheritance17:57
aelknerwithout needing an evolution script17:57
ignasth1a: reading17:57
th1aI mean, can we just leave the interface hanging around for bbb?17:57
aelknerbbb is short for backwards compatability?17:58
ignasjust that - backwards compatibility with what?17:58
aelknerhere's why i think we don't need to keep it17:59
ignasth1a: just to be sure - you want schooltool.gradebook enabled by default in this release?17:59
aelknerwe don't need to worry about any cando instances in the field that would need it17:59
aelknerbtw, guys, i had to fix an interesting problem for jeff this morning17:59
ignasshould we add it to all existing ubuntu installations of schooltool18:00
ignasor make it enabled for new schooltool installations only18:00
th1aIt would be ok with me if existing installations required some intervention to turn it on -- but it would also be fine if it was on by default.18:01
th1aIt is an alpha to beta transition.18:01
ignasI see18:01
aelknerso i instructed matt to add schooltool.gradebook to their school.zcml file, i.e., adding the schooltool gradebook to their new cando instance18:03
aelknerone problem with doing that18:03
aelknerthe gradebook init routine doesn't run if it's not a new database18:03
aelknerso i had to patch their code to run it once18:03
aelknerbut it underscores a problem ignas pointed out about adding and removing packages18:04
ignasaelkner: hmm, the nice thing to do would make it "write on read" or something like that18:04
ignasI am thinking of doing something like that18:04
ignasto avoid complicated evolution stuff18:04
aelknercould you be more specific?18:04
ignaswell - you can create the default data structure the first time someone tries to access18:05
aelkneri get it18:05
ignasthus making schooltool.gradebook easier to enable18:05
aelknerso you mean in place of the InitBase18:05
aelknerderivitive of GradebookInit18:05
ignasit would probably involve changing the way categories are accessed18:06
ignasand making that access through an adapter18:06
aelknerit could be done18:06
ignasi think i'll have to do it, if I want users to be able to enable gradebook on their existing schooltool instances18:06
aelknerthat would help take that off my plate18:07
aelknercould you do it after i've finished the cleanup?18:07
ignasi guess18:07
ignasif you will tell me when you are done with cleanup ;)18:07
aelkneri only ask to avoid messy merging18:07
aelkneri certainly will18:07
aelknerth1a: ignas: so here's what i concluded about the Requirement class18:09
aelknerat first i thought it was just a BtreeContainer with the bases, subs for inheritence18:09
aelknerso i was going to replace it's code with just inheriting from BtreeContainer18:10
aelknerthen i saw that such a decision would cause me to have to write an evoluton script18:10
aelknerbut then a closer look revealed that it's more than just btree + inheritance18:11
aelknerit also is ordered18:11
aelknerso we keep it's version of all the btree dict-type methods18:12
aelknerbecuase they have the self._order logic that should stay18:12
aelknerand then i don't have to evolve anything18:13
aelkneranyway, it's not important18:13
aelkneri just thought i'd pass along what i learned about the requirement class18:13
ignasth1a: i am seriously thinking about disabling Overlays until I can fix them :/18:22
th1aOn the calendar?  I guess I don't understand how broken they are.18:23
ignascurrent view has to be mostly rewritten if I am to support groups in schoolyears, and with 8K students - that view will bring the system down18:23
ignasproblem is with current way we do relationships18:23
ignaswe have no way to refer to a particular relationship between objects18:23
ignasso the check for "are there new calendars overlaid"18:24
ignasis something like - let's go through all the possible objects and check if we have a relationship with it18:24
ignasif users will suddenly start asking - "how do I make someones calendar show events on my calendar"18:25
ignasI will fix it ASAP18:25
th1aCan you only turn that off for persons?18:25
ignaswell - we have persons, groups and resources in there18:26
ignasI have broke groups18:26
ignaspersons are too much of a load...18:26
th1aWell, we can't do a release without overlays.18:28
th1aIf you break them in trunk, ok.18:28
ignasoverlays for sections will work18:28
ignasbut you can't select them in the "More..." anyway18:29
th1aOverlays need to be back in October is what I'm saying.18:29
th1aIs that what you're thinking?18:29
ignasso you think we must have ability to show events of groups and persons on top of your calendar for the release18:29
th1aWell... resources.18:31
* ignas is trying to gauge the importance of this feature...18:31
ignasi mean - i haven't ever found myself thinking of real life usecases for it except for sections/timetables18:32
ignaswhich is why i am asking you for feedback ;)18:32
ignasyou are closer to actually using this thing than I am ;)18:32
th1aIt is important if you are primarily using SchoolTool for resource booking.  At the school here they set it up so that the teachers have the relevant resource overlays set up.18:32
th1aSo you can just check the library and auditorium schedules to see what's available at the same time.18:33
ignasis it when the teacher is the "asset leader" for the resource? or is it just for resources that hey might need?18:33
ignasI see18:33
ignasso it serves as a quicklink to a resource calendar18:33
ignasthat does not require you to leave your own calendar18:33
ignasto see whether library is free to use18:34
ignasok, i'll look at it, resource overlays will stay there for sure18:35
ignasi mean - it does not add *any* effort18:36
ignasthe question is - person overlays and group overlays18:36
th1aThat is not a deal-breaker.18:36
th1aI mean, if we can't do it, we can't do it.18:36
ignasi mean - persons work, but also effectively disable the view with more than a few hundereds of persons18:37
ignasjust because of permission checking and title showing18:37
th1aI'm ok with making it only work for resources for the time being.18:41
th1aSections too.18:42
ignaswell - sections don't work in More... at all18:43
ignasi mean - they never were there18:43
ignasthey do show in your overlays18:43
ignasbut only sections you are a member or instructor of18:43
th1aThat's ok.18:44
ignasas for schooltool.gradebook, i think we can do better than write on read18:46
ignasi think I can add a hook for schooltool application startup18:46
ignasthe other startup ;)18:46
ignasi mean - one startup is when the database is first created18:46
ignaswe had hooks and subscribers for that18:46
ignasbut there is also the startup when you restart the server18:46
ignasand it should be possible to hook into it and after making some checks either initialize gradebook18:47
ignasor just do nothing18:47
ignasallowing people to just symlink the gradebook slug into their plugins to enable it18:47
ignaswithout redoing all their data import18:47
ignaswe can even try that out in this release I think (i mean 2008.04)18:47
ignasif aelkner will be done with his fixes soon18:48
ignasso that the guy who expected the gradebook in launchpad answers could get what he wants ;) or at least be our guinea pig18:48
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aelknerignas: yeah, i always wondered why the hook was only for db startup18:56
ignasaelkner: because we didn't need the other hook18:56
ignasever ;)18:56
aelknerever, ever, forever :)18:57
aelknerignas: i think by our meeting on monday i should be 95% there18:58
ignasso you will only have the other 95% left to do? ;)18:59
aelknerit should be done by then19:00
aelknerbut just in case i say 95%19:00
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