IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2008-06-23

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ignasaelkner: up already?14:39
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th1aHey.  I'm on the phone with jelkner.16:30
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th1aHi ignas, aelkner.16:32
th1aOK, looks like we've got a couple balls in the air this week.16:34
th1aOne thing I'm starting to worry about is giving the process of getting our packages into Ubuntu a kick.16:34
th1aI need to talk to jinty about that.16:35
th1aIt would seem we have the hard part done -- making the packages -- but we still have the politics to deal with.16:36
th1aignas: How has your work been coming?16:36
LumiereI need jinty to document the package builder so cando can use it too16:36
ignasth1a: a bit slowly, spent some time helping mgedmin on Ivija (for all the time I am bugging him for help on complex schooltool issues)16:37
ignashe helped me resolve the timetable mess in my head though16:37
ignashad some problems with the mental picture16:37
ignasapparently - everything is simple - timetable dict is a container with 2 keys16:38
ignas1 key is __name__ the other key is school timetable + term pair16:38
ignasboth keys can be queried by16:38
ignasboth keys are unique16:38
ignaswhen I understood that - everything became clearer16:38
ignasgot a new revelation - "I still can't lead a spring and do good code reviews at the same time"16:39
ignasthe timetable weekly view (the one with timetable grid support)16:39
ignasis a bit hazy, and is not tested well enough so I could change it in some places being sure I did not break anything16:39
ignasbut I have managed to rewrite the test to at least get an indication of what went wrong with one of my refactorings16:40
th1aConsidering you're mostly working with high school students, I think you've done a great job at the sprints.16:40
ignas(a couple of events were missing in weekly view, just that it was not showing me which events in any readable format)16:41
ignasbut a couple of hacks and now I know which timetable got broken while fixing the "schedule" view for sections16:41
ignasso I am back on track, and I hope I will have Schoolyears in place for our europython sprint16:42
ignasso we could start discussing the new object hierarchy16:42
ignasat least on a mockup level16:42
ignasthat's everything for this week16:43
ignastoday is a holiday in Lithuania (and in theory ;) but I will not be online on friday16:43
th1aaelkner: Anything to add to your email report (you're sending a copy to ignas, right?)16:44
ignasyes he is16:44
aelknerfrom a mile view16:44
aelkneri'm needing to accomplish three main things16:45
aelknerby Aug 15 that is16:45
aelknercas, which needs only the patches to the live moodle and drupal instances16:45
aelknerand coordination with the SLA fols, or course16:45
aelkner2) the dashboard16:45
aelkner3) the propgation of person, course, section creation16:46
aelknerto moodle and drupal16:46
aelknerso i think i should do the dashboard next (concurent with finishing cas)16:46
aelknerso that at the sprint at europython16:46
aelknerwe can discuss the design of the propogation16:47
th1aThat will be an interesting conversation.16:47
aelknerth1a: you realize that our findings on testbrowser lead us to need to do what i had wanted to do16:47
aelknerin the first place, namely, writing to the SAL datbase directly16:47
th1aThe don't, really.16:48
th1aBecause you wouldn't be using TestBrowser anyhow.16:48
aelknerdarn Q is next to the A16:48
th1aYou'd be using Mechanize, or something.16:48
aelkneryou've done it before16:48
aelknersuccessfully, i mean16:48
ignasPoV have done it before at least once16:48
aelknerexamples available?16:49
aelknerwell, you can show me at europython16:50
aelkneras you know,. cando is in a bit of a crisis16:50
ignasI don't know16:50
aelknerjelkner and i have been on the phone discussing what we can do16:50
aelknereldar has quit16:51
ignashow? why?16:51
th1aWhat branch has Eldar been working on.16:51
Lumiereeldar has given his 2 weeks notice16:51
aelknerhe will not be at the sprint16:51
aelknerhe was still working on the svn repo16:51
th1aignas: We discussed this last week -- you emailed gintas?16:51
jelknercorrection: eldar did *not* give 2 weeks notice16:51
jelknerhe just left16:51
jelkneri spoke to him yesterday16:51
th1a0 weeks notice.16:51
ignasth1a: yes, but Gintas has no time too :/16:51
jelknerhe is out of the picture16:51
aelknerand in mid-feature16:52
ignasaelkner: do you know the reason?16:52
aelknerhaven't spoken with him16:52
jelknerignas: he got another gig16:52
jelknerwe can't really figure out the details16:52
Lumierejelkner: you need to contact dwelsh16:53
Lumierehe *expects* eldar to be on still16:53
jelknerLumiere: how, he is in florida16:53
aelknercell phone?16:53
Lumiereuse cell16:53
jelknerthe most important thing now is to find someone to work on this16:53
Lumierehe just called me on it16:53
aelknerthough i tried yesterday and he didn't answer16:53
jelkneron th1a's advice, i've been spreading the word in the local plone community16:54
Lumiere        *16:54
Lumiere          branches/cando-buildout-integration/src/cando/virginia/README.txt16:54
jelknertoday i planned to broadening my sweep16:54
Lumieresorry about that16:54
Lumierethere's the branch16:54
jelkneri'll be on the phone all morning trying to find someone16:54
jelknerany help you all could give me would be *greatly* appreciated!16:55
jelkner(by "help" i mean suggestions on where to look)16:55
aelknerat the sprint16:56
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ignasLumiere: is everything in there? last commit is 12 days ago ...16:56
LumiereI assume it is16:56
aelknerwhat's the comment for the commit?16:56
aelkneryou're looking at the svn rep, right?16:56
th1aThat's not good.16:56
LumiereMade global id optional again. Now if one is not provided, one will be generated16:56
aelknerhe never switched to bzr16:56
ignasaelkner: cando did not switch to bzr16:56
aelkneri just said that, didn't i :)16:57
aelknerso two things16:57
jelknerignas: we had scheduled that for this week16:57
aelknereldar not only didn't give two weeks notioce16:57
aelknernut he also gae us nothing in thelast 12 days16:57
aelkneris that what we are to believe16:57
ignaswould not be so sure, ask him if he has any uncomited changes16:58
jelkneri don't know if that will work16:58
jelknerwhen i talked to him yesterday, we basically said good bye and good luck16:58
jelknerwe need to assume that we have to pick up the pieces with whatever we have now16:59
aelknerso we will be aout three weeks behind when next week's sprint starts16:59
th1aOK... how do I get his branch running?16:59
ignasstrange, because the last commit is not related to the requirements work that I think eldar mentioned he was working on16:59
aelknerhe did the global id thing cuase we needed it17:00
aelknerthen he was going to finish course and section competency assignment17:00
aelknerthen the skilldrivers17:00
aelknerthen the gradebook17:00
aelknerwe figured he would not be done the gradebook, so i would pair with him at the sprint17:01
ignasI see17:01
aelknerwith the interns doing functional test writing17:01
aelknerand in the process, better learning cando's codebase17:01
aelknerin preparation for other ork17:01
aelknerbut that's our the door17:01
aelkneri think maybe17:01
aelknerwe should pair the interns on skilldrivers17:01
aelknerwhile i pair with someone17:02
aelknerand finish the competency assignmentthing17:02
aelknerand write the gradebook17:02
aelknerall in three days!17:02
Lumiereand without me for one of em17:02
Lumiereprobably 217:02
aelknerexplain please17:02
LumiereI have a conflict tuesday17:03
Lumierethat I cannot change17:03
LumiereI am techical support for Virtual NECC at ACC17:03
LumiereTuesday 7:30-517:03
aelknerwell, our hope to freeze by july 1517:04
Lumiereis looking unlikely17:04
aelknermaybe should be pushed back to aug 117:04
LumiereI know17:04
Lumiereleave it the 15th17:04
Lumiereif we blow it.. we blow it17:04
Lumierebut I need *something* presentable then17:04
aelkneryou hope17:04
Lumierebecause training starts17:04
aelkneri'm not promising anything17:05
LumiereI understand that17:05
aelknerunless my involvement changes to being more than just three days17:05
aelkneror a new developer is magically found17:05
Lumiereaelkner: can you afford any more time and still make SLA deadlines?17:05
Lumiere(and not die in the process)17:05
aelknerwell, i'll need to discuss this with th1a17:06
aelknerand not right now17:06
Lumierei am not asking for commitment17:06
aelknerwe'll talk about this at the sprint17:06
aelknerthat's only a week from today17:06
th1aWe intentionally set conservative goals for SLA.17:06
th1aIf everything goes well, there will be extra time.17:06
th1aHowever, since we set conservative goals, if we would miss them, we'd have very little to show for our effort.17:07
ignashmm, what are your plans for Philikon? i mean - you won't have anyone experienced available in there...17:07
Lumiereth1a: yes17:08
Lumierefor aelkner SLA has to take precedence, and I understand that17:08
Lumierebut it's going to look really bad on both CanDo and SchoolTool to miss the VA deadlines too17:08
Lumieregiven that we're supposed to be heading into the statewide trial this fall17:08
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* th1a can write code in case of emergency, although if nobody tells him what branch to check out, it is extra-difficult.17:09
ignasth1a: i'll explain it after the meeting17:10
aelkneri think we need to stick with the svn repo17:11
aelknerrather than wasting the sprint dealing with converting to bzr17:11
aelknereldar was supposed to do that too17:11
ignasI agree17:11
aelknerso, i'll coordinate with dwelsh17:12
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aelknerif i can reach him in florida17:12
aelknerLumiere: how long will he be there?17:12
Lumieretill wednesday afternoon17:12
aelknerok, that' my report then17:13
Lumiereand mine17:13
th1aOK.  Sounds like we all have plenty to do.17:13
th1aAnything else?17:13
jelknerso, no suggestions on who to call?17:14
Lumierejelkner / aelkner: you should probably start getting filip up to speed17:14
aelknerdon't forget ccarey17:15
Lumiereget them both moving17:15
jelknerccarey has been asking me to start17:15
jelkneri told him to wait17:15
jelknershould we move ahead on that now?17:15
LumiereI think so17:15
Lumiereeven if they just start17:15
jelknerwho would work with him?17:15
aelknerhow about telling him to check out comp assignment17:15
Lumierejelkner: filip17:15
aelkneri can answer emails17:15
Lumiereand aelkner on email17:15
aelknerbut not much more than that17:15
th1aYou may need to and be able to get more out of those kids than you think, jelkner.17:16
aelknerthey wil have to be self-motivated a bit17:16
Lumierejelkner: you can get a bunch out of filip for sure17:16
Lumiereccarey was on sif integration17:16
Lumiereso I didn't get to see as much from him17:16
aelknernot only17:16
Lumiereaelkner: I know, but I didn't see as much of his work17:16
aelknerignas can tell you he has done other things17:16
aelknerso yes, they should pair17:17
aelknercan we count on them to meet by phone if necessary to do this17:17
th1aThey're out of school now though, right?17:17
aelknerthey should be17:17
Lumiereth1a: yes aelkner: likely, but you may have to call them or use skype17:17
aelknerjelkner says ccarey asked him for work17:17
Lumiereaelkner: they won't have long distance17:17
aelknerskype, land line, whatever17:17
aelknerbut they will have to skype out17:18
jelkneryes, they are out of school17:18
aelknercause i can't get skype to work on my machine17:18
aelkneri tried contacting the skype help team, but they don't respond17:18
aelknerbut yes, i think an important start would be a conference call between me and the two of them,17:19
aelknerto kick off what they do together this week17:19
aelknerjelkner: would they noth be available17:19
jelkneri can do a conference call today17:19
jelknerit has to be this morning17:20
aelknerso could you initiate that and conference me in?17:20
jelknergive me about an hour to get in touch with everyone and i'll get back to you.17:20
aelknerremember to use my land line17:20
Lumierejelkner: poke me on irc before calling17:21
LumiereI will be in transit to acc17:21
Lumiereand then trying to figure out what my priority list for today is17:21
LumiereVirtual NECC is a lot of my work this week17:22
wbradyjelkner: what happened to
jelknerwbrady: don't know17:23
jelknercan't deal with it now17:23
jelknercan you contact mattva0117:24
ignasjelkner: is there a page that sums up everything that Cando needs to get done before fall?17:24
wbradyjelkner: ok17:24
Lumiereignas: I can share the google doc with you17:24
aelkneri wrote a long email17:24
Lumiereif you pm me a google account17:24
aelknerafter the first week of may sprint withy eldar17:24
th1aaelkner: Came across this this morning:
aelknerare we interesting in casifying that wiki?17:26
Lumiereaelkner: it describes a process to add CAS17:27
Lumiereto mediawiki17:27
Lumierewhich could be extrapolated to other things17:27
Lumiere(or am I off target th1a)17:27
aelknernot to moodle and drupal17:27
aelknerit's a case by case basis17:28
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Lumiereoh shit... it's paul flint17:28
flintth1a, Tom,  I got a thing for you...17:28
flintLumiere, Jason be nice!17:28
th1aOh, Christ who let him in?17:28
th1aaelkner: fyi just something that came through my google reader on a subject you're currently working on (PHP & CAS).17:29
aelknergot it17:30
flintth1a, veni, vini, pissoff17:30
th1aaelkner does not like begin provided with spurious data.17:30
th1aWhat's up?17:30
th1aHow's scary Barre?17:30
flintth1a, you know ?17:31
flintth1a, Chris Lozinski is the man.17:31
flintth1a, give him my kindest regards...17:32
th1aChris Lozinski?17:32
flintth1a, Barre is still scary.  I want to throw a Zope 3 conference up here someday.17:32
* th1a is going to have to go watch Vivian shortly...17:33
flintth1a, real good zope hack... out on the left coast.17:33
th1aignas: Are there instructions for getting the CanDo branch running in your docs?17:33
ignasth1a: nope, but if you have schooltool sandbox17:33
ignasadding cando to it is very easy17:33
Lumiereth1a: it runs like old schooltool trunk17:33
th1aflint: Oh, you need to be jelling jelkner, not me.17:34
ignasLumiere: not that branch17:34
flintth1a, enjoy Vivian, and send me some mail...17:34
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ignasLumiere: that branch runs like new schooltool trunk17:34
th1aLumiere: Oh, crap.17:34
th1aignas: Yay!17:34
ignasth1a: "svn co svn+ssh:// cando"17:34
ignasand add that directory to develop17:34
ignasand add "cando" to the scripts, tests and etc.17:34
th1ain which file?17:34
ignasjust like you do with "schooltool" checkout17:35
th1aI need to go babysit while Jennifer goes to the dentist.17:35
ignasif you'll have any questions - just email17:35
LumiereI need to go get ready to head to work17:35
LumiereI'll be on skype/email/irc about noon17:35
aelknerbummer, George Carlin just died17:37
aelknerhe was a big hero of mine17:37
Lumiereyea I got the email from WP17:38
aelknerhe was like the continuation of Lenny Bruce17:39
aelkneri'll miss his social commentary17:40
ignasindeed, I have only seen him on youtube, but I liked what I saw...17:46
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Lumierehi fsufitch22:37
fsufitchLumiere: hi!22:37
fsufitchlong time no talk22:37
fsufitchis aelkner around?22:37
fsufitchah well, he's not responding to his name being used22:38
fsufitchLumiere: is the branch we're supposed to be using ?22:38
Lumiereuh... it is cando-buildout-integration still22:41
* Lumiere stab aelkner more22:41
aelkneri'm here22:42
fsufitchthanks, cuz trunk is broken out of the box22:42
th1aThere are some instructions from ignas to me from this morning (on IRC) that might be what you need.22:43
fsufitchth1a: thanks!22:43
th1aWell, I'm just trying it now, too...22:43
th1aSo I'll let you know shortly if it works.22:44
th1aHm... I'm confused...22:46
aelknerwhat about22:46
th1awhat I'm supposed to be doing with buildout.cfg22:46
aelkneri'm going to paste mine22:48
lisppaste5aelkner pasted "cando buidout.cfg" at
th1aWell, I guess I'm confused because mine looks like that out of the box.22:51
aelknerso maybe we didn't need to change anything22:51
aelknertry bin/buildout22:51
th1aThat's always a good problem to have.22:51
th1a  Ran 177 tests with 3 failures and 0 errors in 1.461 seconds.22:52
aelknertry make run22:52
th1aOoh... CanDo tab...22:54
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th1aOooh... traversal error when I hit it.22:54
aelknerare you loggin in as manager?22:54
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aelknerth1a: did you start from scratch with a fresh db?22:59
th1aFresh checkout.23:00
aelknercould you paste your traversal error23:00
th1aTraversalError: (<zope.traversing.interfaces.TraversalError instance at 0xaa86c4c>, 'bugs.gif')23:00
th1aThat's truly odd.23:01
aelknerthat's not much for me to go on23:01
aelknercould you paste the whole traceback?23:02
aelknerusing lisppaste, of course23:02
th1aLet me start over again...23:02
aelknerfilip: how about you?23:02
fsufitchaelkner: i have an issue getting zope.ucol23:03
th1aaelkner: Do you have a working version of this?23:03
aelkneryes, on alan.elkner.net23:03
aelkneri should give you an account23:03
aelkneron sec23:03
aelknerwhat user id do you prefere, thoffman?23:03
th1aI don't need an account.23:04
th1aJust wanted to know if you had a working version for comparison.23:04
aelknerwe do23:04
aelknerbut you don't want to cimpare?23:04
aelknerthat's why i was gong to give you an account23:05
aelknerfsufitch: what iddue?23:05
fsufitchaelkner: my id is filip23:05
aelknerfsufitch: why are you telling me your id?23:06
fsufitchwhatis "iddue" then?23:06
fsufitchi'm confused23:06
aelknersorry, typo23:06
fsufitch"Couldn't install: zope.ucol 1.0.2"23:07
aelknercheck out the make ubuntu environment rule in the make file23:07
fsufitchwat about it?23:08
fsufitchoh, run it23:09
aelkneryeah, i guess23:09
aelknerit might help get bin/buildout to work23:10
fsufitchaelkner: it'll need these packages though ;)23:13
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aelknerfsufitch: i don't know what to tell you, i always ask ignas when bin/buildout doesn't work23:14
aelknerhave you tried comparing with the one on
aelknerfsufitch: that's all i can recommend23:15

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