IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2008-05-12

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th1a_hi ignas16:28
th1a_hi Lumiere16:28
th1a_aelkner is en route to a CanDo meeting in Virginia.16:29
th1a_Did he cc you on his email report?16:29
ignashaven't had the time to read it yet16:29
th1a_They've rolled out intervention, made some quick improvements.16:30
th1a_Seems like things are going on the right course now.16:30
ignasgood to hear16:30
th1a_aelkner and eldar are working on CanDo this week.16:31
ignasI see16:31
th1a_eldar will be pretty much full time all summer now.16:31
th1a_So this is a little sprint to get him rolling again.16:32
th1a_So we should have nice consistent work going on in CanDo.16:32
ignasi see16:33
th1a_Plus the other interns kicking in when their school year ends.16:33
th1a_I need an April invoice from you, ignas.16:35
ignasi'll tell Aiste about that, i thought she sent it already though16:35
th1a_I don't think so.16:35
th1a_I might have missed it.16:35
th1a_So, how was your week?16:37
ignasnot so smooth i can say16:37
ignason one hand - having the environment homogenized is very good16:37
ignaspackage release tools16:37
ignaswith tags and branches handled properly16:38
ignasbuildout coinfiguration that treats everything except cando the same way16:38
ignaseasy way to backport fixes to our 2008.04 release16:38
ignasotoh - 6 hours of staring at the progress bar on Saturday was not so ice16:39
ignasand i will have to explain all the new rules to Alan somehow16:39
ignasand I don't really like some of them myself ...16:39
ignasi can live with the first checkout taking ~15-20 minutes16:40
ignasand you don't really have to make another one that big after doing it once16:40
ignasthe problems are with publishing branches16:40
ignasso either everyone who wants to work on schooltool trunk will have to read bzr documentation about shared branches16:40
th1a_Were you able to import our whole history?16:40
ignasor i will have to summarize it in some accessible way16:41
th1a_An accessible summary will be necessary, I'm afraid.16:41
ignaswhich i am trying to do at the moment16:41
th1a_Good.  Thanks.16:41
ignasthe idea is this16:41
ignaslaunchpad does not use shared repositories yet16:42
ignasthey started talking about it like a year ago16:42
ignasand it's right around the corner ;)16:42
th1a_shared in what sense?16:42
ignasshared repository is a concept that means that multiple branches share the revisions that are identical16:42
ignasso if you have 2 schooltool checkouts in 1 repository16:43
ignasthey will have only 1 copy of the stuff that matches16:43
ignasso it will take up as much as 1 branch + differences16:43
ignasso when you checkout another branch (let's say schooltool_2008.04) into the shared repository16:43
ignasinstead of downloading 70 megabytes of changes16:44
ignasyou only get the few kilobytes that you actually need16:44
th1a_I see.16:44
ignasa neat concept, makes branching on your machine very fast and easy16:44
th1a_What about using --lightweight?16:44
th1a_Doesn't that speed checkouts?16:44
ignasit is good if you are not going to do any work on it16:44
ignasif you want to work on stuff - it's really really inconvenient16:45
ignasbecause you pay the 20 minutes of checking out time in the first 2 days waiting for bzr diff ;)16:45
th1a_Can we host our own shared repository?16:45
ignaswe do16:45
ignasthe problem is - launchpad does not use it yet, so if you want to publish your feature branch16:45
ignasyou must have a shared repository you have access to16:46
ignaswhich means either using the schooltool repository one probably16:46
ignasat least at the moment16:46
ignaswhich only people who have ssh access for schooltool can commit to16:47
ignasor - having your own web space16:47
ignasthat you can create a shared repository in16:47
ignasand push your new branches there16:47
ignaswhich adds a huge chapter to the documentation that would not be neccessary if we had launchpad working the way it will work some time in the future16:48
th1a_Hm.  I see.16:48
th1a_Well, I don't want you to spend a lot of time temporarily making things easy for hypothetical outside developers.16:49
ignasi am worrying about Alan16:49
ignashe is not very enthusiastic about learning things that are not related to his immediate tasks16:49
ignasit wold not affect aelkner that much16:49
ignasbut we have released schooltool.gradebook16:50
ignasto ubuntu16:50
th1a_I talked to him on Friday about it after your chat.16:50
ignaswhich means we will have to follow proper - develop on trunk, backport to release branch workflow16:50
th1a_I stressed that this change has been a long time coming and it won't be repeated anytime soon.16:50
ignasand even I don't like the way he will have to do it :/16:50
th1a_Because of the slowness?16:50
ignasbecause of the increase in the complexity16:51
ignasi kind of know why it is good to me, and how these are the best practices16:51
ignasbut making someone actually think that it's good when he has to juggle feature branches16:51
ignasand understand new concepts of bzr at the same time16:52
ignasis quite difficult16:52
th1a_Does he have to use feature branches?  Is that to make porting managable?16:52
ignasthat is kind of the point, bzr *should* make branching easier16:52
ignasand at the same time - mandatory if you want to have a proper workflow16:53
ignasbecause if you want the same feature both in trunk and in the release that happened weeks ago16:53
ignasyou better have it in an isolated repository16:53
ignasor someone will have to comb through all the checkins and pick the ones that belong to the feature16:54
th1a_Well, it might help to try teaching him this while eldar is with him.16:54
th1a_Perhaps we should set up a meeting on Skype or something as well.16:54
ignasthese things would be a lot easier if he was sitting in the same office ;)16:55
ignasbecause it's not something you can just say once16:55
ignasand hope that it will be known16:55
ignaswe need more like a permanent hotline ;)16:55
th1a_Do you think you'd be able to do this on Thursday or Friday?16:55
ignasi will try to16:55
ignasexplain it as well as I can16:56
th1a_OK... which day would you prefer to set up a meeting?16:56
ignasdoes not really matter16:56
ignasboth days are fine for me16:56
th1a_OK.  I'll send out an email.16:56
th1a_Do you have Skype working?16:56
ignasi think so, i'll have to borrow a mike from someone16:57
ignasmy skypename is ignas.mikalajunas16:58
th1a_I have to get rolling on my documentation this week... I got tangled up in my old school part of last week... still doing some of their reports.16:58
th1a_I think I'm tom_hoffman.16:58
th1a_Anything else?16:59
ignasi have released new versions of schooltool and schooltool.gradebook to gutsy17:00
ignasand will "copy" them to hardy17:00
ignasso you could try and see if they work17:00
th1a_When did you upload them?17:01
ignasyesterday i think17:01
th1a_OK, I might have already gotten it.17:02
th1a_I did notice when I was in Philly you'd fixed the version string in the footer :-)17:03
ignasso it works17:03
ignasok, copied both packages to hardy17:04
ignaswe'll have to wait until they get build17:04
th1a_Hm... I don't see that on my desktop though.17:05
th1a_I don't remember if I was looking at Alan's bzr checkout or my deb version on my laptop when I noticed the version string.17:06
th1a_That is, the deb running on my desktop doesn't have the new version string.17:06
ignaswell - yes17:07
ignasare you running hardy or gutsy17:07
ignasand did you apt-get update + upgrade?17:07
ignashardy - has no changes yet17:07
ignasthey will gt built in like 20 minutes17:07
ignasi guess that's all17:08
th1a_OK.  I'll send you an email about the bzr meeting.17:10
th1a_Have a good week!17:10
* th1a_ drops the bag of gravel.17:10
ignasth1a_: oh - by the way - you can find all the branches and trunks you need in schooltool "code" tab17:11
th1a_Ah.  Cool.  I'll try that out.17:12
th1a_See how long it takes.17:12
ignaslightweight checkouts prolly, unless you'll read17:12
ignasthe shared repo tutorial17:12
ignasth1a: i can send you the in progress documentation17:13
ignasso you can crash test it17:13
ignasstill better than nothing i'd guess17:13
ignassent it to you17:14
th1a_ignas:  bzr co lp:~schooltool-owners/schooltool/schooltool.stap2008spring/ doesn't work for starters...17:33
ignasfallback urls17:34
th1a_Missing a "p"17:34
ignasat least internal for schooltool are:$PACKAGE_NAME/trunk17:34
ignasoh :)17:34
th1a_hm... bzr co lp:~schooltool-owners/schooltool/schooltool.gradebook/ isn't working now...17:36
* ignas is looking at launchpad17:36
th1a_I don't see it there.17:37
ignashmm, my bad17:38
ignasforgot to register the branch17:38
th1a_bzr co lp:~schooltool-owners/schooltool/schooltool/ doesn't work either.17:44
th1a_Should it be schooltool-trunk?17:45
ignasregistered the branch, you can either wait for it to be mirrored or bzr co schooltool.gradebook17:45
ignasyes it should be schooltool-trunk17:45
th1a_Good thing you didn't send these to aelkner yet ;_017:45
ignaswe should rename it in launchpad i think17:45
ignasit's a draft ;)17:45
ignasnot a very good one apparently17:46
ignasrenamed the branch to schooltool on launchpad17:46
lisppaste5th1a pasted "bzr bug" at
th1a_Did you just change the name of the branch?17:56
th1a_OK.  Let's assume that caused my problem.18:03
th1a_Until it recurrs ;-)18:03
ignasth1a_: are you still there?18:36
th1a_I am.18:36
th1a_Things appear to be working... with bzr at least.18:36
th1a_Still checking out.18:36
ignasis there any chance i can include these kinds of things in your super documentation thing?18:36
ignaswhen you will get it working18:36
ignasand published18:37
th1a_Yes, although I might make a separate developer document.18:37
ignasyeah, a place for cross refferenced not code related documentation18:37
ignaslike release workflows, sandbox setups and etc.18:38
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