IRC log of #schooltool for Friday, 2007-06-22

Makorihiafter removing the schooltool00:00
Makorihifrom the slug00:00
Makorihiwe were given00:00
MakorihiConfigurationError: ('Invalid value for', 'package', "ImportError: Couldn't import scheduling, No module named scheduling")00:00
pcarduneMakorihi: where is your scheduling code located?00:00
pcarduneit should be in cando/SchoolTool/src/00:01
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Makorihiwow . . .00:01
smalekghI think... uhh... that... my brain... has melted...00:01
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fsufitchpcardune, so what is this barcode stuff about?00:03
pcardunewell, i'm sure bvuong and brittney can tell you about it00:04
pcardunethe synopsis is this though:00:04
pcardunestudents have id cards00:04
pcardunewhich have barcodes on them00:04
pcarduneand resources like cameras and laptops and projects also have barcodes00:04
pcardunewe need schooltool to generate barcodes for these items00:04
fsufitchi see00:04
pcarduneso bvuong already wrote barcode generation code00:05
smalekghEwww, you're objectifying a human identity... oh wait, it is already objectified (stupid social security numbers)00:05
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pcardunebut it is not integrated into schooltool yet00:05
smalekghhiya george00:05
fsufitchi see00:05
fsufitchnow what do i know about integration again...?00:05
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pcardune"integration" is just a fancy way of saying, make schooltool use the bar code generation thing to generate bar codes for a given object00:06
smalekghoh, random question... where would you be generating the bar-codes from?00:07
fsufitchthose pplz's code00:07
pcardunewe haven't decided yet, but probably from the __name__ attribute of the objects in question00:07
pcarduneso for a person, it would be their username00:07
fsufitchu could imitate something of java and have a hashCode() method for everything00:07
fsufitchand use that00:07
pcardunefsufitch: yeah, but that is more than we need00:08
pcardunepython already has a hash() method00:08
pcardunethat will hash anything00:08
Makorihiit gave me NameError: name 'interfaces' is not defined00:08
smalekghwe really have issues with positioning and file-referencing...00:08
Makorihifrom scheduling.py00:08
pcardunebut it gets tricky when the objects change every time you restart the server00:08
smalekghlike, insanely...00:09
Makorihiwhen i said, 'interfaces.ISchedule'00:09
fsufitchi see00:09
fsufitchwell, who are these ppl, so i know how to contact them ;)00:09
pcardunethere are special stuff in zope to handle that sort of thing00:09
pcarduneDon't ask me, I don't know what any of you look like00:09
pcarduneaccept for eldar jeff dave and jason00:10
fsufitchwell, that's useful...00:10
smalekghuh, could you answer our question?00:10
pcardunesmalekgh: what as your question00:10
pcardunei don't see any question marks00:11
fsufitchthe new questions dont need question marks :)00:11
Makorihiit gave me NameError: name 'interfaces' is not defined00:11
pcarduneoh, that is a statement00:11
smalekghyes, it is >_<00:11
pcardunedid you import interfaces at the top?00:12
smalekghoh. uhhh00:12
fsufitchpcardune, who are the people working on bar codes again?00:12
pcardunebvuong and brittney00:12
fsufitchbvuong, where are u?00:12
fsufitchi.e. are you at the ACC?00:13
smalekghyes he is00:13
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Makorihiwe have this error now00:14
tdoggettepcardune: in lieu of wdickers, are you our boss? We being the sifagent interns.00:14
pcardunedid he depart?00:14
pcarduneme/eldar are your boss00:15
tdoggetteLeaving us with the privilege of creating flattenCourse and inflateCourse functions.00:15
pcarduneMakorihi: *looking*00:15
pcardunetdoggette: ah, that sounds like a noble work00:15
smalekghdon't look!!!00:16
pcardunesmalekgh: get rid of your __init__ method00:16
smalekghjust now >_<00:16
pcardunetdoggette: you guys have working branches and everything?00:17
tdoggetteYeah, we're all set up.00:17
cpcareyare we working with schooltool Course objects here? or objects following SchoolCourseInfo?00:18
pcardunecpcarey: both00:18
fsufitchpcardune, so brittany gave me the intro to bar codes00:19
fsufitchhow do you want it to be integrated?00:19
smalekgh happy errors :-)00:19
fsufitchlike, from the user perspective00:19
cpcareypcardune: could you please explain how that would work?00:20
pcardunefsufitch: I want to be able to go to a url like http://schooltool/resources/someresource/barcode.pdf and get a pdf showing the barcode00:20
pcardunecpcarey: i'm not really sure as I haven't gotten a chance to look at SchoolCourseInfo00:21
fsufitchhow do you make pdfs out of the images?00:21
pcardunecpcarey: how are they different?00:21
pcardunefsufitch: I think they had it setup to generate either00:21
pcarduneif not, then gif instead of pdf00:21
pcardunewhatever file format works00:21
fsufitchok, so you just want to be able to access something's image that way00:21
pcarduneeven multiple file formats would be fine00:21
pcardunesmalekgh: *looking*00:21
fsufitchis there a launchpad blueprint about this?00:21
smalekghour code haseth been pushed, could thoust greatness please assist us in the figuring out of problems that sense of none make?00:22
smalekghJama hit the enter key on that one <_<00:22
pcardunefsufitch: no, not yet for some reason00:22
fsufitchwouldnt that be the first thing to do ? ;)00:23
pcardunefsufitch: someone ought to bug Lumiere about that00:23
pcardunefsufitch: yes, go ahead and put it in00:23
pcardunesmalekgh: you have permission errors00:23
fsufitchpcardune, under cando or schooltool?00:23
pcarduneoh wait... *i* have permission error00:23
cpcareypcardune: we think schooltool's Course object has just a title and a description, while the XML template SchoolCourseInfo has CourseCode, StateCourseCode, DistrictCourseCode, SubjectArea, InstructionalLevel, etc.00:23
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smalekgh*is laughing an insane amount*00:24
fsufitchsmalekgh, the command is /me00:24
pcardunesmalekgh: so, that error is because you dont have index_title defined in your browser view class00:24
* smalekgh is laughing and killing filip with a stranglehold from chains at the moment*00:24
pcardunecpcarey: yikes00:24
fsufitchpcardune, where should i add the blueprint??00:24
pcarduneMakorihi: it is in your .pt file00:25
Makorihihow would that look like?00:25
pcardunefsufitch: under cando00:25
fsufitchaaaah, i'm going to ask eldar, he's not so busy :)00:25
fsufitchoh ok then00:25
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cpcareypcardune: all of the XML template datatypes have a myriad of attributes00:25
cpcareypcardune: or at least most of them00:26
pcardunecpcarey: is there anything that says they are required attributes?00:26
cpcareypcardune: let me check00:26
pcardunefsufitch: on launchpad00:26
fsufitchright, where else?00:27
pcardunecpcarey: if it seems like there are attributes which absolutely must be there, then what we will probably do is create an adapter to an interface like ISIFAttributes00:27
pcardunefor the different objects we want to work with00:27
pcardunefsufitch: and on the wiki00:27
fsufitchagh, the wiki00:28
pcardunecpcarey: and then there would be interfaces like: ISIFSchoolCourseInfo that have attributes mirroring the SIF standard00:28
cpcareypcardune: only the attributes are stated as required, but the elements don't say00:29
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cpcareypcardune: i'm looking at the SchoolCourseInfo.xsd file from chesty00:30
pcardunecpcarey: you should probably shoot an email off to tom hoffman or will and ask them about the SIF specification and whether it requires all the data to be there00:30
cpcareypcardune: will do00:31
fsufitchpcardune, assignee is me?00:32
pcardunefor some reason you can only assign one person in there00:32
fsufitchand who's drafter and approver?00:32
pcardunewelsh and jason respectively00:33
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fsufitchwelsh is rdavidw00:34
fsufitchpcardune, ping00:35
smalekghlisppaste5: url00:35
lisppaste5To use the lisppaste bot, visit and enter your paste.00:35
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lisppaste5smalekgh pasted "part of our <_<" at
mattva01pcardune, when I clocked out, the 2 times were totally wrong00:35
pcardunefsufitch: yeah00:36
smalekghI feel n00bish right now, is that paste right?00:36
smalekghlike, minus the last cut-off part thinger00:36
pcardunemattva01: it uses UTC time00:36
smalekghthe whole 'self' business00:36
mattva01oh oops :)00:36
pcardunemattva01: I once tried to do a spike and make it handle time zones correctly, but it didn't work in the end00:36
pcardunetimezones are an enormous pain00:36
* smalekgh points to question mark00:37
pcardunesmalekgh: *looking*00:37
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pcardunesmalekgh: no, you don't want any self00:38
smalekgh<_< before I didn't have any self, and it complained about those attributes not existing >_<00:38
fsufitchsmalekgh, oops () : )00:38
pcardunesmalekgh: yeah, it depends on the namespace00:38
smalekgh<_< uhhhhh00:39
MakorihiAttributeError: 'Schedule' object has no attribute 'courses'00:39
pcarduneyou showed me the ISchedule object00:40
pcardunenot the Schedule object00:40
smalekghyep, the schedule object extends Ischedule though, so shouldn't it recieve the same attributes?00:40
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smalekghoh wait00:40
smalekghit doesn't <_<00:40
smalekghokay, that's on my todo list, cya peoples00:40
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aelknerpcardune: it looks like the interns have headed out.  Would you have time for me?00:50
pcarduneafter your brother calls me00:50
aelknerpcardune: ok, he'll be calling me, too, so after that?00:51
pcardunewhat did you wanted to talk to me about?00:51
aelknerthe batch system has changed a lot, so I was hoping you'd look at with me and analyze the effect the changes have on it.00:52
pcarduneyou could potentially remove batching for now00:53
pcardunesince we'll have to fix it later anyways00:54
aelknerpcardune: for instance, there doesn't seem to be any batch_macros anymore.00:54
aelknerright, I was thinking of that, but that seemed radical for little old me.00:54
pcarduneI think that is what I would do00:54
pcarduneeither that or fix it :)00:54
aelknerThey seem to have gotten rid of batch_macros all together, so I wouldn't know what to fix.00:55
aelknerI took eldar00:55
aelkner's suggestion00:55
pcardunewhich is why I suggest you just get rid of it and move on without batching00:55
pcarduneI'm pretty sure that batching is something people rarely use00:56
aelknerSo it's ok to iterate over the contents rather than the batch?  I'd be ok with that, but that would mean that 1000s of entries could appear.00:56
pcardunethat would be fine00:56
aelknerok.  will do.00:57
pcardunefor now at least00:57
pcarduneuntil we get batching sorted out00:57
aelknerYeh, and maybe eldar can sort batching out.00:57
aelknerCan I use xml comments to comment out parts of page templates?  This way, I don't get rid of the old stuff for good yet.00:58
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pcarduneyou can never get rid of it for good... that is why we have revision control00:59
pcardunejust delete it00:59
aelknerSomething told me you would say that.  :)00:59
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aelknerpcardune: I'm getting all kinds of problems starting my schooltool server:01:13
aelknerFirst there are warnings about python versions.01:13
aelknerThen there is a problem importing
aelknerHave you run across this?01:14
pcardunebut you weren't getting these before?01:15
pcardunewhat does it say?01:15
lisppaste5aelkner pasted "schooltool startup errors" at
aelknerI haven't tried to start the server in quite a while.01:16
aelknerI did just do a fresh checkout of my branch and make.01:17
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pcarduneaelkner: try running with python2.4?01:18
aelknerHow, by staring the server with make run?01:19
aelknermake run worked!01:19
aelknerI see that it uses python2.4.01:20
aelknerpcardune: I can see why you have shifted the SIF effort to use make.  More control that way.01:20
pcarduneand you can also just do python2.4 schooltool-server.py01:21
pcardunejust because it's executable doesn't mean you have to execute it01:21
pcarduneand now to go work on my google summer of code project01:21
pcarduneyou should check that out if you really want a trip into deep kim chee zope 301:21
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rogerzahi all01:24
rogerzajust been to the website schooltool.org01:25
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aelknerpcardune: I'll save the deep zope 3 for when I've mastered the basics, but I think I will be interested in your AJAX work by the time the summer is up.01:29
aelknerpcardune: As schooltool manager, I go to the manager's page, but I don't see a link for Blog.  Am I blind, or has it been removed?01:36
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pcarduneaelkner: maybe cando is not being loaded?01:42
pcardunethat is my suspicion at least01:42
pcarduneeldar supposedly fixed that problem01:42
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aelknerPerhaps I need to merge something other than the trunk in?01:43
aelknerpcardune: I'll leave you alone for the rest of the night.  I'll be signing on and looking for Eldar tomorrow morning.  Thanks.01:45
pcarduneno, there is nothing else to merge01:46
pcarduneI haven't had a chance to run actual cando in a while01:46
pcardunewith all this SIF stuff01:46
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smalekghanyone here I may ask a question about tals/sequences?05:15
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ignassetuptools are EVIL16:49
ignasbuildbot should work now though16:54
jfrocheignas: have buildbot running on your branch now ?17:11
ignasbut i have fixed the trunk buildbot17:12
jfrochegreat, less mail :)17:13
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pcardunehi everybody17:16
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* pcardune grimaces at the sight of hard coded file paths in code :/17:50
ignaswhere ?17:53
ignaswho did that?17:54
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pcarduneignas: sifagent code18:06
pcardunewhere is th1a when you need him?18:06
pcarduneignas: the sif stuff is in major need of refactoring18:06
ignaspcardune: no idea, i only see him in monday meetings lately18:06
ignaspcardune: anyone except you capable of fixing it?18:07
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pcarduneignas: well a lot of the refactoring just involves making the code more readable18:08
pcarduneignas: like this file for example
pcarduneso I think anyone could just go through and make the code conform to PEP 818:10
pcardunethat would be a big step in the right direction18:10
ignasthe code need some serious refactoring18:12
ignasi mean the ammount of duplication18:12
pcarduneWe need some good elisp scripts for this18:12
pcarduneexcept I can't find my emacs book18:12
ignasi mean no PEP 8 can fix that18:17
ignasyou could reduce the ammount of code in there like 20 fold18:17
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pcardunethis is discouraging18:50
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algapcardune: don't feel discouraged19:17
algait can -- and should -- be fixed19:17
algathe first thing I'd do is remove all the duplicated exception __init__s19:17
algajust set the different values on the class attributes19:18
algathen see if it is possible to reduce the status* classes to a list or dict of strings19:18
algathey seem especially unpythonic19:18
ignaspcardune: can you link to the place they are being used?19:20
pcarduneeverywhere in there19:20
ignasouch they are raising classes19:21
ignashow does that work at all19:21
ignasi guess only because they have a __repr__ defined they can see the error message19:22
ignasthough i would refactor it to use normal exceptions19:22
ignasand have 1 exception like SIF_XML_Error19:22
ignasand pass it the id as a parameter19:22
ignasas  SIF_XML_Error(2)19:22
algathat's how IOError works19:23
algait knows it ERRNO value and displays the message accordingly19:23
ignasand define error messages as a dict in SIF_XML_Error19:23
pcarduneBut I can't even test if the changes I'm making don't break the rest of the system19:33
ignasno tests?19:35
pcardunevery incomplete tests19:36
pcarduneignas: what is the difference between and Error and an Exception?19:39
ignashmm, you will probably have to add at least some tests for code that throws exceptions, and trust that if these tests pass - all the other code should continue to work19:39
ignaspcardune: don't know really, what does python documentation say?19:40
pcarduneignas: there is no such thing as an Error in python19:41
pcarduneI think tom just mixed terminology19:41
ignasouch, is he using bare excepts and then printing the repr of the thing he has caught?19:42
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ignaspcardune: the messages you get are not because of failing tests, apparently just constructing an Error object, logs some data into default logging stream19:55
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ignaspcardune: are you going to fix the exception file?20:13
pcarduneignas: eventually20:13
ignaspcardune: ok, i'll send you a patch then ;)20:13
pcarduneok :)20:13
ignasnow i get where these warnings are from20:20
ignasif you throw SIF_SOME_ERROR -> you throw it20:20
ignasif you call SIF_SOME_ERROR()20:20
ignasyou log it20:20
ignasnot 100% sure it's intentional20:21
pcardunethat isn't clear20:21
pcarduneok, i'm going to setup testing to work right20:21
pcardunewhat should I use for the test runner?20:21
ignasi don't know - what does zope.testing egg depend on ?20:22
* mgedmin would be surprised to find it depending on anything but the python stdlib20:23
ignaswhee emacs-fu20:35
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ignasi was quite sure i have disabled Ctrl+Alt+Backspace20:40
* mgedmin laughs20:42
* pcardune creates chesty-refactor branch on launchpad20:56
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lisppaste5ignas pasted "muffle warnings in doctests" at
pcarduneignas: that's one way21:00
* pcardune goes to take a shower21:01
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pcardunedoes anyone know what an ack is?21:56
pcardunethe tests don't actually test anything, they only test that functions were called21:57
* pcardune considers how zope CA could come in handy here22:04
pcarduneah, i see22:25
algaalso, the jargon didn't mention there's an ACK bit in TCP headers, used in the TCP 3-way handshake22:27
pcarduneits all greek to me22:31
* pcardune reconsiders whether it was a good idea to do math instead of CS22:32
algajust read a Wikipedia entry on TCP and you'll know more about it than any CS graduate :-)22:36
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