IRC log of #schooltool for Sunday, 2006-03-12

tiredbonesth1a, I have an ahtlonzp 1.3MHz processor with 500mg of ram, how long would you estimate make ftest run. Its been running for an hour now.00:01
th1aZope 3 tests or SchoolTool tests?00:03
th1aDo the non ftests run?00:04
tiredbonesth1a, I beleave the Zope 3 test, "make ftest". I haven't ran any of the python
th1aThere are a lot of Zope3 tests.  I avoid running them because they take so long, so I don't really know how long they take.00:06
tiredbonesth1a, I ran 'make test' and that took about 30minutes. I don't have to run, 'make test' or 'make ftest'? Just run the python
th1amake test and make ftest pretty much just run python test.py00:08
th1aThe SchoolTool tests don't take nearly as long.00:08
th1aIf you run make test from the SchoolTool directory instead of the Zope3 directory.00:09
tiredbonesth1a, I'm running them from the Schooltool directory. I'm at the top of schooltool tree.00:10
th1aWhat happens if you do make test?00:11
tiredbonesI did that and it took about 30 minutes to run.00:11
tiredbonesI'm now running make ftest.00:11
th1aWhat OS?00:12
tiredbonesUbuntu breezy.00:12
tiredbonesThe output from startin make ftest tells me inported 14 modules00:13
th1aOK.  I'm trying it on mine...00:13
tiredbonesMy system is really slow.00:15
tiredbonesI think I lost it. I can type on the line that show the process dots.00:16
th1aI need a clean checkout...00:16
tiredbonesShould I get a clean Checkout?00:17
tiredbonesTo do a clean checkout just be at the top of schooltool tree and run svn's update command?00:18
th1aWell, starting completely fresh.00:19
th1aThings can get out of whack because we've changed which versions of Zope 3 we use,00:19
th1aand also your Zope 3 checkout needs to be updated separately.00:20
tiredbonesSo, the Zope-3.2 I have needs to be updated first. Then update schooltool. Is that the order?00:22
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tiredbonesth1a, do you use svn for your Zope-3.2 or apt-get?00:23
th1aYou should use the one that comes with your SchoolTool checkout.00:24
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tiredbonesLittle confuse now. Are you tell me that when one first does a checkout of schooltool they get a copy of zope3, then if they do svn update they only get schooltool without anothe copy of zope?00:27
tiredbonesSo, to get my system in syn I have to remove schooltool and start over.00:28
tiredbonesWhich would be ok.00:28
th1aWhen you do svn up from the SchoolTool directory, it doesn't also update your Zope3, which currently comes from the Zope3 trunk.00:29
th1aSo you have to cd into the Zope3 directory and do a second svn up from there (if something has changed in the Zope3 trunk which breaks SchoolTool, which happens periodically.00:30
tiredbonesth1a, I think I got it. Two svns, on at the top of schooltool tree and then cd into `/schooltool/Zope3 and an update from there.00:33
th1aIf necessary.00:34
tiredbonesIt looks like I got to reboot my system.00:36
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tiredbonesth1a, I wouldn't to udate zope after i udate my schooltool?00:49
tiredbonesth1a, It wouldn't to udate zope after i udate my schooltool?00:49
tiredbonesth1a, It wouldn't hurt to udate zope after i udate my schooltool?00:49
th1atiredbones:  Here is what you need to do.00:49
th1aGet a clean checkout of schooltool, which I think you just did.00:49
th1aThat should give you a new Zope 3.00:50
th1aWhy don't you just try 'python' at this point and see if the damn thing works?00:50
tiredbonesok, thanks00:51
tiredbonesSorry for get you upset.00:52
th1aI'm not really upset.00:54
tiredbonesthanks for the education. It's up!!!!!!00:56
th1aWell, that's a relief.00:57
tiredbonesI think I'll go have a good stiff drink now.00:58
tiredbonesth1a, the reason just didn't run 'python' is I thought the test where required to run before starting schooltool.01:05
tiredbonesmay something in the README.txt file would help on this.01:05
tiredbonessrichter, where would I find the definition of New Event? i check around the site and couldn't find anything.01:37
srichter"new event"?01:52
tiredbonessrichter, yes it's on the first screen that comes up after you signon to schooltool.02:10
srichterlook in the ZCML Files02:11
srichterit is a menu entry for a simple add form02:11
th1asrichter: Pong.03:05
th1atiredbones:  It is to add a new calendar event.03:05
srichterth1a: I have hit a pretty big wall today03:06
srichterbut after thinking about it all day I think I have a plan of attack03:06
th1aOof.  What?03:06
srichterafter all, it turned out that the event model was not really adequate to manage the assessment grade items03:07
srichterthe system would have been too brittle03:07
th1aYou mean the term events triggering populating the gradebook?03:07
srichtergetting all the subscribers right would have been very delicate and difficult to argue about03:07
srichterso I bit the bullet and introduced term templates, and the system becomes more stable03:08
tiredbonesth1a, I see that now.03:08
srichterI have drawn up some UI mockups and an object creation workflow, so I will scan this in and send it to you tonight or tomorrow morning03:09
th1asrichter:  Ah.  OK.  Looking forward to it.03:09
th1aThis is what you and Martin were discussing in Rotterdam?03:09
srichterthough I think this latest design is a little bit easier in concept03:09
srichterth1a: btw, I love the "understanding by design book"03:13
srichterjust the first half of chapter 1 was very instructive03:14
tiredbonessrichter, by who?03:16
th1atiredbones:  It is a book on curriculum design.03:17
tiredbonesjust found it, Grant Wiggins,Jay McTighe.03:17
tiredbonesI'm going to critique the form that I see in schooltool. I don't expect a reply. I'll just give my $.02. take it for what it's worth.03:21
th1aWell, navigation is kind of a mess at this point.03:22
tiredbonesI'll send these in an email. I know I'm a noob, but I do have lots of experience with IBM stuff(CICS).03:25
srichterth1a: where you able to view the PNGs I sent you yesterday ok?03:26
srichterth1a: ok, they are out; It03:32
srichterth1a: it's 1.5 MB so it will take a little bit03:32
srichterth1a: the great part of using term templates is that creating a new academic year is a one form task and it is guaranteed that the term structure is correct03:34
srichterok, I am done for today03:38
srichtermore tomorrow!03:38
tiredbonesI couldn't really see the need for testing, but one value I have for them is helping me to understand schooltool.06:46
tiredbonesgood doc folk!06:46
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tiredbonesjelkner, hi, While i was googling for different terninology fo schooltool I was constanly point to CanDo. Can I assume that CanDo and Schooltool use the same definitions for the various terms like, Section, Manager and so for?18:06
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carljmam I an hour off, or was class supposed to start 20 mins ago?18:23
huynhclass is delayed an hour for today18:24
huynhdo some homework while you're waiting ;)18:24
carljmworking on it :-)18:24
tiredbonesjelkner, I don't see the configure.zcml file for the browser at the site. Did I over look it?18:27
carljmhuynh: as you read ch13, did you work with the messageboard example?18:34
huynhI was doing the tutorials from those three websites18:34
carljmI have the messageboard code from svn, and the web UI doesn't let me add a message to another message, which according to the tutorial it's supposed to.  and I can't figure out why...18:35
tiredbonescarljm, how did you sign on?18:36
carljmas manager18:36
carljmi'm using a zope instance instead of running straight from zope3 src, does that a difference?18:37
carljmi can add messages to the board, just not replies to a message - somehow it doesn't understand that the message is a container18:37
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carljmusing unmodified step01 code18:38
tiredbonescarljm, do you see any errors on the screen you started zope on?18:38
tiredbonescarljm, I want you to know that I'm also a noob.18:39
carljmtiredbones, just a number of i18n errors, which the book says to expect18:39
carljmtiredbones, well, less of a noob than me i'm sure18:39
tiredbonescarljm, I also get the i18n error when I start zope. srichter informed me that I needed to add a directive to the configure.zcml. It did not solve my problem.18:41
tiredbonescarljm, I don't know why Paul not seeing this same error. When you look at the configure file the i18n directive is not there.18:43
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tiredbonesI ask jelkner to post the configure file for the browser.18:45
carljmwell, i'm not so worried about the i18n error right now, just trying to understand why it doesn't understand the message object as a container for other messages18:45
carljmis it clear that I'm talking about the messageboard example from ch13, using the code from svn - not the timeclock example from class?18:45
tiredbonescarlym, it could be that the translation of object is not taking place. I grabed the out of thin air.18:46
carljmseems odd that the rest of it works, then18:46
tiredbonescarlym, yes it does.18:47
jelknergood morning huynh and wdickers18:58
jelkneri don't see our teacher yet18:59
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jelknerbut i wanted to ask you if you would prefer starting at noon instead of 11 am?18:59
tiredboneshow does that fit in with Paul's schedule?19:00
jelknertiredbones: i imagine he would like it better19:00
jelknersince he won't have to get up so early19:00
lhuynhI thought noon was when we were starting anyways19:00
jelknerlhuynh, we've been starting at 1119:01
jelkner11 to 119:01
jelknerso now it would be noon to 219:01
lhuynhdo you mean permanently moving the time? and not just for today?19:01
jelkneri was wondering what you thought about making it regular?19:01
jelknerthe only disadvantage is it occupies the middle of the day19:02
wdickersHeh, I have no qualms about moving it to 12 either19:02
lhuynhmm... I'm more comfortable with early hours, but if that's what Paul wants, I can do it19:02
tiredbonesjelkner, did you read my earlier post about terminology between CanDo and schooltool?19:02
jelkneri didn't see it yet19:03
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tiredbonesjelkner, right after you sign on to irc.19:03
lhuynhhello, teach19:03
pcardunehello everybody19:03
jelknergood morning teach!19:03
pcardunethey really open at exactly 9am here19:03
wdickersMorning teach19:04
pcarduneok, so where are people with the homework?19:04
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pcarduneI'm sure there must be a few questions19:04
flintgood afternoon campers...19:04
carljmpcardune: did you add me to your student email list?  i didn't get the notice about class being late today19:05
carljmand hi everyone, i guess i'm the new student19:05
lhuynhhello, carljm19:05
pcardunecarljm: sorry, I don't have access to that yet19:05
flintpcardune, ewww a new kid, can we beat him up?  BTW hi Carl!!!19:05
wdickershello carljrr19:06
carljmwell, you can virtually beat me up.  hi all.19:06
flintcarljm, wait till recess... :^) wecome Carl19:06
carljmto answer the original question: yes i have questions.  like, why do I get a system error when trying to use my new AddPerson view19:07
pcardunewell, that's a really specific question19:07
pcarduneI was hoping for some more general questions19:07
flintmy question was why did not get an error in the hello world example...19:07
flintok, you want a general question, is the homework assignment on the wiki at a particular url?19:08
wdickersooo, I have one...I think. In the hello world configure.zcml file, do the tags that start with browser: essentially placed in a browser/configure.zcml file?19:08
pcarduneflint: no, I don't believe it is19:08
pcardunewdickers: yes19:08
wdickersokay ^_^19:09
flintpcardune, ok then the object dog we were talking about last week ate my homework for this week.19:09
pcardunewhen we were working on timeclock, we separated out the browser zcml from the zope zcml tags19:09
carljmin the area of more general questions, I don't fully understand what addMenuItem and containerViews do.19:09
pcardunealso in the zcml files, you should pay attention to the very first configure flag where is says xmlns=19:10
pcardunein the hello world configure, you should see xmlns:browser=""19:11
pcardunethat allows us to use browser:whatever tags in the config file19:11
wdickersright, because they're condensing both configs into one19:11
pcarduneotherwise, had you put xmlns="" then we wouldn't have to prepend the browser tags with "browser" (this is the case in browser/configure.zcml)19:11
pcarduneas for carljm's question19:12
wdickersso does it not actually matter if that config file is in a folder named browser?19:12
pcardunewdickers: correct, it doesn't matter where it is19:12
tiredbonesDo you have a pointer the docs on all the driectives in these configure files?19:13
pcardunestrangely there is no static web page with the documentation (as far as I know), but you can use zope's apidoc to look through all of them19:13
pcarduneto use apidoc, you have to start up your zope server19:13
pcardunelog in19:13
pcarduneand then go to http://localhost:8080/++apidoc++19:14
pcarduneor whatever the appropriate url would be (for those on maddog i guess it would be )19:14
srichterwe are working on a static version19:15
srichterit had some bugs for 3.2, so we did not generate it19:15
pcardunesrichter: good to know19:16
flintsrichter, stephan is there a quick way to print a pdf of this?19:16
tiredbonescould someone post the configure.zcml file for the browser.19:16
tiredbonescould someone post the configure.zcml file for the browser fo timeclock.19:16
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pcarduneso, if you are looking at the apidoc now, you can click on ZCML Reference, and then click on browser and zope in the lefthand tree19:17
pcardunebrowser and zope contain all the tags that we have used so far, and really all the tabs that we will use in the future19:18
wdickersuh-oh, I'm having an error with Todo. It says __setitems__ is not defined19:18
wdickerswait, it's supposed to be singular. nvm19:19
pcarduneok, so finally getting back to carljm question19:19
pcardunewhat do addMenuItem and containerViews do?19:20
flintpcardune, hey paul how do we make these neat collapsing lists like this documentation uses?19:20
pcarduneflint: with a fair amount of difficultly19:21
flintpcardune, that is dissapointing... :^(19:21
pcardunethe zcml documentation for addMenuItem isn't the most helpful for explaining its purpose19:21
carljmit adds an entry under Add: on the left, right?19:22
pcarduneBasically, in the ZMI (Zope Management Interface), assuming you are logged in, you will see a list of objects that you can add to any given container (when you first log in, you are at the root container)19:22
pcardunecarljm: right19:23
pcardunethat is basically all it does19:23
carljmwhat creates an actual Add button if you view Contents19:23
flintpcardune, very similar to the old zope2 add dropdown.19:23
carljmit doesn't seem to necessarily do that19:23
pcardunecarljm: what exactly do you mean by view Contents?19:23
carljmI mean, choose the Contents tab on a container19:24
carljmif there are contents, under the list of them you get Rename, Delete etc buttons19:24
pcarduneah, yes19:24
carljmwhat makes an Add button appear there?19:24
pcardunezope goes through and comes up with all the possible objects that you are allowed to add to a given container19:25
flintIt says you can add a wiki.  is it merely that simple to add a wiki?19:25
pcarduneso, if a container has constraints, that say it can only contain x kind of object, then an add button will appear only for x19:25
carljmaha - so it only appears if there's only one option19:25
pcardunewell, at least one option19:26
tiredbonesDoes zope get this info fron the interface?19:26
pcardunetiredbones: precisely19:26
carljmin the messageboard example from ch13, there are multiple things you can add to a Message19:26
carljmsuch as another Message, or a File, or a couple others19:26
carljmand no Add button19:26
tiredbonesIs this also why we run test, so zope knows how to tie the pieces together?19:27
carljmI presume because it wouldn't know which you intended to add?19:28
pcardunetiredbones: no, zope knows how to tie the pieces together without the tests, we write the tests so that we know that we told zope the correct way to tie them together (does that make sense?)19:28
pcardunecarljm: I think I am confused19:28
pcardunewhere does it not show the add buttons?19:29
carljmUnder the list of contents, when you choose the Contents tab19:29
carljmnext to Rename,Cut,Copy,Delete (which are only there if there are some contents)19:29
tiredbonesso the test verifies the contract.19:29
pcarduneoooh, i definitely was confused about what you were talking about19:30
pcardunecarljm: I actually never see an add button there next to rename, cut, copy, delete19:31
pcarduneactually, carljm, you are right, only when there is only one thing you can add to a container does it show the add button19:31
tiredbonesDoesn't that directive tell forms what we want on the form when its display.19:31
pcarduneotherwise there is a list on the left hand side19:31
carljmalright, that's what it looked like - sorry for the long tangent19:31
pcardunetiredbones: which directive?19:32
tiredbones addMenuItem19:32
tiredbonesisn't this what we are talking about?19:33
pcardunetiredbones: yes, i was just making sure19:33
pcarduneaddMenuItem does not tell the forms what we want in them19:33
pcardunethe addform directive does that19:34
tiredbonesdoen't it say to place something on the form.19:34
carljmtiredbones: it places something on the left-bar Add: menu19:35
carljmtiredbones: something we can add to the container19:35
flintpcardune, what was the difference between the original QS hello world menu item and the hello world that eventually ended up on the menu?19:35
flintare these two separate menu items of addMenuItem?19:36
pcarduneflint: one of them is another zope object that comes with zope as an example19:36
pcardunethe other is the one you made following the tutorial19:36
pcardunethey are totally separate packages alltogether19:36
flintpcardune, I am concerned that this is not confusing enough... :^)  so I can have many instances of the object hello world eh?19:37
pcardunesure, as many as you want19:38
flintpcardune, and I can ruthlessly destroy these instances or create more eh?19:38
pcardunein otherwords, you can click on QS Hello World in the Add Menu, and add instances as many times as you want, and then delete them all if you want19:39
flintpcardune, ok the instance "time clock person container" has a size factor.  it is currently zero, what is that about?19:39
pcardunewell, when you are dealing with files in a file system, it is easy to come up with a size attribute (how many bytes the file takes up)19:40
pcardunein zope though, you can define custom size attributes that dont reflect bytes but some other unit of measure19:41
flintpcardune, could I associate a file with my instance of this object somehow?19:41
pcardunefor example, for our PersonContainer we could define our own size attribute that would tell us how many people were in the container19:41
pcarduneflint: no, i'm just trying to say that "size" in zope isn't necessarily synonymous with "size" in a file system19:41
flintpcardune, and doing a fine job sir... :^)19:42
pcardunechapter 17 talks about that19:42
pcarduneso, if those are all the questions at this point19:43
pcarduneI'd like to move on with the timeclock app19:43
flintpcardune, go ahead.19:43
pcarduneso, a couple sundays ago I asked you all to add a few extra addforms and addmenuitems to the timeclock app19:44
pcarduneso that we could add Person objects to our PersonContainer instance19:44
pcardunethere was a bit of mass confusion, so last sunday we decided to do a few tutorials first19:46
pcarduneso, the last time we left off doing timeclock we had defined an addMenuItem for the PersonContainer along with an addform for it19:48
pcarduneallowing us to create instances of PersonContainer19:48
pcardunehowever, after clicking on the instance of PersonContainer all we got was a crazy view dealing with a strange thing called "introspection"19:49
pcardunenow we want to create a simple view for the PersonContainer that just displays the contents of the container19:50
pcardunethus, we use the containerViews directive19:50
pcarduneI think at this point most of you know how to apply that to timeclock19:50
pcarduneso, if you haven't already, go ahead and do that, and the first one to finish can post what they added19:51
flintpcardune, is the PersonContiner menu item manifest on the z3 menu as  TimeClock Person Container19:51
pcarduneflint:  yes19:52
carljm      for="timeclock.interfaces.IPersonContainer"19:53
carljm      index="zope.View"19:53
carljm      contents="zope.View"19:53
carljm      add="zope.ManageContent"19:53
carljm      />19:53
flintcarljm, does this go in person or interface?19:53
carljmflint: browser/configure.zcml19:53
flintcarljm, and yes we are beating you up. :^)19:53
carljmpcardune: all this does is add the Contents tab?19:54
wdickerswhy are both index and contens zope.View?19:54
pcardunecarljm: yes, essentially19:54
pcardunewdickers: the index, contents, and add attributes define permissions19:55
flintpcardune, how besides experience do we know which file to put views in?19:55
carljmwdickers: anyone can list the contents, only manager can add something19:55
wdickersOh, I see19:55
pcarduneflint: well, you know that we separated all the browser zcml directives from the zope zcml directives (we discussed this earlier today)... since containerViews is a browser zcml directive, it goes on browser/configure.zcml19:56
tiredbonesDon't we need a permission atribute?19:56
flintpcardune, yea i see this now.19:56
pcarduneor you can think of it as: containerViews deals with stuff that we see in a browser, so it goes in browser/configure.zcml19:56
pcardunetiredbones: we already have three permission attributes... they are index, add, and contents19:57
pcardunethose attributes define permissions for three different views19:57
pcarduneso containerViews actually creates three different types of views automatically, and we specify the permissions for them in the zcml directive19:58
flintpcardune, ok, i put carls code in the configure.zcml and the silly thing is erroring out the instance now.19:58
pcarduneanyways, if you restart your zope servers after adding this, you wont see all the crazy introspection stuff after clicking on your PersonContainer instance19:58
carljmpcardune: so the contents view is the Contents tab - where is the "index" view?19:59
flintpcardune, na it is dead as a mackeral19:59
flintpcardune, i am backing the code out and restarting.19:59
pcardunecarljm: instead of @@contents.html, go to @@index.html (in the address bar)20:00
carljmflint: you put it in the right configure.zcml, browser/configure.zcml?  and did you put it between the <configure> tags?20:00
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carljmpcardune: ah. or if you're logged in as manager, it's under "Preview"20:00
carljmsort of20:00
flintcarljm, thanks by the way, you are failing the touring test... I think you are an alternate manifestation of Paul. :^)20:00
pcardunecarljm: exactly20:00
carljmflint: nope i'm a noob too, just read chapter 13 of srichter's book 3 or 4 times this week :-)20:01
pcarduneok, so is that working for everyone?20:02
flintcarl what is the whole path to the browser directory?20:03
wdickersworking for me20:03
carljmflint: ~/zope3/lib/python/timeclock/browser - on my system anyway20:03
flintcarljm, thanks.20:03
pcarduneflint: that is what it should be on maddog too20:03
pcarduneok, next thing we want to do is be able to add a person to our person container20:04
flintpcardune, i love a system that spreads configuration files into as many separate directories as possible.  reminds me of programming in visual basic! :^)20:04
pcarduneflint: well, we don't have to spread the configuration into different files, but there going to become large enough that it will be simpler to have them separate20:05
flintpcardune, then why did it not work when I did it into the child configure.zcml?20:05
pcardunebesides, they are functionally separate as well, one is for components (under the hood), and one if for browser views (glossy paint job)20:05
pcarduneflint: because browser tags are not in the namespace for that configure file20:06
pcarduneremember to pay attention to the xmlns attribute in the configure flag20:06
pcarduneanyways, to add a person, we will want an addform20:07
pcardunethis is also something all of you should be able to figure out, (there is already an addform defined for PersonContainer)20:07
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rjellisoUgh, finally here.20:08
pcardunehi rjelliso20:08
carljmhi rjelliso20:09
pcarduneso, if anyone has already written the zcml directive for the addform, please post it20:09
carljm <addform20:09
carljm      label="Add Person"20:09
carljm      name="AddPerson.html"20:09
carljm      schema="timeclock.interfaces.IPerson"20:09
carljm      content_factory="timeclock.person.Person"20:09
carljm      permission="zope.ManageContent"20:09
carljm      />20:09
carljmbut i get a system error when i try to use it, so take it with a grain of salt...20:09
wdickers        label="Add person"20:10
wdickers        name="AddPerson.html"20:10
wdickers        schema="timeclock.interfaces.IPerson"20:10
wdickers        content_factory="timeclock.person.Person"20:10
wdickers        permission="zope.ManageContent"20:10
wdickers        />20:10
wdickersThat one doesn't give me an error20:10
wdickershmmm, they seem identical20:10
carljmwdickers: I don't get an error on startup, but I do when I try to actually add a Person20:10
wdickersWell I don't have that problem...20:10
flintpcardune, I am back a step.  and am getting errors on carls first addition to the configure.zcml.  please post what is correct so I can move on.20:11
pcardune\msg flint if you are on maddog, you can take a look at /home/jelkner/zope3/lib/python/timeclock/browser/configure.zcml20:11
pcardunewoops, wrong back slash20:11
pcarduneok, both wdickers and carljm's directives look fairly close to correct20:13
pcardunewhat is the error you are getting carljm20:13
flintpcardune, I have residual errors that are still starting.  these warnings are annoying. do we get rid of them or live with them.20:13
pcarduneflint: are they deprecation warnings or i18n warnings?20:14
flintflint@maddog:~/zope3/bin$ ./runzope20:15
flint/usr/local/src/Zope3/src/zope/configuration/ UserWarning: You did not specify an i18n translation domain for the 'label' field in /home/flint/zope3/lib/python/timeclock/browser/configure.zcml20:15
flint  warnings.warn(20:15
flint/usr/local/src/Zope3/src/zope/configuration/ UserWarning: You did not specify an i18n translation domain for the 'description' field in /home/flint/zope3/lib/python/timeclock/browser/configure.zcml20:15
flint  warnings.warn(20:15
flint/usr/local/src/Zope3/src/zope/configuration/ UserWarning: You did not specify an i18n translation domain for the 'title' field in /home/flint/zope3/lib/python/timeclock/browser/configure.zcml20:15
flint  warnings.warn(20:15
flint2006-03-12T13:15:27 INFO root -- HTTP:localhost:8084 Server started.20:15
flint        Hostname: localhost20:15
flint        Port: 808420:15
flint2006-03-12T13:15:27 INFO root Startup time: 6.211 sec real, 6.150 sec CPU20:15
carljmpcardune: here's the end of my error:20:15
carljm  File "/usr/local/src/Zope3/src/zope/app/container/", line 214, in sublocations20:15
carljm    for key in container:20:15
carljmTypeError: iteration over non-sequence20:15
carljmcan give you more if you want it20:16
carljmpcardune, also I added an addMenuItem in addition to the addform for Person, else there was no option to add one20:16
pcarduneflint: these are related to internationalization, eventually we will get rid of them once we setup internationalization for timeclock20:16
flintpcardune, as George H,W. Bush says, internationalization is annoying... :^)20:17
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pcardunewdickers: is it working for you?20:18
carljmpcardune: i can also give you access to my instance if you want to use ++skin++Debug and see it all yourself20:18
wdickersIs what? Adding personContainer and a Person? Yes20:19
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carljmhmm - do you guys perhaps have something in another file that I'm missing?  Are the versions of everything else on current?20:20
pcarduneactually, the ibiblio viersion has a few small problems, hold on a second, i will fix this20:20
wdickersdo you have the timeclock-configure.zcml in zope3/etc/package-includes?20:20
carljmsure do20:21
carljmelse I wouldn't be able to anything at all with timeclock20:21
carljmpcardune, I copied everything else from, so if there's a problem there, that's probably it20:22
flintpcardune, I need to go early.  could you post the homework on the ibiblio site?20:23
jelknerflint: i'll make sure that happens20:23
jelknerand also send an email20:23
pcarduneflint: yes20:24
flintcarljm, for a while i thought you were jelkner in a cloak, but you are so much less optimistic in speach than he is. :^)20:24
flintthanks all.  sksk20:24
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pcarduneok, the correct version is now on the ibiblio site20:25
pcardunejust hit refresh on the pages20:25
carljmwhich file(s) have changed?20:25
wdickersCould you link me? I don't think I have it bookmarked on this machine20:26
pcarduneyeah, just a second20:27
wdickersthanks jelkner20:27
carljmok, the two attributes are TextLine instead of Text, see if that helps20:28
carljmnope, same error20:29
pcardunemake sure in IPersonContained inherits from
pcarduneand that IPersonContainer inherits from
pcardune(there was a typo and the r/d were switched)20:31
pcardunethat should fix it20:32
carljmthat was it, thanks20:33
carljmunrelated question: say I have a Person Container in my site.  What changes to the code/zcml would make it necessary to delete my Data.fs on restart for things to work as expected?20:33
pcardunechanges to zcml do not require deletion of Data.fs20:34
pcardunechanges to the code can if they involve chaning the data structures of your object20:34
pcardunesay you can an attribute of a class that was a list, and then you make it a dictionary, you would have to delete the Data.fs, because it doesn't know how to put a list into a dictionary20:35
carljmwhat about if you just change inheritance, like fixing that typo just now in
pcardunethat could potentially required deleting Data.fs20:36
pcardunebut only if the change in inheritance changes the data structure20:36
wdickersumm, what are Data.fs?20:36
wdickersare they the attribute values?20:37
pcardunea lot of inheriting is done for the purpose of acquiring methods and not attributes when attributes are inherited, that is when you have to watch out20:37
pcardunewdickers: Data.fs is the file that stores all the data on the ZODB (zope object database20:37
wdickersSo it contains the instance data?20:38
carljmalright, makes sense20:38
pcarduneyou can find it in ~/zope3/var/20:38
tiredbonesso if you change your attributes you wouls hve to reorg the Data.fs?20:38
pcardunewdickers: correct, for your entire zope instance and everything in it20:38
wdickersokay, I get it now20:39
pcardunetiredbones: sometimes yes, and sometimes no, it depends on the changes you have made20:39
tiredbonesschema changes.20:40
pcarduneanyways, so hopefully everyone has working zcml directives?20:40
pcardunetiredbones: again, it depends.  it also depends on the implementation.... in general it is a good idea to solidify your data structures before making any major release of your software20:41
pcardunei think jelkner wanted to talk about logistics for a second if he's around20:42
jelknerhe is20:43
jelknerq1: do tiredbones and carljm want/need maddog accounts?20:43
tiredbonesI don't think so?20:43
pcardunethey seem to be doing pretty well without them20:44
carljmdoes it get me anything besides a server on which to play with zope?  because i have that already20:44
jelknerq2: are tiredbones and carljm on the mailing list?20:44
jelknercarljm: that's all it would be for20:44
jelknerbut since the rest of us are on it, it would be easier to copy files from each other.20:45
carljmok, i don't need a maddog account, but I do need to get on the mailing list20:45
pcardunejelkner: and i need administrative access to that mailing list (and logs would be nice if that is possible)20:45
carljmoh, ok, well if it's not a problem, go ahead and give me an account then.  username carljm20:45
jelknercarljm: send me an email: and i'll set it up for you20:46
jelknersend me your name while you're at it ;-)20:46
jelknerok next question:20:46
jelknerdoes everyone know about the nelinux sprint from july 16-19?20:47
lhuynhwhere is it?20:47
jelknernew hamshire20:47
tiredboneswhat's the cost?20:47
wdickersSOMEONE just called my parents :)20:47
jelkneryes, i tried to reach linda's mom too, but she didn't answer20:48
lhuynh... she went out, I think20:48
jelknerlhuynh: did you tell her about it?20:48
wdickersis Linda here today?20:48
carljmjelkner: email sent20:49
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lhuynhjelkner: she needs info20:49
wdickersoh, there you are xD20:49
jelknerthat's why i was trying to call her20:49
lhuynhbut it's a given that I can't come to the ACC one20:49
tiredbonesWhai is tha ACC one?20:49
jelknerArlington Virginia20:50
jelknerArlington Career Center20:50
jelknerCanDo sprint20:50
jelknerJuly 29-30, 200620:50
jelknerno cost20:50
jelknerexcept transportation and room and board20:50
jelknerok, that's all i have20:51
jelkneroh, same time next week20:51
jelkner12 - 2 pm20:51
tiredbonespcardune, do you have a new email address?20:51
wdickersWait...why would there be need for 'board' when it's at the Career Center?20:51
wdickers*'room and board'20:51
jelknerwdickers: not for you ;-)20:51
pcardunetiredbones: nope same one20:51
jelknerbut for folks coming from a far, yes20:51
pcardunewdickers: you already have permanent room and board20:52
lhuynhwhat about the NH one?20:52
jelknerwe are staying on campus20:52
jelknerbut there is no cost to you, linda, the internship pays for everything20:52
lhuynheven better :)20:53
carljmis class over, or are we doing more after the logistics break?20:53
wdickersNot really, I'm getting kicked out in 3 years T-T20:53
lhuynhwdickers: you're a freshman?20:53
jelknerpcardune: well, teach?20:53
wdickersNope, sophmore20:53
pcardunewell, if people need to go, they can, those who want to can stick around and we will do one more small thing (making a page)20:54
wdickersI'll stay20:54
carljmalright, i'm staying20:54
jelkneri need to go (my son has a concert)20:54
lhuynhI need to go20:54
jelknercya next week...20:54
lhuynhyeah, bye20:54
pcardunehomework will go out in an email and get posted on the internet20:54
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pcarduneok, so now you guys can add a Person instance to a PersonContainer instance yes?20:55
wdickersOh wait, is this the making of the index.html?20:55
rjellisoindeed I can.20:55
wdickersI already did that 8D20:55
pcardunewdickers: yeah, if you already did that, you have nothing more to do20:56
wdickersHeh, okay. See you guys next week20:56
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pcarduneok, so if you click on the Person object that you added, again you are going to get the Introspection view20:56
pcardunebecause we haven't defined an index.html view for our Person object20:56
carljm(unless I defined an editform already)20:57
pcardunestep one is to add a "page" zcml directive to the browser/configure.zcml file20:57
pcardunecarljm: yeah20:57
pcarduneso if you defined an edit form you will see that instead of the introspector20:58
pcarduneI will paste the directive below:20:58
pcardune  <page20:58
pcardune      name="index.html"20:58
pcardune      for="timeclock.interfaces.IPerson"20:58
pcardune      template=""20:58
pcardune      permission="zope.Public"20:58
pcardune      menu="zmi_views" title="View"20:58
pcardune      />20:58
pcardunethe attributes here are just like the ones that we've seen20:59
pcardunethe new attributes are template, menu, and title20:59
pcardunewhen we create a page we can add a link to it to any menu we want.  In this case we add a link to the zmi_views menu21:00
pcardunezmi_views is the menu for the tabs you see at the top21:00
carljmwhat other menus are there?21:00
pcardune(Instrospector, Edit, Contents, that kind of stuff)21:00
carljmand what's the difference between zope.Public and zope.View?21:00
carljmno, those are part of zmi_views - what other menus exist besides zmi_views?21:01
pcardunecarljm: that was a continuation of what i was saying before21:01
carljmoh, sorry21:01
pcardunei'm not sure there are any other useful menus other than zmi_views21:01
pcardunebut the idea is that you can create your own menus21:01
pcarduneand use those21:02
pcarduneas many menus as you like, etc.21:02
pcardunethe title attribute goes along with the menu attribute (hence why they are usually on the same line) and just says what goes in the menu21:02
pcarduneor rather, the text to display for the menu21:02
pcardunethe template attribute specifies a file that says what our page is going to look like21:02
pcarduneso we are not going to create an index.html file anywhere, as you would on a regular web server.  instead we are going to create a zope page template called which is essentially a dynamic web page21:03
pcarduneindex.html is just the name by which you access it over the web21:03
pcarduneyou check out to see what the file looks like21:04
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pcarduneif any of you have worked with zope2, page templates are pretty much the same as from zope 221:05
pcarduneI would highly suggest reading up on zope page templates21:06
pcardunethere is lots of documentation on them21:06
pcardunethere is a very detailed reference here:
pcardunewe don't have time at the moment to go over what eavh tal attribute does in this file21:07
pcardunebut chapter 14 goes over that in more detail and I would suggest reading that to get started21:08
pcarduneanyways, if you restart your zope server now, then you will have an index.html page that displays the name and username of the person21:09
pcarduneand that's it for the class21:09
tiredbonespcardune, while your on vaction do you read your email daily?21:09
pcardunetiredbones: yes, but i don't necessarily respond daily21:09
pcardune(i get a lot of emails)21:09
carljmvery nice21:10
carljmone last question?  what's the diff between zope.Public and zope.View permissions?21:10
carljmthe latter requires authentication?21:10
pcarduneyou know, I'm not entirely sure21:11
pcardunei think it has to do with some more in depth security stuff21:11
pcarduneinvolving principals (which we haven't learned about yet)21:11
pcardunezope.Public is *always* public21:12
carljmthanks for the class - homework?21:12
pcardunewhere as zope.View isn't necessarily always public21:12
pcardunei haven't decided what the homework should be yet21:13
pcardunei'll send out an email about it soon though21:13
tiredbonespcardune, Does CanDo have a web site?21:13
pcardune is one of them21:14
tiredbonespcardune, where is discussion being done?21:14
pcarduneuse-cases for cando?21:14
pcardunethey are not really available publicly... there is a *very* small group of people working on it so we don't really have that kind of information up at this point21:15
pcardunealthough there is another website you could look at about taht21:16
pcardunejinty: i heard you that you are the new sys admin guy for schooltool?22:00
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