IRC log of #schooltool for Tuesday, 2006-02-14

srichterhow is it going?00:26
srichterth1a: did you get the examples to work?00:27
th1aI've been distracted.00:28
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tiredbonesWhen I run "" I'm informed that "var/schoolbell.log" is missing. Can I touch this file and what var should it be in?03:04
th1atiredbones:  Where are you running that from?03:28
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tiredbonesth1a, I'm running it from the top of the tree.03:59
th1aYou checked it out, did 'make' and then 'python' ?04:00
tiredbonesth1a, /usr/local/schooltool04:00
tiredbonesth1a, my "make test" failed. Does this test have to pass before starting scholltool?04:02
th1aWhat failed?04:02
th1aSometimes a few tests fail but the server will seem to work.04:03
tiredbonesth1a, I'm using to instruction in the readm.txt file. It said to run  "make test" and the "make ftest".04:03
th1aSo when you try to run it it doesn't find var/log?04:04
th1aThat should be in schooltool-skel/04:04
tiredbonesth1a, no var.lof not found.04:05
th1aWhat OS are you on?04:06
tiredbonesth1a, ubuntu -breezy.04:06
th1aSo you do an svn checkout from the trunk.04:08
th1aCd into your new directory.04:08
th1aType 'make test' and get errors?04:08
tiredbonesth1a, the only thing I have on schooltool-skel/var is the readme file.04:08
tiredbonesth1a, When I run make test I get an error from gcc. It could be that I have some hardware problem accordin to the doc I read.04:10
tiredbonesth1a, I'm not sure this is so, yet.04:10
tiredbonesth1a, I'm not sure of this tho.04:11
th1aIf you're getting an error from gcc it isn't even compiling the Zope 3 extensions correctly, I'd imagine.04:11
tiredbonesth1a, Does the make test have to pass to bring up scholltool?04:11
th1aDo you get the same error if you just type 'make' ?04:12
tiredbonesth1a, it's running now?04:12
tiredbonesth1a, that finish without an error.04:13
th1aWhy do you say it is an error from GCC?04:13
th1aYou're just going to have to paste all your error messages and stick them on http://issues.schooltool.org04:14
th1aOr mail them to schooltool-dev.04:14
th1aMost of us use Breezy all the time, so it doesn't make sense that this isn't working for you.04:14
tiredbonesth1a, I agree with your last statement. That's is why I'm confuse.04:15
tiredbonesth1a, does make test have to pass before starting schooltool?04:16
th1aBut I don't understand why you think the error is coming from gcc.04:17
th1aIf there is a problem compiling C extensions, it wouldn't surprise me if nothing works.04:17
tiredbonesth1a, I assume that because when I run make test I get a seg fault from the compilation Btree.04:18
th1aYes, if you are getting a segfault from SchoolTool ever, something has gone horribly, horribly awry far below the level of our programming.04:19
tiredbonesth1a, I'm running make test again and I'm getting farther than I did before.04:20
tiredbonesth1a, I now got seg fault from some different than before. I'll post it pastebin.04:22
th1aIf I were you I'd download Zope 3.2 from and see if that will compile and run.04:23
th1acd into the Zope3 directory and run 'make test'04:25
th1aSee if those pass.04:26
tiredbonesth1a, this is the last part the screen,
th1aWell, it isn't a SchoolTool problem, then.04:31
th1aAre you running some weird architecture or something?04:31
tiredbonesth1a, No04:32
th1aThis is a lower level problem than I can diagnose.04:32
tiredbonesth1a, madmin(?) pointed me to some doc about this issue, it seems he had the same problem. His solution was to by new ram.04:34
th1aDo you compile other C apps on this machine?04:35
tiredbonesth1a, not yet, but that's my next test.04:36
tiredbonesth1a, I'm not sure how complex the code has to be before the error shows up.04:37
th1aYou could also try a RAM test.04:38
tiredbonesth1a, Can you point me to some docs/04:39
tiredbonesth1a, just found it on google. Thanks for your time.04:40
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povbot`/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 5757:10:57
povbot`/svn/commits: Added a copy of Python 2.4 to the SchoolTool repository.10:57
povbot`/svn/commits: I want to apply the patch to get rid of hundreds of 'make coverage' warnings:
povbot`/svn/commits: The patch is purely cosmetic, and SchoolTool will work perfectly with pristine, so our packaging manager need not worry.10:57
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mgedmin'make coverage' broke for some reason11:04
povbot`/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 5758:11:05
povbot`/svn/commits: Applied the patch to get rid of hundreds of 'make coverage' warnings:11:05
povbot`/svn/commits: The patch is purely cosmetic, and SchoolTool will work perfectly with pristine, so our packaging manager need not worry.11:05
mgedminnope, its 'make test' that broke11:05
mgedminhow? why?11:06
mgedminwhy didn't buildbot notice anything?11:06
mgedminzope 3.2 versus zope trunk11:06
mgedminold sandboxes11:06
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tiredbonesHas anyone here used Memtest86? I ran several hours of test and Memtest86 reports no problems. I even ran the Bit Fade test, which ran for three and half hours, and it said I have no problems with my RAM.14:47
ignaswell, if it says that everything is ok, then probably your RAM is ok14:48
tiredbonesignas, yes but I still get a seg fault when I run make test on schooltool.14:49
ignasthen maybe something else is broken, not ram14:49
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tiredbonesWell, I just ran "make test" again and this time it finished with "1002 test in 168.635s". Onward to 'make ftest".14:58
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tiredbonesThe first time I ran "make ftest" it hung my system up. Now I get seg faults
tiredbonesIs there a log for this?15:33
ignastiredbones, your computer is seriously broken, as gcc segfault indicated, and sorry but we can't really help you run schooltool/bell on a broken PC ...15:36
ignasi am not really good at fixing hardware problems remotely15:37
tiredbonesI'm going to download again, is this the right address? svn co
ignastiredbones, as i have already said - turn of your PC and carry it to the service, because you are having some pretty serious hardware problems, and if not fixed you can loose your data/ burn your mother board/ poison your cat etc.15:43
algaignas is right15:45
tiredbonesThe problem I waould have is finding someone to look at it and know what they are doing.15:47
ignasaren't there any computer services in the town ?15:51
tiredbonesThe nearest town is 30 miles away. It's probable time to build a new box.15:54
tiredbonesThis has not been my week. First my fuls pump went on by backhoe during the snow stom, next my furnace started to suck air, causing it not to run. The toen refuse to let me rezone my property. Now my computer shit-the-bed.15:57
ignaswhere are you from ?15:58
tiredbonesI live in Maine, USA.15:58
tiredbonesP.S. This is the highest tax state in the USA.16:00
tiredbonesOne more, My wife just told me that the light in the shower doesn't work and the light bulb is not burnt out. Sorry for being so wordy this morning.16:01
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srichtertiredbones: where in Maine do you live?16:10
tiredbonessrichter, A place called Casco, near lake sebago, which I look at while I work.16:11
tiredbonessrichter, I went to Boston once to see you give a speach on Zope 3 at the boston-group(?), but things got kinda busy for you and you couldn't make it.I hope you can make it up some day.16:14
srichteroh, I was giving a talk at the last one16:22
srichterI think I will give another one soon16:22
tiredbonessrichter, I didn't get a notice on your speach. I'll be look for your next one.16:24
* srichter took out his Maine Gazetteer and found your town16:24
srichteris it really 30 miles to Portland? the map says more about 15-20 miles16:25
tiredbonessrichter, population 3,000 in the winter month and 30,000 in the summer months.16:25
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srichtermmh, maybe a great place to have a sprint in the spring/summer :-)16:26
tiredbonessrichter, to be exact it's 28 miles.16:26
tiredbonessrichter, to be exact it's 28 miles to Portland.16:27
srichterok; can you go snowmobiling over there?16:28
tiredbonessrichter, yes, but I gave by snowmobile away a couple of years ago. From my house you can snowmobile to Canada. I uderstand they have some very nice hotels on many of these trails.16:30
th1a OK, let's get this meeting underway.16:31
srichtertiredbones: cool, I might have to come up one weekend16:31
th1aIt should be brief.16:31
srichterth1a: yep, claerly I am here16:31
th1aWho else is awake?16:32
* mgedmin is ready for the meeting16:32
tiredbonessrichter, I had some friends that snowmobile from Portland Or. to Portland, Me. a couple of years age. They said they would never do that again. I'l lurk now.16:32
th1aOK, let's plow ahead then.16:32
th1ajinty has limited connectivity, but it doesn't appear (from his email) that anything is standing in his way to create the packages for Dapper.16:33
th1aGood work by mgedmin and ignas making more changes than we thought would be necessary to get things running with Zope 3.2.16:34
srichteryes, well done!16:34
th1aAnything in particular that should be brought to the Zope 3 release manager's attention?16:34
* mgedmin stands up and bows modestly16:34
srichterI think a bug report concerning the missing BBB of the viewlet stuff would be good16:35
mgedminI cannot think of anything16:35
mgedminhas anyone tried a live database upgrade?16:35
mgedmin(and lived to tell the tale)16:35
th1aUm... no.16:35
ignaswell - Zope3 drastically changet the xstrategy of selecting multi adapters16:36
ignasand - there is no BBB for http server16:36
* th1a just had to run to the door to receive his Paris to Brussels and Brussels to Rotterdam rail tickets.16:37
srichterthe BBB for the HTTP server is a good one16:38
ignasthe drastic change in the selection policy was the evil bit16:39
ignasit literaly turned the world around for REST traversers, and got only 2 lines of mention in the ChangeLog of Zope316:39
srichtermulti-adapter lookup: That strategy should not have changed much, other than a relatively small change to fix a bug; wait for 3.3 :-)16:39
ignassrichter, the fix was not small16:39
kitblaketh1a, doublecheck the dates16:40
ignasignoring the interfaces on the first argument vs making them the main criteria16:41
srichterbut that change should have not caused any failures, unless you were using the buggy one16:41
srichteranyways, the change for 3.3 will be bigger16:42
srichteras a note, Jim has told me that unit tests will speed up 30% and startup and ftests 50% (or the other way around; I can't remember exactely)16:42
th1asrichter: How's that going to work?16:43
srichterhe basically completely rewrote the lookup and caching strategy16:43
srichterthe new code will also feature site inheritance16:43
srichterwhich opens the door for declaring local sites in ZCML16:44
mgedminwill it perhaps be possible to get a complete list of adapter registrations?16:44
mgedmin(to catch unit tests that do not cleanup after themselves)16:44
srichterI dunno, I have not looked at it, but it should be possible16:44
srichterit is possible now too, I think16:44
srichteranyways, the speedup seemed feasible, because multi-adapter lookup used to be very inefficient, since it was implemented as an afterthought16:45
th1aOK... we should probably move on.16:46
mgedminI am sure it is *possible* now, if you know the implementation details of the adapter registry *intimately*16:46
mgedminbut there is no public API for that16:46
mgedmin(or at least there wasn't when I last looked for it)16:47
mgedminok, +1 for moving on16:47
th1asrichter, kitblake, et al: Comments on your summit in Rotterdam?16:47
th1aInfrae impressions of SchoolTool?16:47
j-wi think the summit was useful!16:48
j-wwe got to know schooltool really quickly having stephan around!16:48
kitblakewe made a flying start with Stephan here16:48
kitblakeMartijn is at a customer today, but he had some good sessions with Stephan last week.16:48
kitblakethey worked on an average score calculation for the gradebook16:49
srichteryeah, I think it went really well; MArtijn and I got to chat about some term/gradebook integration as well, since those two seem tightly coupled for some reason16:49
kitblakeMartijn and Stephan talked about how terms, types of terms, courses and sections fit together and got some interesting ideas on how to proceed with a design16:49
th1asrichter and I are going to meet on Thursday & will probably work on those issues some more.16:50
mgedminsrichter, never mind, I think I see it now16:50
mgedminsrichter, thanks16:51
th1aOK.  Thanks for the report...16:51
srichteryeah, I hope Tom will simplify the requirements, so that we do not have to implement the complex solution Martijn and I thought of16:51
kitblakenp, in general SchoolTool looks really promising16:51
* mgedmin is unable to separate privmsgs from public msgs in xchat with auto-open-dialog-windows disabled16:51
* th1a doesn't think the requirements will be that complex.16:51
th1aOK, let's just make sure everyone is on the same page about who is going to start what, when.16:52
th1aInfrae will be free to work on SchoolTool in earnest in about a month.16:53
kitblakeMartijn will do some time with Stephan in the coming weeks16:53
th1aThat will be good.16:53
th1asrichter:  We need to finalize your next proposal, right?16:54
th1aWhat's POV's schedule looking like?16:54
* th1a wonders when we should refactor sections.16:55
srichterth1a: but we will need the meeting on Thursday to do that, just so that we agree on complexity and direction16:55
srichterth1a: I think the term work will shake this up anyways, so that might be a good point16:55
th1asrichter:  I think we're both driving in the same direction.16:55
algaIt seems that 2 persons will be working on schooltool in the nearest future16:57
algaAistÄ— is away from office, so we're not 100% sure :-)16:57
srichterhe he16:58
th1aI'm flying to London on Saturday & traveling all next week.16:58
algaWe have national holidays from Thursday till Monday16:59
th1aSo if POV happens to want to start working next week, let me know soon.16:59
srichterwe have monday off as well here16:59
mgedminMonday is not off here16:59
algawe're OK to start working, we just need to flesh out exactly on what16:59
mgedminbut Thursday through Sunday is17:00
mgedminalga is using half-open date ranges, as is mathematically proper ;-)17:00
algamgedmin: "till-exclusive" Monday17:00
th1aalga:  OK, I'll work on the stories.17:00
algaWe'll try to estimate them ASAP17:01
th1aI think 'll be in a meeting next Tuesday at this time... since jinty probably won't be able to make the meeting either, perhaps we should skip the week.17:03
srichterth1a: Tom is POV continue to work on attendance or something else?17:03
th1asrichter:  Yes.17:03
srichterok, so that won't interfer with the term work that much then17:03
th1aNot really.17:04
th1aOK.  Let's wrap this up then.17:05
th1aLet everyone go to recess early.17:05
th1aHave a good week, folks.17:05
ignassrichter, unless some timezone bug will make us go out of path and fix broken stuff ;)17:05
srichterok, that is calendar stuff, which is fine too17:06
* th1a bangs the virtual gavel.17:06
srichterI just have a feeling that the term work will be very integrative and thus swap into other areas17:06
th1aIf you guys find yourselves sitting around in Vilnius looking for something to do, you can get started on some bugs.17:06
srichterwe certainly have defined this in the combination term, course, section and gradebook already17:06
srichter(we as in MArtijn and I)17:07
mgedminth1a, you're echoing my thoughts17:08
th1aRest assured that we'll pay you for bugfixes.17:08
tiredbonessrichter, Your more than welcome to stay here if you don't mine a house being built.17:09
th1aEspecially timezone bugs...17:09
mgedminyeah, those land mines intefrere with house construction17:09
tiredbonesThat goes for anyone else who wants to visit Maine.17:10
* th1a is going to be learning how to lay out and produce report cards using TinyRML and pdftemplate over the next couple days.17:12
tiredbonesMy fingers don't keep up with what I'm thinking and I'm not very good at typing.17:12
srichterth1a: I hope to see some results on Thursday :-)17:15
srichterth1a: have you gotten it to run already?17:15
th1aYes, I've got the samples running.17:15
th1aI think I should rough out the layout in HTML, to get the TAL right.17:15
th1aOnce I can do that, I'm not too worried about the RML itself.17:16
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shaprth1a: Got my slug-mail?17:24
srichterth1a: cool17:24
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flint_hi  gang i am stalking elkner through the entire chatspace...19:16
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SpecIs there a flint here?22:33
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