IRC log of #schooltool for Thursday, 2005-09-15

bskahansrichter: where do you find the problem?00:08
srichterfor some reason it uses this complex macro cosntruct00:08
srichterviewlets (i.e. pagelets. portlets) should simply be views00:09
srichterexcept that they are also registered for a slot00:09
bskahaneach with their own context?00:09
srichterthe context will be the same as for the view00:09
srichterthey should also have the view as context00:10
srichterso basically and adapter from (context, request, view, slot) -> IPagelet00:10
srichterso basically and adapter from (context, request, view, slot) -> IViewlet00:11
srichterall this macro stuff makes it *much* harder to understand00:11
srichterand this way we can get rid of the pagedata concept00:11
srichterbskahan: thoughts?00:13
bskahanlooking at it now00:15
bskahando we really need slots and viewlets?00:17
bskahanor is viewlet just one of pagelet or portlet?00:18
srichterI am on the phone with Roger00:21
bskahanin the current code each pagelet a single macro, correct?00:21
th1abskahan: I've been playing with the new site.00:38
th1aI replaced "Downloads" with "Products," and set up some categories: Calendaring, SchoolTool SIS, LiveCD's, Infrastructure Tools, Academic Tools.00:41
srichterokaaayy, got the scoop00:42
srichterwe can implement the pagelets using views, which is cool00:43
srichterso pagelets will work as described above00:44
srichterslots will become instances of a class called slots, which will make the adapter lookup cleaner00:45
srichterpagedata will go away, since we can do everything in the view class00:45
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bskahanth1a: cool, I just put the stuff in there as examples01:08
bskahansrichter: so we can use the current pagelets module without major changes?01:09
srichterwell, my changes won't be minor, but they are not major either :-)01:09
srichterbut we can pretty much reuse it yes01:09
srichterthe nice thing is that Roger is opkay with the changes and will change his Tiks code to use it01:10
bskahanwhat is Tiks?01:10
srichterThe first CMS for Zope 301:10
srichterthat projekt01 developed over the last 2-3 years01:10
srichterit has a lot of nice features that I wish some people would look at and evaluate01:11
srichtermost of them are irrelevant to us, since they are geared towards CMSs, but still01:11
* bskahan nods01:12
bskahanI remember it now that I see the site01:12
bskahanit would be really cool if we could use pieces from that easily01:12
bskahanschooltool the project may not do CMS stuff, but there's alot of interest in 'CMSy' features for addons01:13
srichterat least it is Zope 3,s o it should not be too hard to reuse01:15
srichteras I said, I never looked at all components01:15
* bskahan nods01:15
srichterbskahan: are you okay with the tasks I boldly assigned to you?01:19
srichter(especially the time estimates)01:19
bskahanthe CSS classes is probably pushing the timeline01:30
bskahanI'll be back in a few minutes01:30
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povbot/svn/commits: * ignas committed revision 4979:14:19
povbot/svn/commits: Removed dead code from CalendarViewBase.getEvents. (The variable was used before this function has been refactored)14:19
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SteveAjinty: hi.  do you know adam conrad?14:45
jintyalso hi;)14:50
SteveAso, adam is (i think) a debian developer.14:51
SteveAhe also works for canonical, on buildd infrastructure14:51
SteveAhe has an ubuntu ppc machine at home that he said you can get an account on for buliding a schooltool livecd14:51
jintyhe is willing to give me root acess?14:52
SteveAthink so14:52
SteveAi'll see if he's around now.  he's based in .au i think, so maybe not.14:52
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mario1how "stable" is the ressources management tool schoolbell?15:29
srichterI think it is more stable than most other software ;-)15:30
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mario1is there a debian sarge pkg? i have plone 2.1 and zope 2.8.1 but i dont get compiled schooltool (too many deps)15:32
mario1isnt it possible to integrate schoolbell into plone or schooltool.. so the users wont need to login twice??15:35
jintymario1: eventually i plan to start providing sarge back-ports15:36
mario1o i see15:37
jintyit is not in sarge for security support reasons, but should migrate to testing shortly after the Zope3.1 release15:37
mario1jinty, as i understood the idea of schoolbell its not book ressources.. its just an additional mini-feature right?15:37
mario1i just read (watched :) the pdf s ..15:38
* jinty thinks mario1 wants to talk to th1a_ about this15:39
mario1if th1a_ wants to talk too..15:40
mario1i need a tool for booking/reserving PCs in our school..15:41
mario1nothing more nothing less..15:41
mario1the schooltool page is very slow..15:49
jintyth1a_: schooltool 0.11.2?16:47
mario1cmon i need help16:52
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th1amario1:  I am now awake.17:05
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jintyth1a: do you need time for a coffee?;)17:06
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mario1th1a, as i didnt get installed schooltool/schoolbell on my debian sarge box i installed ubuntu now i have schooltool working..17:07
th1amario1:  OK, well, probably you should decide for yourself if it does what you need.17:07
mario1yes but which port does this tool use?17:08
mario1i dont see any instance of python in my ps..17:08
th1aPort 7080, I believe.17:09
jintyschoolbell is on 7180 by default in ubuntu17:09
erchacheyou can change it to 8017:09
mario1the pkgs in breezy are OK right?17:09
erchachemodifying schoolbell.conf.in17:09
th1aSchoolbell is 7180 and SchoolTool is 7080?17:10
erchacheor redirect throught apache with a rewrite sentence on httpd.conf17:10
jintyth1a: correct17:10
jintyso they can both be installed at the same time:)17:10
erchacheth1a jinty: who are writing documentation? i want to include upgrade process to it17:10
mario1i ve done apt-get install schooltool schoolbell but it didnt start and also no initscripts around .. hmm broken pkgs in ubuntu?17:12
erchachemario1: impossible i installed schoolbell yesterday via apt and runs ok17:13
th1aerchache:  I started setting up the new website yesterday.  I'll be adding FAQ & documentation stuff throughout the day.17:13
erchachehow are you accesing to your st site?17:13
erchachewhen you finish send me a mail it and i do a spanish translation17:14
th1aThe new site uses the system from
erchacheor send me a mail and download of svn17:14
erchacheahhh ok17:14
mario1erchache, i had to reedit my sources.list17:14
th1aSo you can edit it online.17:14
erchacheplone is good17:14
erchachemario1: :-?17:14
erchacheth1a: perfect!17:14
th1a"Plone Software Center" is even better.17:14
erchachecan you add me a publisher user?17:15
th1aJust give me another day to get the structure worked out.17:15
erchachewell, this sound good17:15
erchachewhen you finish your work....make me a account with publish permission17:15
mario1erchache, how can i log in as admin?17:15
th1aI think everyone will be happy with the new site.17:15
erchachemario1: user: manager pass:schoolbell17:16
erchachewell lets go to see it! ;-P17:16
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4980:17:16
povbot/svn/commits: Moved some very old branches into /branches/obsolete/.17:16
jintyth1a: I am hoping to upload the releases/live-cd's/packages to the ftp site.17:17
th1aDoesn't have the new skin yet:
mario1ok thx its working .. but i d be happy if someone could make sarge pkgs..17:17
th1ajinty:  We'll ftp the files.17:17
th1aAnd link to them from the Plone site.17:17
erchachemario1: are working...17:17
* jinty breathes a BIG sigh of relief17:18
erchachea release little older than newest but runs...17:18
* mgedmin about to switch trunks: /trunk -> /branches/before-srichter-refactoring; /branches/srichter-refactor/schooltool -> /trunk17:18
th1aBut the Plone Software Center product makes things much more organized as well.  It is what they developed to manage releases on the site.17:18
jintymgedmin: +117:19
* mgedmin clarifies: /trunk/school{tool,bell} -> /branches/before-srichter-refactoring/school{tool,bell}; /branches/srichter-refactor/schooltool -> /trunk/schooltool17:20
erchachewell i put my st server on production mode next week :-D17:21
jintyth1a: about an x.x.2 release?17:22
erchachei need a public ip and change university web portal to make a redirect17:22
erchachehehehehe....most fun are become on these days ;-P17:22
mario1erchache, could u pls mail me if its cetinokt@zhwin.ch17:22
th1aThere will be one.  Why do you want it?17:22
mario1erchache, if its done17:22
jintyI want to put as many optimizations as possible+translations into one for breezy17:23
jintywhich means soon17:23
th1aFine by me.17:24
mario1jinty, some german translations are missing right?17:25
jintyIt means porting the optimizations to the release branch, and committing the translations17:25
jintyboth of which I can't really do17:26
jintythough I can give the optimizations a try17:26
jintymario1: our integration with rosetta is not that good yet17:26
th1ajinty: You're just being pedantic about the translations.17:27
mario1jinty, what is rosetta?17:27
th1aI can commit the translations if you insist, but I don't remember how.17:27
mario1jinty, ldap / ads translations from zope isnt available for schooltool right?17:28
mario1i meant acl over ldap / ads..17:29
jintyth1a: have a look at
th1aWhich branch do they need to be committed to?17:31
jintythe schooltool ones to schooltool-0.11.x and schoolbell to schoolbell-1.2.x17:32
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erchachemario1: what do you want i email you?17:34
mario1erchache, the debian pkgs if possible..17:36
jintyth1a: af.po -> locales/af/LC_MESSAGES/school{bell,tool}.po17:39
erchacheanybody....i dont know who....are making debian packages of schooltool/schoolbell software....are you suscribe at mailing list?17:39
mario1resource conflicts are not handled right.. it shows just a notice but it should be disabled to book a resource twice right??17:39
jintyerchache: yes, I am17:39
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erchachemario1: suscribe to is the mailing list....and jinty inform there when a debian package are created17:40
th1amario1: We just warn the user at this point.17:40
th1ajinty:  What's that command for?  Do I do that for each locale?17:41
drwooIs there ay way to get a list of all current calendar events for a single user in schooltool?17:41
drwoo uh, ignore the current.17:42
mario1erchache, ok thx..17:42
jintyth1a: the format of the translations in the tarball is different from the translations in the repository. Eventything needs to be moved around.17:42
mario1th1a, how could i change this so it should be disabled to do so?17:43
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th1amario1:  You'd have to change the application code.17:50
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mario1th1a, and is it possible to add zope products into schoolbell/tool ?17:53
th1aZope 3 products, of which there are few at this point.17:53
mario1i just want a HTML page (if possible dynamic) for every resource for example with pictures and so on..17:55
th1amario1:  Zope 3 (and SchoolTool) uses Zope Page Templates, so if you're used to Zope 2 that should help.17:57
mario1ok perfect..17:58
mario1but where is the product dir?17:58
mario1i mean how can i get into ZMI?17:59
th1aWell, Zope 3 doesn't use those things.17:59
mario1oo sry for those stupid questions..18:00
mario1is the zope api stable (freezed?) so i could write my own changes??18:02
th1aThe Zope3 API?  It is stable.18:05
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4981:18:06
povbot/svn/commits: Switching the trunk: create a place for old schooltool and schoolbell trunks.18:06
th1aWe won't be changing the API on the stable branches of SchoolTool or SchoolBell, although (as you can see above) we're starting a new development branch for SchoolTool that will probably have changes in the API.18:07
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4982:18:07
povbot/svn/commits: Switching the trunk: moved trunk/schoolbell -> branches/before-srichter-refactoring/schoolbell.18:07
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4983:18:08
povbot/svn/commits: Switching the trunk: moved trunk/schooltool -> branches/before-srichter-refactoring/schooltool.18:08
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4984:18:09
povbot/svn/commits: Switching the trunk: branches/srichter-refactor/schooltool -> trunk/schooltool.18:09
mario1i ve done dpkg-reconfigure schoolbell and set RSERV to 99 .. and HTTP to port 80 but it trys to start it afterwards but that doesnt work.. (no error just no app runnin)18:12
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4985:18:14
povbot/svn/commits: Switching the trunk: fixed svn:externals on the old schooltool branch.18:14
jintymario1: schooltool runs as user schooltool and as such cannot use port 80. better to install apache and use re-writing. See the README18:17
mario1doesnt ZOPE support VHM in v3?18:18
mgedminit does18:18
mgedminwell, VH without the M18:18
mario1how could i use that instead of apache?18:19
mgedminyou can't use that instead of apache18:19
mgedminyou can use that together with apache18:19
mgedminwas that a cry of enlightenment, or a cry of pain?18:20
jintyenlightenment is my guess18:20
mario1jinty, r u sure?18:20
jintyre: guess18:20
mario1try again18:21
jintywell, then, pain18:21
mgedminsrichter's not here18:21
mgedminth1a, perhaps you would remember18:21
mgedmindo we require Python 2.4 for the next release?18:21
mgedmin(i.e. in srichter's branch which is now the new trunk)?18:22
th1aFor "SchoolTool 2006," i.e., the new trunk, yes.18:22
mgedmin'cause my buildbot says tests fail when run with Python 2.318:22
mgedminth1a, thanks18:22
mgedminI'll install 2.4 on the buildbot host18:22
mgedminhey, it is installed there18:22
mgedminhow do I tell schooltool's makefile/whatever to use it?18:23
mgedminor at least fail if the default python is not 2.4?18:23
mario1would u recommend any other solution for resource-booking which is zope based?18:24
jintyexport PYTHON=python2.4??18:24
mario1or do u know any other?18:24
th1aNot really.18:24
mario1and how about LDAP schooltool?18:25
th1aComing probably in a few months.18:26
th1aI almost had srichter start working on it, but it got pushed back again.18:26
jintymgedmin: or `make PYTHON=python2.4 xxx`? If that doesn't work, it's a bug.18:26
th1aZope 3 supports LDAP authentication, so it isn't a big job.18:26
mario1th1a, are all acls in zope available in schooltool or what has to be done?18:28
th1aI'm not sure what you mean.18:28
mario1as its in zope 2.8 + plone 2.118:29
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ignas_th1a, should pdf views care about timezones ?18:30
mgedminjinty, do you have an opinion about changing the makefile to say PYTHON=python2.4 (currently it says PYTHON=python)?18:30
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ignas_well they do not ;)18:31
th1aignas:  "Care about timezones?"18:31
ignas_as in - are timezone aware18:31
mgedminignas wants to say that PDF lists all event times in UTC18:32
mario1anyway good night ..18:33
th1aWell, that would be a bug.18:33
mgedmingood night, mario118:33
th1abye mario118:33
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mgedminit seems that the timezone support in sb is incredibly buggy :/18:37
jintymgedmin: -1, I would rather test if the python version is 2.x with x >=418:40
jintythere will be a python 2.5 one day18:40
jintythe old used to, I don't think the new one does18:42
* jinty must still make a list of regressions18:42
mgedminwaah, debian doesn't have libxml2-python2.4!18:52
jintyor are you more interested in python2.4-libxml2?18:53
mgedminbut it does have python2.4-libxml218:53
mgedmininstalling now18:53
mgedminwhy is there both python2.3-libxml2 and libxml2-pyton2.3?18:54
jintyone is a transitional package (libxml2-python2.4)18:55
mgedminah, ok18:55
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jintybecause the developer, when making his first package ignored python policy18:55
jintywhich says: pythonx.x-name18:56
ignasth1a, can you rebrand issues 379, 38018:58
ignasi don't know how important they are ...18:58
th1aHow difficult are they to fix?19:00
th1aWe've built in extra bugfixing time for this kind of thing, right?19:00
ignasthese two bugs would not take that much time, though i am afraid there are some hidden ones left :/19:01
ignasand urgency would shift the time when we will fix them either up or down ....19:01
th1aOK, "urgent" then.19:02
mgedminyay, buildbot is happy now19:03
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mgedminhey, 'make test ftest' only runs ftests for schooltool19:12
mgedminwhat about tests for schoolbell?19:12
th1aIn the new trunk?19:15
mgedminoh, I see -- src/schoolbell is just a shim for ZODB backwards compatibility19:15
mgedminit has no actual code and therefore no tests19:15
th1aWe should be able to create a SchoolBell package using zpkg, but it is a *low* priority.19:16
mgedminI like how the Makefile defines ZPKG=../../zpkg-tools/bin/zpkg19:18
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povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4986:20:27
povbot/svn/commits: Small refactoring: s/test_name/testdir_name/.20:27
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povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4987:20:32
povbot/svn/commits: Introduced a method that determines the name of a test (instead of scattering direct calls to all over the code).20:32
povbot/svn/commits: BTW Zope 3 uses str(test), while SchoolTool uses  This is entirely intentional (I prefer "package.module.class.method" to "method (package.module.class)"), but doesn't give optimal results when there are doctest files.  I intend to fix doctest file IDs.20:32
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povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4988:20:52
povbot/svn/commits: Fix IDs of doctests defined in text files.  Previously you'd see tests named20:52
povbot/svn/commits: README_txt README_txt booking_txt20:52
povbot/svn/commits: Now you'll see tests named20:53
povbot/svn/commits: schooltool/traverser/README.txt schooltool/app/README.txt schooltool/app/booking.txt20:53
povbot/svn/commits: The implementation of this feature is hacky, and I'm not entirely happy with it.20:53
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4989:20:53
povbot/svn/commits: Marked a couple of questionable things with XXXes20:53
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jelknertvon: hi tom!21:03
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povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4990:21:07
povbot/svn/commits: Moved the test safety net ( into a top-level 'testsupport' directory.  Taught the test runner to look for this new directory (somewhat hackily, I'm afraid).21:07
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jelkner__tvon: hi tom!21:08
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4991:21:09
povbot/svn/commits: Changed to use the new name_of_test function of the test runner.  Now when I run functional tests, I see which functional test is spewing that libxml2 warning to sys.stderr.21:09
jelkner__thla: and tom...21:09
povbot/svn/commits: * mg committed revision 4992:21:12
povbot/svn/commits: Get rid of that obnoxious error message on sys.stderr while running ftests.21:12
bskahanjelkner: do you have anyone besides tom and paul who should have sent an SSH key for svn access?21:12
bskahanthose are the only keys I've received21:12
jelkner__bskahan: no21:13
jelkner__i will later21:13
jelkner__does anyone know why i'm logged in 3 times and what to do about it?21:13
th1ahey jelkner__21:13
jelkner__thla: hey tom21:14
jelkner__do you know why i'm logged in 3 times?21:14
jelkner__i got kicked off the server twice21:14
jelkner__but it seems i'm still logged in21:14
bskahanif you have a registered nick you can kill jelkner and take the nick back21:14
jelkner__how do i get a registered nick?21:15
bskahan /msg nickserv help21:15
bskahanwithout the space at the beginning21:15
th1abskahan:  Where should I upload packages for ftp?21:16
jelkner__help REGISTER21:17
jelkner__i still don't get this21:17
bskahanth1a:<appropriate folder>21:18
jelkner__it says REGISTER <password>21:18
jelkner__where to i put the nick?21:18
bskahanit uses your current nick21:18
bskahanyou probably want to wait till jelkner expires21:19
jelkner__bskahan: but that's the problem, my current nick is jelkner__21:19
jelkner__funny, though, flint is still on this channel, and he didn't even know it21:19
jelkner__he's been on for weeks, i think21:20
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bskahanth1a: you can scp things into /home/ftp/pub/schooltool/<dir> and they will be availble via ftp21:20
th1aI presume I have permissions for that.21:21
jelknerthla: tom, have you heard from Tom (v) recently?21:22
bskahanth1a: yers21:22
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jelknercool, now i'm the one and only jelkner ;-)21:23
jelknerthla: tom, can i ask you a question about dave's request?21:24
jelknerand how to get it fixed...21:24
tvonjelkner: hey21:27
jelknertvon: hey tom, i was about to send you an email21:28
jelknerto check in and such21:28
jelknerbut it would be quicker here21:28
jelknerhow are things going?21:28
tvongood.  I'll send you a summary email this afternoon if thats okay with you21:30
jelknerbtw.  did you see dave welsh's email about the sections screen in schooltool?21:31
tvonyes, I saw it, I havent looked into changing it from cando though21:31
jelknerhe is really concerned about it and says it is difficult to use the way it is currently configured21:32
jelknerit is a schooltool issue, not a cando one21:32
jelkneri haven't seen it, but i was going to stop in to see him after this so he could show me what the problem is21:32
bskahanjelkner: what is the issue with it?21:33
jelknerhold on, let me bring up his email...21:33
jelknerhere is what he is requesting:21:35
jelknerChange the way a section appears in the sections listing:21:35
jelkner     Please list an instructor's sections by showing SECTION title, then COURSE title, then INSTRUCTORS21:35
jelkner     (currently list is reversed, showing instructors, course title, then section title)21:35
jelknerhe says the the way it is setup now is confusing21:36
jelknerthe already have four instructors with several courses and sections using it, so he knows what he is talking about21:36
jelknerthey already..21:36
bskahanthere's no builtin way to change that21:38
bskahanit's not a complicated change, but there are several places where it would need to be changed for consistency21:38
bskahanthe reason its better his way: each teacher has 4 sections of the same course, so the first value is just repetitive21:39
jelknerand he say's it is visually very confusing21:40
bskahanth1a: would that be considered a usability bugfix that could go into 0.11.2?21:41
th1aIf someone fixes it we can backport it.21:41
jelkneri was hoping to ask more about the feedback process in general for schooltool21:41
th1aOTOH, our intention in general was that people would navigate to sections via courses.21:41
th1aAnd there was some debate about whether or not there should even be a section index.  Apparently it is necessary, however, and needs still more attention.21:42
bskahanoh!, this is on the section index page21:42
th1aRight jelkner?21:42
jelkneri don't know, i haven't seen it21:42
bskahani hate that page, the course index is much more useful, imnsho21:43
jelknerbut i'll tell you what, i'll go to dave's today, and grab a screen shot21:43
jelknerthen i can send it in21:43
jelknerbut where?21:43
bskahanjelkner: mail it to the list21:43
bskahanor file a bug21:43
jelknerwhat to you use for bugs?21:43
jelkneri'll ask dave to create an account there today21:44
jelknerand i will too21:45
jelknercan i upload a screen shot?21:45
jelknerok, let me head over to the career center then, i'll check back in when i get there21:45
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mgedminbskahan, is there any reason why calendar.expand checks whether first.tzname() == last.tzname()?22:11
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jelknerbskahan: hi brian, dave submitted bug issue#38223:09
jelknerit only allowed on file upload23:09
jelknerso he showed the way it looks after paul fixed it in cando23:09
jelknerbut it is still broken in schooltool23:09
jelkneri have a screen shot with the schooltool version23:10
jelknerit does look very confusing23:10
jelknertvon: you still here, tom?23:18
th1aSo... couldn't Paul fix it in SchoolTool?23:30
th1aWe need to get that boy a contributor agreement.23:30
th1aIsn't that how this open source thing is supposed to work ;-)23:31
jelknerhi tom23:37
jelkneri was away for a bit23:37
jelkneryes, i would love to see that happen23:37
jelkneri'm eager to here how tom's code review goes23:38
jelknerthis whole process has been great for paul23:39
th1abtw, I'm putting a section for CanDo on the new
jelkneri wanted to figure out what to do with the sourceforge site23:40
th1aPlone Software Center is going to restore my sanity.23:40
jelknershould we do a "this site has been moved..."23:40
th1aOnce I'm done, that would be cool.23:40
jelknerwill do23:41
th1abskahan has to move the skin over.23:41
jelknerthis is working out so well!23:42
jelknerthe teachers at the career center are loving it.23:43
jelknermost important is that it is working for the kids23:43
jelknerthey are finding it easy to use and it is really motivational for them to be able to track their skills development23:43
th1aI'm going to be doing a poster presentation thing at the T+L2 conference next month.  I could use some pictures of happy people using CanDo.23:43
th1aAnd of Eldar and Paul.23:43
jelknerdave is the one to go to for that23:44
th1aI'll just have to start nagging him regularly, I guess.23:44
jelknerpaul and eldar i can work on, but they will have to send them to me.23:44
jelkneri'll get on that23:44
th1aI want to highlight the student contribution to this.23:45
jelknerand i'll help you nag dave ;-)23:45
jelknerok, time for me to get out of here...23:45
jelkneri'll send out one more email and then check in with you tomorrow...23:46
jelknertalk to you then...23:46
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