IRC log of #schooltool for Monday, 2005-03-28

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th1atvon:  Do you guys want to help maintain once we get it off POV's server?06:21
th1aYou've got much more Plone experience than they do anyhow.06:22
th1aYou'd be paid to do it, of course.06:22
tvonth1a: sure06:23
th1aThat'll make mgedmin happy.06:24
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bskahananyone know when ftests broke?17:09
bskahantvon: remember the little glitch in cal_daily style that causes the right side (forward) arrow to kirk out when the font size changes?17:37
bskahanI'm pretty sure its a mozilla bug, the behavior doesn't seem sane17:37
bskahanto test, C-+, C-+, C-+, C-017:38
bskahanand C--, C--, C--, C-017:38
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bskahanmorning everyone19:11
bskahanor some of everyone ;)19:11
th1aJust woke up.19:27
th1aWhere is everyone?19:28
* tvon shrugs19:28
tvonmaybe everyone is sleeping in19:29
bskahanno one from LT has been around today19:29
jintyeaster monday?19:29
bskahanjinty: good call19:30
* bskahan goes back to bed19:30
tvonI'm so charging double for this19:30
tvonbeing deeply religious as I am19:30
tvonWell, is there anything we want to cover anyways? or does everyone wanna skip it?19:31
th1aI feel like shit.19:31
tvonthe stories looked good from here, we'll work on some time estimates19:31
tvonthat sounds like a skip += 119:31
tvonWell, I'll be around should anyone need anything.  All-day events should be going in later today/tonight if anyone is curious.19:32
bskahanI have some questions about the stories, but they're all directed at persons not present19:32
th1aI'm going to have to have a shower and some tea before I can think straight.19:34
th1aI didn't get out of BWI until 1:00 AM on Saturday, and I haven't been right since.19:35
bskahanth1a: what happened?19:36
th1aBad weather in the south screwed up the whole system.19:36
th1aIt isn't so bad if you have two laptop batteries and a couple movies with you.19:37
th1aSorry about the confusion.19:38
th1abskahan:  I don't understand your question in the email.  Where do I call "terms" classes arranged by periods?19:45
bskahanth1a: in the workflow diagram19:45
th1aI do?19:46
th1aI'm looking at it, and I'm not sure what you mean.19:47
bskahan"Time Periods are now called Terms"19:47
bskahanbox to the right of "Start"19:48
th1aIn ST 0.x, a time period is like a semester.19:49
bskahanah, ok19:49
bskahanI thought you meant Period A, B, C, D19:49
th1aPerhaps I can force myself to work on the glossary this week.19:49
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bskahancaldav article, via mitch kapor's blog20:20
th1aYeah, I saw that.20:21
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th1atvon & bskahan:  You still around?20:57
tvoner, yup20:57
th1aA couple things I wanted to bring up.20:57
th1aIn SC, courses aren't going to know what term they're connected to.20:57
bskahanbut sections should20:58
th1aWhoops.  I meant sections.20:58
bskahanthey aren't going to know about term?20:58
th1aIn SchoolTool proper, they'll need to essentially activate and inactivate themselves automatically.20:59
bskahani was thinking a relationship between term <-> section20:59
bskahanso you could see all the sections for each term20:59
bskahanor is not having that part of the "not archival" aspect of STC20:59
th1aThat's the way it will be in SchoolTool, but I don't think we need the complexity in SchoolBell Calendar.20:59
th1aYeah, that's what I was thinking last night.21:00
th1aMake is simpler and more manual first time through.21:00
bskahanthe term knows its start/end dates though, correct?21:00
th1aRight, because you need it to make the timetable calendar correctly, and a few other things.21:00
th1aAlso, Courses can be super simple.  Just a title and a description.21:01
bskahanI'm not sure that associating section with term is difficult enough to warrant having to set each sections start/end21:01
bskahanwich would get tedious on course 3021:01
th1aI'm thinking they'll either be deleted or just get updated rosters.21:01
th1aWe should just make it easy to do either.21:02
th1aBut also, we aren't really expecting people to use SchoolBell Calendar for more than a year.21:02
th1aWe want to move them to SchoolTool next year.21:02
th1aSo we can be a little cheezy.21:03
bskahango to "Courses", choose "Chouse", Add "Section", in the section form "Pick the dropdown with a list of available Terms"21:03
bskahanthat sets the recurrence rule for the class, rather than having to do it manually21:04
th1aI'm thinking that there's only one active term, so you don't have to pick it.21:04
th1aWhen you set up the terms, you select one as active.21:05
bskahanok, can we do "Use active Term or specify recurrence"21:05
th1aIn this case, I'm just trying to find the simplest thing, so if it doesn't actually seem simpler, let me know.21:05
th1aError on the side of making it direct and simple up front.21:06
bskahanfrom a user perspective, I think adding the same recurrence pattern for 50 classes would suck21:06
th1aYeah, that's out of the question.21:06
th1aI think it should be like, go to sections index, hit add section21:06
th1aselect the relevant course from a list21:07
th1aadd a teacher and add students21:07
th1aIt will assume the current active term,21:08
th1aand when the admin switches to a new active term, it will show up on that term's timetable as well.21:08
th1aBut if that doesn't fit with the internal timetable implementation, we should do whatever is easiest.21:08
th1aI'd prefer if we didn't require the admin to set up the whole year right at the beginning.21:09
bskahanthat makes sense21:09
th1aThen they have to think about which courses change quarterly or by semester.21:10
th1aSet that all up at the beginning.21:10
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th1aThey'll need to do that eventually in SchoolTool, but I don't think we need it here.21:10
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th1aI'm also thinking that in SchoolTool, we're going to have to do something to create some kind of representation of each period in the term.21:11
th1aIf I'm making an assignment, I have to be able to say "this is due period c, day 123 of the school year.21:11
th1aAnd if that period is moved for some reason, the due date on my calendar should move, too.21:12
th1aIt seems to me that we can either do that by making the timetables much, much more complex,21:13
th1aor by allowing events to be tied to individual periods.21:14
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bskahandefinitely need a view of events relative to Term start/end21:15
th1aNot sure what you mean.21:16
bskahansimilar to "this is due period c, day 123 of the school year"21:26
bskahanor, a variation of21:26
th1a"a view?"21:26
bskahanah, you meant input21:27
bskahanthat's trickier21:27
th1aI'm not sure we're talking about the same thing.21:27
bskahanwould you care about the "day of year" vs. "day of Term"21:27
bskahanth1a If I'm making an assignment, I have to be able to say "this is due period c, day 123 of the school year21:27
bskahanthat's cut-n-paste21:28
th1aActually, the time is more likely to be changed than the day.21:28
th1abskahan: yeah, that's what I mean.21:28
th1aAlthough, if there is a snow day on day 122 or 123, the correct behaviour is hard to determine.21:29
bskahanprobably "the next occurance of the section"21:29
th1aWhat I'm thinking is, what if there's a 2 hour snow delay on day 123.21:29
th1aPeriod C will be moved.21:29
bskahansome schools cancel the first classes21:30
th1aThat has to be a manual operation.21:30
bskahansome condense21:30
th1aBut it would be nice if the due date moved on the calendar.21:30
th1aActually, it isn't so important that we'd need it for SC.21:30
* bskahan nods21:30
th1aAnd maybe not at all.21:31
th1aSomething to think about.21:31
th1aThe thing is, if you've got a day of the week and time based schedule, like in Europe, you don't consider these issues.21:31
* bskahan wonders how many man hours are wasted by obscure schedule21:32
th1aAmerican schedules are better.21:32
th1aThere's no question in my mind about that.21:32
th1aExcept perhaps for programmers.21:32
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th1aIf we are making the calendar the central view of the application, if we seem to be gravitating towards, we probably need to keep it accurate.21:35
bskahanI'm not into the idea of the calendar being the default view21:35
bskahanit just happens to be what we have21:35
th1aIt is an open question.21:36
bskahanI think it will be for STC21:36
bskahanbut not for ST21:36
th1aPerhaps a daily calendar about half the size of the current one.21:36
th1aA smaller calendar summary of today and tomorrow.21:36
bskahanthat would be good21:37
bskahanI was thinking a more task based view21:37
bskahan"Todays Assignments", "Todays Events (excluding recurring)"21:38
th1aWe'll probably end up using tvon's compressed event view.21:38
tvonI'd like to see some nice page of aggregated information I think21:38
bskahanhave to ask some teachers21:38
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tvonwell, I'd like to see that for the person view..21:38
tvonregardless of what is the front page21:38
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* tvon wants to get the compressed thing into the week view for 1.1 if possible21:40
th1atvon:  that would be nice.21:40
tvonalong with js tooltips for other things... need to get em working in IE first though21:40
th1aI need to go out into the rain and run some errands, since I've been out of town for two weeks.21:40
tvonaight, ttyl21:40
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bskahannot in the stories, but alloting time to making sure i18n works with sb 1.1 and STC ?.?22:21
th1aYes.  That needs to be in there.22:36
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