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| ignas | hi | 14:49 |
|---|---|---|
| bskahan | hey ignas | 14:55 |
| alga | bskahan: I've figured out the way to separate the SB and ST skins | 15:58 |
| alga | ST app does not have to inherit from SB app class | 15:58 |
| alga | since the code is duplicated anyway | 15:58 |
| alga | the SB class has to have an interface IWantASchoolBellSkin | 15:59 |
| alga | and the skin must be added if that interface is there | 15:59 |
| bskahan | alga: that makes sense | 16:00 |
| bskahan | I've been trying to move the schoolbell skin's menus and CSS into slot/pagelets so that the schooltool skin can overide just the part of the skin it needs to | 16:02 |
| bskahan | running into some annoying zcml errors in the process though | 16:02 |
| alga | yep | 16:02 |
| alga | I would be glad if more of our calendar views code was in schoolbell.calendar | 16:03 |
| * bskahan agrees | 16:03 | |
| alga | that would make it a more useful library for Zope 3 users | 16:03 |
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| bskahan | ignas: http://people.etria.com/~bskahan/person_view.png to close http://issues.schooltool.org/issue218 | 17:05 |
| ignas | +1 | 17:07 |
| ignas | oh | 17:07 |
| ignas | and please try a bigger picture | 17:07 |
| ignas | or i will open a new issuse :P | 17:07 |
| bskahan | heh | 17:08 |
| bskahan | was actually going to ask about that | 17:08 |
| bskahan | can we add image scaling back? | 17:08 |
| mgedmin | what's that toolbar at the bottom? | 17:08 |
| mgedmin | foaf, opml, google, doggy? | 17:08 |
| bskahan | foal, doap, gmail, beagle | 17:09 |
| bskahan | all seperate plugins | 17:09 |
| bskahan | the gmail one is actually useful, the foaf and doap have lost their allure | 17:09 |
| bskahan | beagle is a farce | 17:09 |
| bskahan | figuring out how to put a randomly sized image into the UI sucks a bit, would it be a problem if I port the old scaling code over? | 17:10 |
| bskahan | ignas: it will work with a large image | 17:11 |
| bskahan | it just won't be pretty | 17:11 |
| bskahan | well, | 17:11 |
| bskahan | it actually looks the the same, but that's because I constrained the img tag width to 48px, looks nice, loads slow with a 1600x1200 image | 17:12 |
| mgedmin | -1 for scaling on the server side | 17:13 |
| bskahan | sigh | 17:13 |
| bskahan | I was afraid of that | 17:13 |
| mgedmin | +1 for giving an indication of the recommended picture size in the upload form | 17:13 |
| bskahan | ok | 17:13 |
| alga | yep, useful insight | 17:14 |
| alga | I'm usually annoyed if the server scales an image for me | 17:14 |
| alga | and then compresses it as jpeg at 75% | 17:14 |
| bskahan | everyone here knows what 640x480 means though | 17:14 |
| alga | what do you mean? | 17:15 |
| mgedmin | phones? | 17:15 |
| bskahan | if I say 640x480,everyone here knows I'm talking about pixels | 17:15 |
| bskahan | and probably knows exactly what program on their computer can be used to get that | 17:16 |
| bskahan | I think many computer users have never cropped or resized a picture | 17:16 |
| alga | "ideally this image should be no bigger than 80 by 80 pixels" | 17:16 |
| bskahan | and have no idea what a pixel is | 17:16 |
| alga | maybe you're right | 17:16 |
| alga | we could provide a selection of stock avatars :-) | 17:17 |
| bskahan | I just watched a non-technical user emailing me an image | 17:17 |
| bskahan | explaining resizing (actually changing the image) was different than grabbing the corner and scaling it in word ... | 17:18 |
| bskahan | bbiab | 17:19 |
| alga | mgedmin: what about a conditional import of PIL? | 17:19 |
| mgedmin | don't we have more important things to do? | 17:19 |
| mgedmin | and a strict time limit? | 17:19 |
| alga | I won't be doing it anyway | 17:20 |
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| bskahan | tvon's going to be a few minutes late | 17:59 |
| GaryPoster | Hey--I have some questions/suggestions about the schoolbell iCal allday approach...but it looks like you all arre about to have a mtg? | 18:01 |
| ignas | well, meetings are for questions :) | 18:01 |
| GaryPoster | :-) yeah, but I wasn't on the invite list afaik ;-) | 18:01 |
| GaryPoster | OK, I'll fire away, I guess. if anyone wants to quiet me down, just let me know. | 18:02 |
| GaryPoster | I was shuffling around in schoolbell/app/browser/cal.py and saw this comment: | 18:03 |
| GaryPoster | # iCalendar has no spec for describing all-day events, but it seems | 18:03 |
| GaryPoster | # to be the de facto standard to give them a 1d duration. | 18:03 |
| GaryPoster | AFAIK, and I think I know :-), you specify iCal all day events by not specifying a time. | 18:03 |
| bskahan | I think that's tvon's comment, he'll be here in a few minutes | 18:04 |
| GaryPoster | Then, further, it looks like the code treats all day events as beginning midnight UTC, which is not an all day event... ok, cool | 18:05 |
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| tvon | GaryPoster: hey, in regards to allday events. Where is this information from? | 18:13 |
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| GaryPoster | Hey tvon. I'll (try to) look it up right now. I implemented some of this in an old project. | 18:13 |
| alga | meeting? | 18:14 |
| ignas | eek! | 18:14 |
| bskahan | th1a: ping | 18:15 |
| bskahan | bugday | 18:15 |
| tvon | afk a min | 18:15 |
| bskahan | http://issues.schooltool.org/issue26 is that applicable to current Z3 based code? | 18:15 |
| th1a | Whoops. | 18:16 |
| th1a | Sorry. | 18:16 |
| th1a | Here I am. | 18:16 |
| alga | bskahan: yes | 18:17 |
| alga | it's kind of obsolete | 18:17 |
| alga | although I don't know if z3 does OPTIONS right | 18:17 |
| th1a | Should have gone to bed before 4:00 am. | 18:18 |
| bskahan | http://issues.schooltool.org/issue201 can someone check that on IE? | 18:19 |
| bskahan | it seems closable in mozilla | 18:19 |
| th1a | bskahan: Thanks for getting things rolling. | 18:20 |
| bskahan | np | 18:20 |
| bskahan | alga: what are OPTIONS used for? | 18:21 |
| th1a | Is that a HTTP verb? | 18:21 |
| bskahan | th1a: http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec9.html | 18:21 |
| th1a | Scrolling back over earlier discussion... I'd rather not spend time getting images to work right. We've got other priorities. | 18:26 |
| alga | I agree | 18:27 |
| th1a | So http://issues.schooltool.org/issue219 still needs to be done? By bskahan? | 18:27 |
| bskahan | is that timezone migration? | 18:28 |
| bskahan | yes | 18:28 |
| bskahan | I got distracted | 18:29 |
| tvon | I have some Q's for POV on CSV importing | 18:29 |
| tvon | Looking at group csv importing, I currently am going at it by making a custom schema with the group title/description and and two additional fields (one for typing in a list of groups and one for uploading a csv). | 18:30 |
| tvon | Doing this requires rewriting most of what things like AddView provide because AddView only expects to be adding one object to the container and we need to be able to add many.. | 18:31 |
| tvon | my question is only, am I on crack or does this seem like the way to go? | 18:31 |
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| mgedmin | you don't have to use the AddView if it doesn't help you | 18:33 |
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| tvon | okay, cool | 18:34 |
| mgedmin | I believe adding an item to the group container does everything that needs to be done (posting Zope 3 events etc) | 18:34 |
| mgedmin | perhaps you need to manually send out an ObjectCreatedEvent | 18:34 |
| bskahan | 222 and 210 are duplicates? | 18:34 |
| tvon | mgedmin: yeah, thats what I'm doing right now | 18:34 |
| bskahan | at least the error part | 18:34 |
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| mgedmin | yes | 18:35 |
| mgedmin | 222 is 2 bugs in one issue | 18:35 |
| mgedmin | I was thinking about splitting it into two issues | 18:35 |
| mgedmin | now I won't need to do that ;) | 18:35 |
| bskahan | heh | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | tvon (and all): sorry, my IRC apparently didn't like my pastes :-(. to answer tvon's question: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2445.txt says... | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | 4.8.2.4 Date/Time Start | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | Property Name: DTSTART | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | Purpose: This property specifies when the calendar component begins. | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | Value Type: The default value type is DATE-TIME. The time value MUST | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | be one of the forms defined for the DATE-TIME value type. The value | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | type can be set to a DATE value type. | 18:36 |
| th1a | fyi, http://issues.schooltool.org/issue201 is fixed in IE for Mac. Do we have IE for Windows? | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | Mac iCal might not get this right; not sure. The first googled page I could | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | find with this in real life use was | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | http://lists.horde.org/archives/kronolith/Week-of-Mon-20031110/004076.html. | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | Logically, the “New year’s day” event begins and ends at a specific time only | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | (done) | 18:36 |
| GaryPoster | at rendering time—according to the timezone of the person asking the | 18:37 |
| GaryPoster | question—and no specific times may be established at storage time. | 18:37 |
| th1a | Is someone going to fix http://issues.schooltool.org/issue200 or are we just going to ignore it? | 18:39 |
| * bskahan ignores all references to 200 | 18:41 | |
| alga | well, it's not harmful enough for us to invest in it | 18:41 |
| ignas | and it is a Zope3 bug anyway | 18:41 |
| alga | and it is submitted to the Zope3 collector | 18:42 |
| bskahan | th1a: if you notice any pages that use view/update instead of view/update_status we could fix those | 18:42 |
| bskahan | (if that's a suitable workaround) | 18:42 |
| th1a | OK. marking 200 as deferred. | 18:43 |
| th1a | Anyone have KOrganizer handy to test http://issues.schooltool.org/issue100 | 18:46 |
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| bskahan | are we officially supporting the commandline client? | 18:46 |
| bskahan | http://issues.schooltool.org/issue120 could be marked 'wish' is not | 18:46 |
| bskahan | s/is/if/ | 18:46 |
| th1a | http://issues.schooltool.org/issue221 -- i18n in SchoolBell -- can be closed, right? But that leads me to a question: can we set up new translation files so people can get to work on this? | 18:47 |
| th1a | bskahan: perhaps it would be more appropriate to mark http://issues.schooltool.org/issue120 as deferred. | 18:48 |
| bskahan | th1a: ok, I'll do that | 18:49 |
| th1a | OK. I'm in favor of moving things to deferred if we have no intention of dealing with them. | 18:50 |
| th1a | http://issues.schooltool.org/issue62 -- many teachers for a single group -- isn't really relevant, except as a warning to make this work in the new implementation. Should I just leave it? | 18:51 |
| tvon | GaryPoster: are you on the mailing list? | 18:52 |
| GaryPoster | nope. Want me to be? :-) | 18:52 |
| tvon | actually, would you mind filing a bug about that at issues.schooltool.org so I can take a look at it later? | 18:52 |
| GaryPoster | will do. | 18:53 |
| tvon | thanks | 18:53 |
| th1a | I'm not sure what "ZMI find dialog hits error on PersonContainer" means for http://issues.schooltool.org/issue217 This seems more like a wish than a bug. | 18:53 |
| bskahan | if it just didn't find people I'd call it a wish | 18:54 |
| bskahan | but it raises a traceback in the ZMI | 18:54 |
| bskahan | in fact, it breaks the ZMI search entirely, iirc | 18:55 |
| th1a | So what needs to be done? | 18:55 |
| bskahan | th1a: that I'm not sure | 18:56 |
| bskahan | I haven't looked | 18:56 |
| th1a | alga: Is this still a problem: In the SchoolTool server only page rendering is protected, but URL traversal is | 18:57 |
| th1a | not. It should be. http://issues.schooltool.org/issue93 | 18:57 |
| mgedmin | I think it's not a problem any more | 18:58 |
| mgedmin | or is it? | 18:58 |
| mgedmin | can someone verify? | 18:58 |
| * th1a is afraid this meeting has been a complete failure. | 18:58 | |
| bskahan | mgedmin: its still a bug | 18:59 |
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| th1a | Hm... I'll have to think about how we're going to assign responsibility for these bugs. | 19:02 |
| * th1a bangs the virtual gavel. | 19:02 | |
| alga | this bug is not relevant any more! | 19:03 |
| bskahan | alga: you sound surprised ... | 19:03 |
| th1a | alga: could you close it? | 19:04 |
| bskahan | what does 'done-cbb' mean? | 19:04 |
| ignas | could be better | 19:05 |
| bskahan | ignas: thanks | 19:05 |
| bskahan | mgedmin: http://issues.schooltool.org/issue35 can that be closed? | 19:06 |
| mgedmin | it means that roundup's maintainers are <insert-negative-epitet-here> | 19:06 |
| mgedmin | (oops, lost an h there) | 19:06 |
| bskahan | heh | 19:07 |
| mgedmin | "what does done-cbb" mean is the most frequently asked roundup question, according to google | 19:07 |
| mgedmin | yet it is *not* in roundup's FAQ list | 19:07 |
| mgedmin | I think 35 can be closed | 19:07 |
| bskahan | closing it | 19:08 |
| mgedmin | we don't have an absence tracker in the new trunk yet, do we? | 19:08 |
| bskahan | no | 19:08 |
| th1a | No, so I guess we can close attendance tracking bugs. | 19:08 |
| th1a | Perhaps things like http://issues.schooltool.org/issue130 and http://issues.schooltool.org/issue62 that are for features that are being re-implemented could be marked in-progress? | 19:10 |
| bskahan | th1a: makes sense | 19:12 |
| th1a | OK. I'm going to do that. | 19:12 |
| bskahan | need a done-ddta status | 19:13 |
| bskahan | (done, don't do that again) | 19:13 |
| th1a | :-) | 19:13 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: you're right about allday events. | 19:13 |
| mgedmin | :) | 19:13 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: I've looke dinto this extensively for the calendar implementatino I was working on. | 19:13 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: you specify a range by not specifying the time, just the date, end not inclusive. that requires careful reading of the spec which is a bit ambiguous, but all clients I've tested do it taht way. | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | iirc mozilla calendar was buggy at one time | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | it treated dtend as inclusive, not as exclusive | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | but that might be fixed already | 19:14 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: I tested with Apple iCal, Mozilla Sunbird and KOrganzier. | 19:14 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I think so.. I tested this quite a bit, though I might've missed this. | 19:15 |
| faassen | mgedmin: but I did test quite a bit to verify it worked right. the confusing this is the UI typically includes the end as inclusive. | 19:15 |
| faassen | mgedmin: but the iCalendar data sent doesn't. | 19:15 |
| * mgedmin nods | 19:15 | |
| GaryPoster | faassen: right, agree. :-) client info is very good to know, excellent. are you still working on calendar impl., or merging efforts with schoolbell? | 19:15 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: working on a separate one, though I try to go with schoolbell if I can get away with it. | 19:16 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: unfortunately this needs to work in Zope 2 + Five and backporting schoolbell calendar wasn't working, I tried for a day or two. | 19:16 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: yes, I really don't want to have us build yet another calendar. GPL is prob. for us, of course, so schoolbell has to really win us a lot...Five: ah, I see. was it the UI in particular, or something else? | 19:17 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: well, this project is for Nuxeo and GPL too. | 19:17 |
| GaryPoster | ah, cool | 19:17 |
| GaryPoster | I meant prob. for ZC | 19:17 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: no, even the underlying schoolbell.calendar was too tied in to Zope 3 trunk. | 19:17 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: I understand, I prefer BSD myself. :) | 19:18 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: anyway, it shoulod actually have been released in beta form today but I don't think they have. :) | 19:18 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: but it should be released Any Day Now. | 19:18 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: most interesting might be the CalCore, whichi s basically just a python library pretending to be a zope 2 product when it finds itself in zope 2. | 19:18 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: oh--of course, I forgot you are on 3.0. makes sense. OK, cool, I'll keep an eye out for it. :-) | 19:18 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: that should be portable straightforwardly to Zope 3 trunk. | 19:18 |
| GaryPoster | hm, what does it provide? (built on maxm's stuff I assume) | 19:19 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: also interesting might be the iCalendar library, which is LGPL. that's MaxM's stuff. | 19:19 |
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| faassen | GaryPoster: it provides events that have attendees that can invite each other. | 19:19 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: right, I have a checkout of that now | 19:19 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: all day event handling, free time algorithsm to find out when there's space free for a given set of events. | 19:19 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: with full iCal negotiation semantics? | 19:19 |
| mgedmin | faassen, what's so z3-trunkish about sb.calendar? | 19:20 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: no, we haven't gotten around to iCalendar attendee support yet. | 19:20 |
| mgedmin | iirc we only use the component architecture, which I thought was ported to Five | 19:20 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: yeah, that's tricky, I think | 19:20 |
| faassen | mgedmin: oh, there's also properties, which don't work in Zope 2.7. | 19:20 |
| faassen | mgedmin: tons of properties. then there are various schema fields which don't exist. | 19:20 |
| mgedmin | ah | 19:20 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I'm not sure I'm only talking about schoolbell.calendar, I tried to port more. | 19:20 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I just tried very hard and couldn't get it off the ground. | 19:20 |
| th1a | faassen: I'm going to see Mark this week. As far as I understand, the issues are 1) do we want to move to an external dependency on an iCalendar library we don't control and 2) do we want to switch our iCal library to LGPL so we can merge some of our code with yours if appropriate. | 19:20 |
| faassen | mgedmin: as I didn't want to reinvent wheels. | 19:21 |
| faassen | mgedmin: we did follow your interfaces and we took your recurrent event implementation. | 19:21 |
| faassen | th1a: I am not sure whether 2) is extremely important, as iCalendar seems fairly complete. | 19:21 |
| mgedmin | sb.calendar is also a soup of components rather than a framework | 19:21 |
| mgedmin | you can choose and pick those components that suit you | 19:21 |
| faassen | th1a: though it might be useful if you want to put in a slightly higher level of abstraction into the iCalendar python library. | 19:21 |
| mgedmin | and provide implementations of others | 19:22 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I know, but you know, I tried very hard. :) | 19:22 |
| faassen | mgedmin: and we only got so far. | 19:22 |
| faassen | mgedmin: but I think I was more ambitious and also wanted to port the views. | 19:22 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I do not recall exactl now, it's been a month or two. | 19:22 |
| faassen | mgedmin: anyway, we also needed attendee handling. we still hope we can evolve towards each other again eventually. | 19:22 |
| GaryPoster | mgedmin: schoolbell doesn't do meeting negotiation, either, eight? | 19:23 |
| faassen | th1a: but the external dependency issue is the tricky one, yeah. | 19:23 |
| GaryPoster | eight==right :-) | 19:23 |
| faassen | GaryPoster: last I checked it didn't. the CPSSharedCalendar project does a lot with that. | 19:23 |
| bskahan | th1a: another issue to cover with mark is schoolbell.relationship possibly going into zope core | 19:24 |
| GaryPoster | faassen: Yeah, that was my impression | 19:24 |
| faassen | anyway, iCalendar is very flexible licensing wise. it's currently LGPL but if something more liberal is necessary, that's fine. | 19:24 |
| faassen | CPSSharedCalendar, it's harder to say. | 19:24 |
| faassen | Nuxeo tends to default to GPL. | 19:24 |
| faassen | but one can talk to them. | 19:24 |
| faassen | anyway, I'd be very interested in moving CPSSharedCalendar functionality into schoolbell. :) | 19:25 |
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| faassen | given appropriate funding definitely. ;) | 19:25 |
| mgedmin | GaryPoster, no meetings | 19:25 |
| mgedmin | faassen: yes, the views weren't designed to be reusable | 19:25 |
| faassen | neither are ours. anyway, we tried to stay close enough to your interfaces. | 19:26 |
| faassen | mgedmin: I need to study the way you handle recurrent events a bit more. we ended up having a separation between 'occurrences' of an event and the actual event. | 19:26 |
| faassen | mgedmin: which seems to be, looking at iCalendar clients, a common decision. I believe CalDav also does something similar. | 19:27 |
| * mgedmin nods | 19:27 | |
| faassen | mgedmin: you have a slightly mor involved story where an occurrence *is* an event, at least in the interface, and then proxy stuff. | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | if you found our interfaces inconvenient or cumbersome for certain use cases, I'd like to hear about that | 19:27 |
| faassen | mgedmin: in Zope 2 terms that would become too hairy, also because our interfaces are fatter, I think. | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | there are some not-nice wrinkles | 19:27 |
| faassen | mgedmin: yeah, I will look whether I can write up something about it all. | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | like that bit about reusing the event for its occurrence | 19:28 |
| faassen | mgedmin: we made recurrent events mutable. :) | 19:28 |
| faassen | mgedmin: right, we separated it out entirely, after long discussions. | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | it bit us later in view code where some events had an 'original' attribute, and some didn't | 19:28 |
| faassen | mgedmin: we just have occurrences which *all* have an original attribut,e and events which never do. | 19:28 |
| faassen | mgedmin: it worked out fairly well, the view code turned out to need very little adjustment. | 19:28 |
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| faassen | anyway, i'm chattering away, sorry. | 19:29 |
| * faassen will go quiet for a bit. :) | 19:29 | |
| bskahan | anyone know what happened to batching in zope core? | 19:37 |
| bskahan | there's a CVS attic in view-cvs | 19:38 |
| bskahan | the code still lives in the zope3 svn in the tracker though | 19:43 |
| mgedmin | I wonder if it is difficult to fix 'make' in schooltool trunk | 19:51 |
| mgedmin | /home/mg/src/schooltool/src/schooltool/tests/test_timetable.py: WARNING: TestTimetableException not in test suite | 19:53 |
| mgedmin | /home/mg/src/schooltool/src/schooltool/tests/test_timetable.py: WARNING: TestExceptionalTTCalendarEvent not in test suite | 19:53 |
| mgedmin | eek! who is making fun of the SB logo? | 20:01 |
| ignas | bad artist ! bad artist! no cookie ! | 20:01 |
| * mgedmin is referring to the abomination that is checked in into schooltool trunk as logo.png | 20:01 | |
| mgedmin | didn't we have a real logo somewhere in the old trunk? or was it too big to fit into the new design? | 20:02 |
| bskahan | heh | 20:02 |
| bskahan | there was no logo that day | 20:02 |
| bskahan | and I needed something to tell me when the new skin kicked in | 20:02 |
| bskahan | I'll check the real logo in soon | 20:02 |
| mgedmin | alga, why don't we use a simple zope 3 container for term and timetable schema services? | 20:57 |
| alga | I just moved the module and made minimal changes to make it work | 21:06 |
| alga | tts has a defaukt | 21:06 |
| alga | terms might just be a standard container | 21:06 |
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| * mgedmin notices i18n:domain="schoolbell" in schooltool's page templates and starts wondering about that | 21:24 | |
| bskahan | mgedmin: should be schooltool domain, correct? | 21:26 |
| mgedmin | probably | 21:27 |
| mgedmin | I'm very indecisive today for some reason | 21:28 |
| mgedmin | :-/ | 21:28 |
| bskahan | I think it should, the pages in the schooltool tree should only be there if they differ from schoolbell | 21:29 |
| bskahan | so they would be in a seperate translation set | 21:29 |
| bskahan | the 'schoolbell's in there are probably me being sloppy | 21:29 |
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| * mgedmin suggests getting rid of IAdaptableToSchoolBellApplication | 21:59 | |
| ignas | +1 | 22:01 |
| bskahan | amen | 22:02 |
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