IRC log of #schooltool for Wednesday, 2012-04-04

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th1aaelkner: You around?05:32
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th1aHi menesis, replaceafill, aelkner.16:31
th1aIs yvl off?16:31
replaceafillgood morning/afternoon16:31
th1aPerhaps he told me that on Monday...16:31
th1aaelkner:  Thanks for sending the clip from the README last night.16:32
th1aApparently we've got actual teachers in Thailand using the gradebook through SiD's company.16:33
aelknerthat's good to hear16:34
aelkneri hope the logic from the README file is clear enough16:34
th1aAh, I see from an email that yvl will not be here.16:34
th1aSo working on updating the book I noticed yesterday that the default page selection in the tabs view didn't make the last release.  Correct?16:36
th1a(I'm just trying to make sure I know what is going on...)16:36
th1aDo you know what I'm talking about menesis?16:39
menesistabs view was in..16:40
menesislet me check16:41
th1aOK.  Yes the tabs view is there.16:41
th1aThere is just another set of changes.16:41
th1aaelkner:  Would you like to start in the meantime?16:41
aelknerok, well, i got the section linkage part of the import to work, tested16:42
aelkneri coded the timetable part as well, but haven't tested yet16:42
aelkneri started to, but i fond out that the oldskin ui crashes even in the case of the old import16:43
aelknerby that i mean, going to the Schedule link from the section view, it crashes16:43
menesisth1a: no, calendar tab and setting default tab came after the release16:43
aelknerbut so far, i can only say that is the case of running from within a tests, using browser.serve()16:44
aelkneri need to try this out with live running app, oldskin16:44
th1aOK.  That will need to get in before summer, menesis, so either the final precise release or the first precise update.16:44
aelknerperhaps the problem has to do with the test setup16:44
th1aWe would know if the actual app didn't work, correct?16:45
menesisth1a: it is merged for precise release16:45
th1amenesis:  OK, thanks!16:45
aelknermenesis, do you know how i can tweek my buildout to run the oldskin?16:45
menesisaelkner: edit instance/schooltool.conf16:46
menesisedit instance/skin.zcml16:46
menesisand replace16:46
menesis  <include package="" />16:46
menesis  <include package="schooltool.standard" />16:46
menesisbut I have no idea what is available in the old skin. what was there before flourish, should still work, but what of the many new features is available, don't know.16:48
aelkneri got it to run under oldskin, thanks16:49
aelknerapparently, section view, Schedule action doesn't crash in live running instance16:50
aelkneronly testing it crashes16:50
aelknerat least i can test manually in the meantime16:51
aelkneri'll see what i can do figuring out the test environment16:52
th1aCan you see if replaceafill has the same problem?16:52
aelknerbut at the least, i'll get it to work testing manually and get the export to work16:52
th1aDo you guys have any thoughts about importing photos?16:53
aelknerreplaceafill would have to run the test himself inserting a browser.serve() after submitting the xls import16:53
aelknerbut he doesn't have to get into that if he doesn't want to16:57
* th1a notes that this is the sort of thing which should be fairly easy with a distributed version control system...16:57
th1aPhotos?  Bueller?16:57
replaceafillth1a, i'm not sure if the filenames idea would work16:58
th1aFetch them via http or just put them in the filesystem?16:58
th1aI guess it assumes you have access to the server.16:58
replaceafillhttp we can do, filesystem i don't know16:58
th1aRight... http might make more sense.16:59
th1aUnless we'd do something more complicated like letting you upload a zip file that contained all the photos.16:59
th1aWhich is probably not worth the bother.16:59
th1ahttp should be easy for us and doable for motivated schools.17:00
menesisdon't think adding photos to excel sheet is any easier than upload through the web17:00
th1aSchools that know they want to upload images in bulk should be able to put them in a directory on a web server.17:00
menesisunless you want the exported xls to have photos17:00
th1aYou kind of have to have a baseline of technical capacity to even know you want to do it.17:01
aelknermenesis, good point about the export17:01
aelknerwe always need to think about export whenever we do importing17:01
menesisto import a zip file, the photos should be named username001.jpg or something17:01
th1aWe have to think about it but we don't HAVE to do it.17:01
menesisthe same about a directory, or directory on the web..17:02
th1aIt is an issue though.17:02
th1awe do store the images in the zodb, right?17:02
menesisbut if they have a 100 photos named DSC0045.JPG without names, they have a problem...17:03
replaceafillth1a, using blobs yes17:03
th1aI guess we do have to have some kind of story for this.17:03
th1aCan you put photos in spreadsheet cells?17:04
menesiswe store them in zodb... but if blob-dir is set in configuration file, they end up in a blobs directory on the disk17:04
th1aUh... as files?17:04
th1aRegular image files?17:04
replaceafilli dont think so17:05
replaceafillmenesis? :)17:05
menesissadly, no17:05
menesisI have one image uploaded17:05
menesisand on the disk it is named...17:05
th1aI don't think there is any straightforward way to literally put an image in a cell.17:06
menesisso, the photos are efficiently stored on the disk. but not in a form usable outside zodb17:07
replaceafillth1a, to me the easiest way to do it is the big zip file17:07
th1aI think images should be a completely separate import/export step.17:07
replaceafilland maybe providing the user some way to map the photo with the user17:07
th1aAnd the convention should be image name maps to id.17:08
th1aExport gives you a zip file with all the images named after person id.17:08
th1aYou can import the same thing, just matching by id.17:08
th1aI don't think adding a second step there is a big deal, since the alternatives are also complicated.17:09
replaceafillnot from me17:10
aelkneras long as somebody who understands what to do does it, i can't object :)17:11
th1aI'm thinking this is a separate task.17:11
replaceafilli this for the october release?17:11
replaceafillor april?17:11
replaceafillor the middle? :)17:12
th1aNothing is for April at this point.17:12
replaceafillah ok17:12
th1aIt isn't a big priority, October.17:12
replaceafilli'd like to work on it17:12
th1aI'll give you the bug.17:12
th1aaelkner:  So you should be on course to wrap your task up this week?17:13
aelkneri believe so, yes17:13
aelknerbarring any unanticipated problems getting the automated tests to not crash17:14
aelknerperhaps yvl can help me with that issue early next week17:14
aelknerbut in the meantime, as i said, i can at least do manual tests17:14
aelknerand it's only the schedule tests that crash17:15
th1aIt would be nice if we could quickly determine whether the test crashing is strictly an artifact of your sandbox configuration.17:15
aelkneri'd need someone to reproduce the problem17:16
th1aCan't you push your current code to a branch?17:16
th1aJust a personal junk branch?17:16
aelknerdon't need to, the problem is reproducable with the trunk code17:17
aelknerthe old section import has timetable importing17:17
th1aOK, can we have replaceafill reproduce it then?17:18
aelknerreplaceafill, can you?17:18
th1aIt seems to me this sort of problem has come up before and ended up being something weird in your sandbox.17:18
replaceafillaelkner, what are the branches involved and what do i have to do exactly to reproduce?17:19
aelknerreplaceafill, you can use trunk17:19
replaceafilli have a trunk instance17:19
replaceafillwhat do i have to do to reproduce?17:19
aelknerjust insert a browser serve in sample_data.txt after the first successful Submit17:20
aelkneryou need to run the following command:17:20
aelknerbin/test -vs schooltool.export --at-level 2 -t sample_data.txt17:20
aelknerif you put the browser.serve() after the Submit, you will have the oldskin running17:21
replaceafillaelkner, are you talking about line 32?17:21
replaceafillusing line numbers is easier to follow :)17:21
aelknergo to any section and hit the Schedule link17:21
aelknerno, see the errors there17:22
aelkneryou have to go to the next one17:22
aelknerline 4217:22
replaceafillok, so i insert the serve() call in line 4317:22
replaceafilldoing it...17:22
replaceafilland now running the test command17:23
replaceafillok, i'm in http://localhost:8000/import.html now17:23
aelknergo to the first section for the first term17:24
replaceafill2006 Fall?17:24
aelknerwhen you hit Schedule from there, you should get: LocationError: (None, 'label')17:24
replaceafillaelkner, yes, i get the LocationError17:25
replaceafillit's because the new content providers17:25
aelkneryet if you import the file in question manually in a running instance, it doesn't crash17:25
replaceafillthey're only for flourish17:25
replaceafillwhy are we using the old skin for this?17:26
* th1a was going to ask that...17:26
aelknerwhen we did the flourish skin last summer, we didn't update the at-level=2 test skin17:26
aelknerif we did, then all of the automated tests would need to be rewitten17:27
aelknerwhich is perhaps why we didn't do it17:27
replaceafillimho, new tests should use the selenium test runner + flourish17:28
aelknerth1a, rewriting all the tests for flourish layer is something that we could do17:28
th1aPerhaps in this case we should re-write the test suite.17:28
replaceafilli'm talking "new tests"17:29
th1aThat is FOR THIS CASE.17:29
th1aNot everything.17:29
th1aPort the import tests.17:29
aelknerthe sample_data.txt file covers the import of the large test file17:29
aelknersuccess tests, so to speak17:30
aelknerthen we have other files for specific error tests17:30
replaceafilliirc, sample_data.txt was mostly a load test17:30
aelknerand now we'll have some more new files for the new feature tests that i'm adding17:30
replaceafillthat's why it was put in level 217:30
aelknerit's not just that file that is put at level 217:31
th1aMy pov is:17:31
aelknerit's the whole testing of schoooltool.export17:31
th1a1) we're never going to stop and spend 6 weeks re-writing all tests at once;17:31
aelknerthe importer, that is17:31
th1a2) if there is a problem with old tests and it is simpler to just write fresh new tests, do that.17:31
aelknerwhat if it is not simler?17:32
aelkneri can't say at the moment how i would test some files with oldskin and others with new17:32
aelknerperhaps it would be a similar project to when i broke up the selenium tests17:33
aelkneri'd have to look into that17:33
th1aWhat do you think replaceafill?17:33
th1aI REALLY don't want to sink up to our waists in this.17:33
replaceafilli'd write new selenium tests17:34
replaceafillwe need to keep extending that capability imo17:34
replaceafillnot using the old test browser17:34
aelkneri'll look into adding an stest layer to schooltool.export17:35
th1aYes, I'd say move forward.17:35
replaceafilland you'd be sure you have flourish available17:35
th1aJust get rid of crufty old tests.17:35
replaceafillnot fighting the old skin views17:35
replaceafillth1a, not get rid of them17:35
replaceafillth1a, add more17:35
aelkneryeah, we don't need to get rid of anyting17:35
aelkneranyway, i'll report my findings on monday17:36
aelknerthat's it for me17:36
replaceafilland from what i've found in the new gradebook tests, you end up with simpler smaller tests17:36
replaceafillseveral of them17:36
th1aOK.  Let's keep this moving aelkner.17:36
replaceafilli fixed the selectors in the cando gradebook17:37
replaceafilland also, i set up better data for a demo17:37
replaceafillyou could log in as teacher000 for accounting skills17:37
replaceafillteacher001 for drawing skills17:38
replaceafilland so on17:38
replaceafilli think that help dwelsh to see the whole picture better17:38
replaceafilland see the column labels17:38
replaceafillsome of them represent optional skills17:39
replaceafill(the black ones)17:39
replaceafillthere may be a better way to represent that, but i just followed the old cando skin :)17:39
th1aWhich teacher is that last one?17:39
replaceafillteacher007 too17:39
replaceafilli added a resource library for cando17:40
th1aPerhaps making required skills bold.17:40
replaceafillso it can have it's own css, resources, js, etc17:40
replaceafillth1a, i tried it, but i didnt like it :D17:40
replaceafilli'll show it to you17:40
replaceafillalso, i was thinking of hiding the total columns always in cando?17:40
replaceafillthey don't use those in the "current" version17:41
replaceafillthey won't need the absences/tardies columns either17:41
replaceafilland hiding these will take me closer to use the generic worksheet yvl has designed for this17:41
replaceafilland now, i'm no this one:|custom-style17:42
replaceafillhover the text input17:42
replaceafilli'm going to use that for the hover box17:42
replaceafilli've been also reading about the position function of jquery-ui, to add the left/right arrows to make the tertiary nav horizontally scrollable17:43
replaceafilland we could also use it for the menus17:43
replaceafillit has collision detection!17:43
replaceafillth1a, are you going to send the link to virginia after we have these last features in?17:45
replaceafillhover box and scrollable third nav17:45
th1aYes, but you might be better able to direct them to what you've done.17:45
replaceafilli think i can have them done today17:45
th1aWrite that up and send it to me.17:46
replaceafillah ok17:46
replaceafilli'll try to fill the others teachers two17:46
replaceafillthere are like 3 courses missing skills only17:46
replaceafilli can finish those ones too17:46
replaceafillok, that's it from me17:47
th1aYou don't have to go nuts on the examples.17:47
replaceafillyeah, what we have now is enough :)17:48
th1aWe don't even want them to look too closely at these because then they'll feel like they have to tell us all the things which are obviously not finished.17:48
replaceafillwe could send screenshots?17:48
replaceafillor put that warning before the demo link :)17:48
th1aThe point here is just to show that it exists and doesn't fall over.17:49
replaceafill"work in progress"17:49
replaceafillah, kk17:49
th1aSo actually clicking on it is good.17:49
th1aI'll explain it.17:49
replaceafillcool thanks17:49
th1aThere is an ongoing debate about what the schedule for this is.17:49
th1adwelsh keeps telling VA CTE that it won't be done until August.17:49
th1aBecause he's being conservative about it,17:50
replaceafilland he said the third week of april to see the first stuff17:50
th1abut I keep pointing out that we say we're going to deliver it a month after we think we really will, then everyone else will add a month to *that* and think it won't be ready.17:50
th1aSo it is head games, basically.17:51
th1aBut a sys admin somewhere did pretty quickly say that it was going to be a problem if it wasn't ready by August (which of course it would be).17:51
th1aAll the core functionality should be ready for testing by June 1 I think.17:52
replaceafillme too17:52
th1aWe're a little behind but yvl is going to take some of the tasks slated for aelkner.17:52
th1aI really had yvl working on non-CanDo stuff almost from here on out.17:53
th1aSo we can juggle that as necessary.17:53
th1aOK.  Thanks replaceafill.17:53
th1aOh -- don't forget the spanish screenshot, replaceafill.17:54
replaceafillwill create them right now17:54
menesisnothing to say17:54
menesiswas talking/designing/drawing17:55
th1aOK.  Good enough.17:56
th1aThanks guys.17:57
th1aHave a great week/weekend and Happy Easter!17:57
aelknerhappy easter everyone17:57
replaceafillhappy holidays guys17:57
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replaceafillth1a, zyt_19:18
th1ahi replaceafill.19:20
replaceafillth1a, is this ok:
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th1aaelkner: ayt?22:21
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