IRC log of #schooltool for Friday, 2009-07-03

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replaceafillth1a, ping21:59
replaceafillhey th1a, you have a minute?22:00
th1aWhat's up?22:00
replaceafilli have a demographics question that dwelsh told me to ask you or yvl22:00
replaceafillcando has some "demographics" attributes22:01
replaceafillethnic_code, ethnicity, state_report_id and grade_class22:02
replaceafillaccording to dwelsh last two are not demographics22:02
th1aGrade class changes from year to year, right?22:02
replaceafilland we were wondering if they should be moved to the new ST demographics machinery22:02
replaceafillit should change, yes22:02
replaceafillright now it hasn't been used22:03
replaceafillat least in dwelsh instance22:03
th1astate_report_id is definitely "demographics" in terms of SchoolTool.22:03
th1aI mean, "demographics" really just means, "some data about this person."22:04
replaceafillincluding "metadata"22:04
replaceafilllike dwelsh called those two attributes22:04
th1aWell, your gender is metadata.22:04
th1aYou can put any simple, unchanging data about a person into demographics.22:05
replaceafillthat leaves out grade_class, right?22:05
th1aAnd you should probably just stuff grade_class in there until we write a proper implementation this winter.22:05
replaceafilland new ST demographics stuff doesnt use ethnic_code because ethnicity is a list field22:06
replaceafillmaybe we can get rid of it, right?22:06
replaceafillcando has an ethnic_code attribute22:07
th1aA number?22:07
replaceafillthat is used mainly in the importer22:07
replaceafillno, a single character22:08
replaceafillwhen you send CSV data, you say "this guy is w"22:08
replaceafillmeaning White22:08
th1aRight, so you could just delete our ethnicity and make a new ethnic_code field.22:08
replaceafilli was thinking on rewriter the importer instead22:08
replaceafilland get rid of the ethnic_code22:09
th1aEither way.22:09
replaceafillcool, i'm going to move it all then22:10
replaceafillthanks th1a22:10
th1aI think the main point is to get rid of all the custom code if you can.22:10
replaceafillwe were looking for a section importer, but there is none!22:11
replaceafillthe "Import Sections" button imports timetables!22:11
replaceafillnot sections into courses22:11
th1aI guess that partly explains why it isn't documented on the form.22:12
th1aBut the .xls import should work.22:12
replaceafillyes, but dwelsh didn't like its complexity :D22:12
th1aIt's inherently complicated.22:12
th1aIt is a complex task.22:13
replaceafillhe's going with csv importing22:13
th1aSo you figured that out when you looked at the import code?22:13
replaceafillno, i showed him the sample_data.xls and he didn't like it22:14
th1aI mean, how did you even figure out what the csv import form did?22:15
replaceafillthe "Import Sections" form has info in it22:16
replaceafillbut says that it will import timetables22:16
th1aAh, that must have been added since I filed the bug.  ;-)22:16
replaceafilldo u think a "import sections into courses" could be useful?22:17
th1aOh, I see.22:17
replaceafilland i think the "Import Sections" should be changed to "Import Section Timetables"22:18
th1aIt looks like it still takes the enrollment, it just also requires a timetable.22:18
th1aWell, perhaps you could just make that optional.22:19
th1aDoes he have some format in mind?22:19
replaceafillbut how can we distinguish it?22:19
replaceafillcan i send you the google doc link?22:20
th1aI'm not sure you even have to have meeting times in the current version.22:21
th1aSo a whole row for each student enrollment in a section?22:23
th1aIs this based on the export format they have from somewhere else of just dwelsh's idea of what makes sense?22:24
replaceafill:) let me send you another mail22:24
th1aWhere is the section defined?22:25
th1aOne sheet per section?22:25
replaceafillah you already have it: Meeting w/APS Info Services re: CanDo exports and imports22:26
replaceafilli see you in the To: list22:26
th1aI guess what matters is literally what the format of the data they're giving us is.22:28
th1aignas designed the csv format to be optimized for programmatic generation from other sources.22:29
th1aNot human editing.22:29
replaceafilli see22:30
th1aThere are too many sections to do all that by hand anyhow.22:30
th1aSo it still may be easier to take whatever format they give us and just write a script to generate a .xls22:30
th1a(I meant .xls above)22:30
th1aRather than write views, etc. in SchoolTool to parse a different format.22:31
replaceafilland use the xls importer22:31
replaceafillscripts to spit xls data that the import can handle22:31
th1aThat *should* be more straightforward.22:32
replaceafillsince we would be using standard ST services22:32
th1aThe thing is that it would also be annoying writing an importer for a format that doesn't quite map to the way SchoolTool looks at things.22:34
th1aI'd rather write a text processing script to do that.22:35
replaceafillnot a view22:35
th1aThat's just my feeling.22:35
th1aAlso... it occurs to me that we might need to add support for linked sections to the .xls importer.22:35
replaceafilland now i'd have to add "new course attributes handling" to the xls importer22:36
replaceafilli only did it for csv importing22:36
th1aTechnically I don't think you'd have to use the .xls import to do the courses.22:37
th1aYou could file a bug for that.22:37
th1aNote that my programming advice is often wrong.22:40
replaceafilloops :|22:40
th1aI just think maintaining a text/format transformation is the simpler approach.22:43
replaceafilli dont like the "cando's own views" feeling22:44
replaceafilllike the one i wrote for importing course government ids22:44
th1aWe should be able to get away from that.22:45
th1aYou shouldn't do anything until you have the actual format the data people export in.22:46
th1aOtherwise you might end up doing two transformations!22:47
replaceafilli'll call dwelsh and tell him about this conversation22:48
th1aJust stress to him that this just needs to be a machine-sensible format.22:49
th1aIt isn't something a human should or will be typing or reading.22:49
moquist_1th1a: is there a schooltool demo that Joe could get into?22:50
moquist_1I had to take mine down yesterday.22:50
moquist_1It'll be back up ASAP, but not until next week.22:51
th1aAh... not really.22:51
th1aHe's not running Ubuntu?  ;-)22:51
moquist_1heh. doubt it.22:52
replaceafillmoquist_1, i have one but it has no data in it22:54
th1aMatt Burkhardt actually had one running on ec2.22:54
moquist_1replaceafill: would you be able to load in the test data22:54
replaceafillmoquist_1, sure, when do you need it?22:54
replaceafilllike yesterday? :D22:55
th1aIt might actually be clearer for their use to run the selenium script.22:55
th1aOr... I guess not.22:55
th1aEither way you get enrolled sections.22:55
th1aWe just don't have the sample attendance data we used to have.22:55
moquist_1replaceafill: now. :)22:55
moquist_1Ah...yeah, they probably want to see attendance-related stuff. That seems to be a hot-button issue for them.22:56
replaceafillmoquist_1, oops, not sure, let me try22:56
th1aWell, it is just letters and numbers in the grid.23:00
th1amoquist_1: I don't understand what they'll want their attendance data to look like.23:00
moquist_1th1a: me either23:00
moquist_1am I moquist now?23:01
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th1aI assume we'll have our somewhat regular attendance journal, and then import a bunch of data from Moodle, and create a third view that combines them.23:01
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th1a I assume we'll have our somewhat regular attendance journal, and then import a bunch of data from Moodle, and create a third view that combines them.23:04
replaceafillmoquist, hhmm the vm i'm using is really slow and importing the sample data is taking a while...23:08
th1aYeah, that's slow you down.23:11
moquistreplaceafill: same here, actually. it finished eventually. :)23:15

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