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| replaceafill | hey th1a | 17:30 |
|---|---|---|
| th1a | hi replaceafill. | 17:30 |
| th1a | How's it going? | 17:31 |
| replaceafill | i went over the authority | 17:31 |
| replaceafill | the blueprints authority | 17:31 |
| replaceafill | i estimated streams yesterday | 17:31 |
| replaceafill | 3 days | 17:31 |
| replaceafill | i think it's a bit "loose?" | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | but enough | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | for the feedback loop, etc | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | and i started on it | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | i assume she'll want it anyway | 17:32 |
| th1a | OK. Yeah. | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | i also added a new blueprint | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | to record the packaging work | 17:32 |
| replaceafill | it's usually 1 day | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | so i estimated it like that | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | well, we say it's 1 day | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | but in reality it takes more... | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | with all the updates, fixes etc | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | :/ | 17:33 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | i also created a diagram for the mobile app data model | 17:33 |
| replaceafill | what was that program we used once | 17:34 |
| replaceafill | to chart relationships | 17:34 |
| th1a | Pencil? | 17:34 |
| replaceafill | and stuff | 17:34 |
| th1a | Dataviz? | 17:34 |
| replaceafill | that's for UI mocking | 17:34 |
| replaceafill | ah, i'll check that | 17:34 |
| replaceafill | maybe it's worth to create a diagram for tomorrow's meeting | 17:35 |
| th1a | One of the things that got me the job with SchoolTool was probably a script I wrote using dataviz that introspected and charted objects in SchoolTool's data model. | 17:35 |
| replaceafill | instead of me just explaining (and getting everybody confused) | 17:35 |
| replaceafill | :O | 17:35 |
| th1a | Turned out to be way easier than actually DEVELOPING in Zope 3... | 17:36 |
| replaceafill | :( | 17:36 |
| replaceafill | anyhow | 17:36 |
| replaceafill | today i checked my notes | 17:36 |
| replaceafill | and noticed the importer bug | 17:36 |
| replaceafill | i'm taking care of that | 17:36 |
| th1a | Ah, right. OK. | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | oh | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | and about streams | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | i guess someday they'll land in core, right? | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | i mean | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | they're not rising specific | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | or ark specific even | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | right? | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | they can land in their ST core branch | 17:37 |
| th1a | Yes, they'll end up in core. | 17:37 |
| replaceafill | cool | 17:38 |
| replaceafill | i started adding them to rising until i wrote the key for the annotation :S | 17:38 |
| replaceafill | 'schooltool.stream.stream', wait a minute! | 17:38 |
| replaceafill | this should go core! | 17:38 |
| replaceafill | :P | 17:38 |
| th1a | Yeah. | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | i plan to have some UI for tomorrow for her to see | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | if we meet | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | probably not the relationship views yet | 17:39 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | but at least the landing page, search area, etc | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | ok | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | that's it from me | 17:39 |
| replaceafill | engergized! | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | energized* | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | oh | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | about the importer bug | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | i was thinking we should evolve people with 2 active levels | 17:40 |
| th1a | Yeah. | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | cool, i'll add that | 17:41 |
| replaceafill | that's it from me | 17:41 |
| th1a | OK, I have a data model issue. | 17:41 |
| replaceafill | hm? | 17:41 |
| th1a | I'm going to start with mocking up the new timed attendance. | 17:42 |
| th1a | First off, should I be thinking of this as just once a day or am/pm? | 17:42 |
| th1a | Did we reach a conclusion about that? | 17:42 |
| replaceafill | flexible option | 17:42 |
| th1a | OK, so yes. | 17:42 |
| th1a | Now... | 17:43 |
| th1a | OK, so we currently just have the time of the change which we store automatically, but there is no other time data for attendance, right? | 17:43 |
| replaceafill | define "time of the change" | 17:44 |
| replaceafill | you mean, evaluation metadata? | 17:44 |
| th1a | Well, I mean this is a blank slate currently, right. | 17:44 |
| th1a | Other than tracking the time of the evaluation. | 17:44 |
| replaceafill | sorry, i'm not following you | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | i'm not sure if you're talking about the date of the "period" | 17:45 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:45 |
| th1a | Anyhow... | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | or the datetime the evaluation was recorded | 17:45 |
| th1a | Now we're going to need to track arrival time and leaving time explicitly. | 17:46 |
| th1a | Which we have not done before? | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | correct | 17:46 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:46 |
| th1a | So, while we are at it, we should probably also deal with coming and going multiple times in the day. | 17:46 |
| th1a | Which is not that odd a case, if you have any kind of appointment during the day. | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | ok | 17:47 |
| th1a | So probably we need a list? | 17:47 |
| th1a | Or we could just limit you to three comings and goings (seems like enough). | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | it's kind of the same issue we have with comments, right? | 17:48 |
| th1a | Not really. | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | if you come and go, etc | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | isn't that history? | 17:48 |
| th1a | Well, could be. | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | you're changing the current evaluation | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | in my head | 17:48 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | to me it's a similar problem | 17:49 |
| th1a | Yeah, ok. | 17:49 |
| replaceafill | annotating current evaluation | 17:49 |
| replaceafill | not sure if it'll fly | 17:49 |
| replaceafill | but that's how i'd start | 17:49 |
| th1a | OK, that helps actually. | 17:49 |
| th1a | I'll work on the mockup. | 17:50 |
| replaceafill | cool | 17:50 |
| th1a | Thanks replaceafill. | 17:50 |
| replaceafill | thanks th1a | 17:50 |
| th1a | ayt replaceafill. | 21:16 |
| replaceafill | hey th1a | 21:36 |
| replaceafill | just got back | 21:36 |
| th1a | np | 21:37 |
| th1a | Just contemplating more of the implications of this attendance change. | 21:37 |
| th1a | First I thought about the whole thing as a rather fundamental reworking of attendance, to be more like a stream of events. | 21:39 |
| th1a | Which would be too much time and not really what we wanted. | 21:39 |
| th1a | But it sort of sends you down that path. | 21:39 |
| th1a | Anyhow, then I did a sort of table of which states change into which other states meaningfully. | 21:40 |
| th1a | Which need times, which would only be corrections. | 21:40 |
| th1a | This is also... kind of complicated, obviously. | 21:40 |
| replaceafill | i think you're overthinking it | 21:41 |
| th1a | Well, not if we were starting from scratch. | 21:41 |
| replaceafill | right | 21:41 |
| th1a | But yes, in this context. | 21:41 |
| replaceafill | yeah | 21:41 |
| th1a | Do you think we should just hard wire in fields for a student leaving and returning once per day/half day? | 21:42 |
| replaceafill | why is that necessary? | 21:43 |
| replaceafill | to record the leaving then returning back? | 21:43 |
| th1a | Well... | 21:43 |
| th1a | Yeah. | 21:43 |
| replaceafill | let's call AM/PM periods for now | 21:43 |
| replaceafill | they're two separate periods | 21:43 |
| replaceafill | and some schools will only use one | 21:43 |
| replaceafill | afaik Fran is not interested in history of the same period | 21:44 |
| replaceafill | she's only interested in the most recent score/evaluation for it | 21:44 |
| th1a | I'm just interested in calculating time. | 21:44 |
| th1a | I mean, that's all we *really* need to do. | 21:45 |
| th1a | If you select "absent-left early" you get two more optional fields for left and returned. | 21:46 |
| replaceafill | why is the returned one necessary? | 21:47 |
| replaceafill | i mean, why two? | 21:47 |
| replaceafill | if you're late, you get "time of arrival" | 21:48 |
| th1a | I'm just saying it seems like it is a common case. | 21:48 |
| replaceafill | common? | 21:48 |
| replaceafill | i'm not sure *they* need it | 21:48 |
| th1a | I mean, more common than it seems on first blush. | 21:48 |
| th1a | OK, if it is just a second field, it isn't a big deal. | 21:48 |
| th1a | ? | 21:48 |
| replaceafill | to me it should be like this: | 21:49 |
| replaceafill | we're going to have a AM/PM setting, right? | 21:49 |
| th1a | Yes. | 21:49 |
| replaceafill | to active one or both periods | 21:49 |
| replaceafill | in that screen i'd set start/end times for both periods | 21:49 |
| replaceafill | and just calculate against that | 21:49 |
| replaceafill | if you're late | 21:50 |
| replaceafill | calculate time of arrival vs ending time of the period | 21:50 |
| replaceafill | if you leave early, time you left vs starting time | 21:50 |
| replaceafill | or whatever :D | 21:50 |
| th1a | The thing is if you base it mostly around setting times and try to imply the codes, I think it gets more confusing. | 21:51 |
| replaceafill | why imply the codes? | 21:52 |
| replaceafill | the code should enable the fields, right? | 21:52 |
| replaceafill | if you set someone as Absent - Sick | 21:52 |
| th1a | OK, I didn't think you meant htat. | 21:52 |
| th1a | that | 21:52 |
| th1a | OK. | 21:52 |
| replaceafill | you don't get a time field (annotation) | 21:52 |
| replaceafill | only present - late | 21:53 |
| replaceafill | and left early will | 21:53 |
| replaceafill | it's dumb | 21:53 |
| replaceafill | it probably has flaws | 21:53 |
| replaceafill | but that was my first thought | 21:53 |
| th1a | No, that's fine. | 21:53 |
| th1a | I think that's sufficient. | 21:53 |
| th1a | But I'd just like to also let you return if you leave early. | 21:53 |
| th1a | It is just one more number. | 21:53 |
| replaceafill | well... | 21:54 |
| replaceafill | to me you could do it with history | 21:54 |
| replaceafill | but it's way trickier | 21:54 |
| replaceafill | ok, student comes back | 21:54 |
| replaceafill | you overwrite the left early score | 21:54 |
| th1a | Well, yeah, I was marching down that path for a while but it is too much of a complicated change. | 21:54 |
| th1a | No. | 21:54 |
| th1a | That's not what I mean. | 21:54 |
| th1a | When you select present, left early, you just get two extra fields instead of one. | 21:55 |
| th1a | If they come back it is still present left early, but you know they came back for a certain amount of time. | 21:55 |
| replaceafill | what i was going to say | 21:55 |
| replaceafill | after you overwrite | 21:56 |
| replaceafill | with present | 21:56 |
| replaceafill | you get again the time field enabled | 21:56 |
| replaceafill | to me, the evaluation just needs a "time" field | 21:56 |
| replaceafill | what we do with it is our issue | 21:56 |
| replaceafill | a "left early" followed by a "present" could be considered in a specific way | 21:57 |
| replaceafill | but i haven't thought of it | 21:57 |
| replaceafill | to me it's not necessary for Fran | 21:57 |
| th1a | OK... | 21:57 |
| replaceafill | we can ask | 21:57 |
| replaceafill | did you get the idea from talking to her? | 21:57 |
| th1a | So basically we're using the same time field we've always had but setting it explicitly to what the user specifies rather than clock time. | 21:57 |
| replaceafill | oh no | 21:58 |
| replaceafill | i'd annotate the score | 21:58 |
| th1a | Well, it just a question of how complicated storing one datetime actually is. | 21:58 |
| replaceafill | i'd keep the evaluation timestamp | 21:58 |
| replaceafill | that gives you when you scored it | 21:59 |
| replaceafill | not what it represents | 21:59 |
| replaceafill | what it represents for the user goes into the annotation | 21:59 |
| th1a | OK... I'm just saying have a second annotation for the left early case. | 22:00 |
| th1a | If that is throwing everything into a mess, I can drop it. | 22:00 |
| replaceafill | not really | 22:00 |
| replaceafill | as you say, it's just an extra field | 22:00 |
| replaceafill | the whole annotating the evaluation object can get into a mess and whe don't know yet | 22:01 |
| replaceafill | (i don't think it will btw) | 22:01 |
| th1a | OK. | 22:01 |
| replaceafill | time1 and time2 attributes :D | 22:01 |
| th1a | Yes. | 22:02 |
| replaceafill | these will be times btw | 22:02 |
| th1a | Yes, ok. | 22:02 |
| replaceafill | not datetimes | 22:02 |
| th1a | OK. | 22:02 |
| th1a | Thanks replaceafill. | 22:02 |
| replaceafill | ok, thanks th1a | 22:02 |
| * replaceafill goes to get lunch | 22:02 | |
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