| *** menesis has joined #schooltool | 00:10 | |
| *** mattva01 has joined #schooltool | 02:26 | |
| *** alga has quit IRC | 03:27 | |
| *** mattva01 has quit IRC | 05:27 | |
| *** aks has joined #schooltool | 06:27 | |
| *** yvl has quit IRC | 09:15 | |
| *** yvl has joined #schooltool | 09:23 | |
| *** aks has quit IRC | 09:47 | |
| *** aks has joined #schooltool | 10:18 | |
| *** aks has joined #schooltool | 10:18 | |
| *** alga has joined #schooltool | 10:53 | |
| *** ignas has joined #schooltool | 11:43 | |
| *** jelkner has joined #schooltool | 13:27 | |
| *** aks has quit IRC | 14:20 | |
| *** menesis has quit IRC | 15:10 | |
| *** th1a has joined #schooltool | 15:21 | |
| *** menesis has joined #schooltool | 16:06 | |
| th1a | hi menesis, yvl, aelkner. | 16:30 |
|---|---|---|
| jelkner | good morning th1a | 16:30 |
| aelkner | morning | 16:30 |
| th1a | hi jelkner. | 16:30 |
| menesis | hi | 16:32 |
| yvl | good morning :) | 16:32 |
| th1a | aelkner: I don't understand the dependency situation you mentioned in the email. | 16:32 |
| yvl | ouch... I thought I forgot something :/ | 16:33 |
| th1a | What is dependent on what and how does CanDo fit in? | 16:33 |
| aelkner | ok, the gradebook is no longer dependent on the journal, except in tests | 16:33 |
| aelkner | cando is dependent on the gradebook | 16:34 |
| th1a | Is the journal dependent on gradebook? | 16:34 |
| aelkner | no, it isn't | 16:35 |
| th1a | Why is CanDo dependent but not the journal? | 16:35 |
| yvl | CanDo is basically dependent on requirement, IIRC | 16:36 |
| yvl | journal does not requirement for storing grades... | 16:36 |
| aelkner | also, the gradebook because it does a 'from schooltool.gradebook.interfaces i prt IExternalActivity' | 16:36 |
| th1a | But the journal doesn't do that? | 16:37 |
| aelkner | well, that's what i decided, not to do that in the journal | 16:37 |
| th1a | It just isn't necessary. | 16:37 |
| th1a | ? | 16:37 |
| th1a | I'd say technically IExternalActivity belongs in requirement. | 16:38 |
| aelkner | IActivity has been defined in the gradebook since its creation | 16:38 |
| aelkner | so moving it to requirement would be a big deal, and for what? | 16:39 |
| th1a | I'd say technically IActivity belongs in requirement. | 16:39 |
| th1a | I'm not saying do it now. | 16:39 |
| aelkner | well, moving IActivity to requirment doesn't stop cando depending pn the gradebok package | 16:40 |
| th1a | OK, moving on... | 16:40 |
| th1a | As long as we aren't creating new cross dependencies, I don't care. | 16:40 |
| aelkner | i thought i was clear in my note that I wasn't creating new dependencies | 16:41 |
| th1a | aelkner: Do you understand why external activities are explicitly imported? | 16:41 |
| aelkner | in order to define an external activity and its source, one needs to import the interfaces | 16:42 |
| th1a | aelkner: The CanDo point confuses the issue. | 16:42 |
| th1a | I got it now. | 16:42 |
| aelkner | i brought it up in anticipation of an objection from yvl | 16:42 |
| aelkner | about inconsistency | 16:42 |
| th1a | It's fine. We're all happy. :-) | 16:42 |
| th1a | Phillies are winning, everything is fine. | 16:43 |
| * yvl begins to remember | 16:43 | |
| aelkner | and the comment in configure.zcml says that external activities are defined in the other package | 16:43 |
| yvl | there's a "soft" dependency of gradebook on journal | 16:43 |
| yvl | because you need to have integration code somewhere | 16:43 |
| yvl | either a separate new plugin, or in one of the plugins, gradebook in our case | 16:44 |
| yvl | I can't remember why the soft dependecy is implemented in gradebook and not in journal | 16:44 |
| aelkner | journal could, in thoery, be soft-dependent on gradbeook | 16:45 |
| yvl | well, it's a matter of choice | 16:45 |
| yvl | it baffles me a bit that "external" dependencies are implemented inside the gradebook | 16:46 |
| yvl | but then again, it does not matter that much for now, I guess | 16:46 |
| yvl | thinking back, it was probably bad judgment on my part | 16:47 |
| th1a | There's more of a model/view intermingling in the gradebook than there ought to be. | 16:48 |
| yvl | true, th1a | 16:48 |
| th1a | OK, moving on... | 16:48 |
| th1a | aelkner: Do you understand why external activities are explicitly imported? | 16:49 |
| th1a | By the user. | 16:49 |
| aelkner | the user doesn't import external activities, they create linked activities, using the 'New External Activity' button | 16:50 |
| aelkner | the code is what does the importing of the interfaces | 16:50 |
| th1a | I mean, you have to hit a button to update the scores. | 16:50 |
| th1a | You "import" not "sync." | 16:51 |
| aelkner | three buttons, yes | 16:51 |
| aelkner | that was my complaint in the note | 16:51 |
| th1a | Thank you for raising it. | 16:51 |
| th1a | We can make it one button. | 16:51 |
| aelkner | first, from the gradebook, the user has to know to hit 'Manage Worksheet' | 16:51 |
| aelkner | then click on the link for the linked activity | 16:51 |
| aelkner | then hit the 'Update Grades' button | 16:51 |
| th1a | I think we need to implement a javascript popup menu for gradebook columns. | 16:52 |
| th1a | Like a spreadsheet would have. | 16:52 |
| aelkner | a right-click menu, right? | 16:52 |
| th1a | Well, probably a little (>) icon you'd click. | 16:53 |
| th1a | Since we don't right-click anywhere else in the interface. | 16:53 |
| th1a | Right under the label perhaps. | 16:53 |
| aelkner | right now each colmn headng has two links | 16:53 |
| aelkner | one takes the user to a special activity gradebook | 16:53 |
| aelkner | the other is for sorting by the column | 16:54 |
| aelkner | but yes, we could add a '>' next to 'sort' perhaps | 16:54 |
| th1a | Well, we could replace the sort and put sort in the menu. | 16:54 |
| aelkner | ooh, good idea | 16:55 |
| th1a | This would change a lot. | 16:55 |
| th1a | "Add a column" etc. would go in there. | 16:55 |
| aelkner | we don't have popups anywhere else in the interface, do we? | 16:55 |
| th1a | No, but that's fine. We just need to make sure there's a visual cue. | 16:56 |
| aelkner | yvl, your thoughts | 16:56 |
| yvl | hmm | 16:57 |
| th1a | It is a UI change we can make without having complicated coordination with the overall UI change. | 16:58 |
| yvl | true | 16:58 |
| yvl | I'm just having trouble understanding what you want to do | 16:59 |
| th1a | aelkner raised an issue that prompts the solution to a larger problem. | 16:59 |
| th1a | In the gradebook at this point you can't do enough actions directly from the spreadsheet view. | 17:00 |
| th1a | You need a contextual menu for a column. | 17:00 |
| th1a | It'll clean up quite a bit of other cruft. | 17:01 |
| yvl | I see | 17:01 |
| th1a | A LOT. | 17:01 |
| yvl | can you give a few examples of what the menu should have? | 17:01 |
| th1a | Sort... | 17:01 |
| th1a | Update scores (external activity) | 17:01 |
| th1a | Add a column after | 17:02 |
| aelkner | edit, for title, category, points, etc. | 17:02 |
| th1a | Edit | 17:02 |
| th1a | yes. | 17:02 |
| th1a | Delete... | 17:02 |
| aelkner | instead of having to know to click 'Manage Workseet' | 17:02 |
| th1a | Move right or left | 17:02 |
| aelkner | ah, good one | 17:02 |
| aelkner | anyway, that's not currently on my task list, but i'd be happy to take that on after the sprint | 17:04 |
| th1a | Which sprint? | 17:04 |
| aelkner | i'd just need help creating the popup menu, because there's no example to draw on in schooltool yet | 17:04 |
| aelkner | ACC, May 20-22! | 17:04 |
| aelkner | boy, how easily we forget | 17:04 |
| aelkner | :) | 17:04 |
| th1a | It isn't my sprint. ;-) | 17:05 |
| yvl | as far as the implementation goes, there are few options | 17:05 |
| yvl | for one, aelkner could learn jquery :) | 17:05 |
| th1a | Yes, a jquery popup. | 17:05 |
| aelkner | yeah, that would be a good opportunity to do that | 17:05 |
| th1a | Maybe fsufitch can teach you how to do that. | 17:06 |
| yvl | alternatively, there could be a simple dropdown menu | 17:06 |
| aelkner | th1a, yeah, iwas thinking that maybe fsufitch may be able to help with that | 17:06 |
| aelkner | yvl, menu, where? | 17:07 |
| yvl | umm, as in - HTML element, [ select action V] | 17:07 |
| th1a | There would be a width problem with a normal HTML menu. | 17:07 |
| aelkner | where? | 17:08 |
| yvl | you're right th1a | 17:08 |
| th1a | OK, so... I do think we should address this after the sprint. | 17:08 |
| th1a | It will really clean up a lot of cruft in the gradebook. | 17:08 |
| yvl | by the way, I was just trying to think up options here - I like when there's something to choose from :) | 17:09 |
| th1a | np. | 17:10 |
| th1a | OK, anything else aelkner? | 17:10 |
| aelkner | nope, if there's no objection, i'll move onto the second journal data task | 17:10 |
| th1a | OK by me. | 17:11 |
| th1a | Let's move on to yvl. | 17:11 |
| aelkner | adding absence and tardy columns (hidable) to the gradebook | 17:11 |
| aelkner | anyway, that's it for me | 17:11 |
| yvl | ok, so things are going pretty well | 17:12 |
| yvl | for the most part of the last week I spent toying with Gimp and my whiteboard | 17:13 |
| yvl | so I've made up my mind on what I want to have, where and why | 17:13 |
| yvl | Gimp was for checking if stuff fits | 17:13 |
| yvl | there's nothing more annoying than drawing a concept and in the middle of implementation finding out that it simply "does not fit" | 17:14 |
| yvl | now I'm implementing... | 17:14 |
| yvl | viewlet managers and their sorting | 17:14 |
| th1a | I always get stuck trying to pick my wireframing tool... | 17:15 |
| yvl | I really want to spend enough time on that | 17:15 |
| th1a | Yes, the sorting is important! | 17:15 |
| yvl | well, Gimp does a good enough job :) | 17:15 |
| yvl | I want to use the same sorting for CSS and JS | 17:15 |
| yvl | and make Douglas a tiny bit happier :) | 17:16 |
| yvl | basically it's a play on our plugin sorting | 17:16 |
| yvl | you have adapter names | 17:16 |
| yvl | then you have before="" and after="" lists | 17:16 |
| yvl | sounds easier than it is ;) | 17:16 |
| yvl | and I think if implemented correctly, this will be more than enough | 17:17 |
| yvl | so this week I'll be playing with viewlets some more | 17:18 |
| yvl | then I'll move on to simple page implementation and basic CSS | 17:18 |
| yvl | using stuff from Ubuntu web dev guide is quite fun | 17:19 |
| yvl | makes everything pretty - instantly :) | 17:19 |
| th1a | Yes. | 17:19 |
| th1a | It is a big help. | 17:19 |
| yvl | true | 17:19 |
| yvl | I think this week I should continue freestyle work | 17:20 |
| *** alga has quit IRC | 17:20 | |
| th1a | Sure. | 17:20 |
| yvl | but I'd like to do some basic estimates... if not this week, than next latest | 17:21 |
| yvl | th1a, is there any timeframe in your mind? | 17:21 |
| th1a | Included in the next release. | 17:21 |
| yvl | :) | 17:21 |
| yvl | well, ok. | 17:22 |
| th1a | Which reminds me, we should all put the Oneiric release milestones on our calendars... | 17:23 |
| yvl | right! | 17:23 |
| th1a | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule | 17:23 |
| th1a | FeatureFreeze is... July 21? | 17:24 |
| th1a | August 11? | 17:24 |
| yvl | I think they haven't made up their minds yet | 17:25 |
| th1a | I'll check back. | 17:25 |
| th1a | Regardless, it is always a heck of a lot less time than you think. | 17:25 |
| yvl | so true | 17:26 |
| menesis | featurefreeze does not matter to us | 17:26 |
| th1a | yvl: I want you to think in terms of guidelines that aelkner and I can use to re-do problematic pages like the term index. | 17:26 |
| menesis | only to get new dependencies in | 17:26 |
| yvl | right, th1a | 17:26 |
| th1a | menesis: Well, technically, but we need to not be jamming things in either for our own sake. | 17:27 |
| th1a | I mean, the main view of a term. | 17:27 |
| th1a | I was shaking my head at that last week. | 17:27 |
| th1a | But we'll need to be able to get everyone grinding through views without too much fuss. | 17:27 |
| yvl | that's what I'm aiming at | 17:28 |
| th1a | Maybe we should plan, say, three weeks where everyone will just be working on re-doing views and posting screenshots daily. | 17:29 |
| aelkner | sounds like a good plan | 17:29 |
| th1a | Two weeks maybe. | 17:29 |
| yvl | beginning of June maybe? | 17:29 |
| aelkner | i was going to say that we would need tight integration of our work | 17:29 |
| th1a | June 6 - 17? | 17:30 |
| th1a | Virtual sprint? | 17:30 |
| th1a | May 30? | 17:30 |
| yvl | +1 for virtual sprint | 17:30 |
| th1a | Let's say May 30 - June 10. | 17:31 |
| yvl | sure | 17:31 |
| yvl | it's not carved in stone, yes? :) | 17:31 |
| th1a | That gives you three weeks. | 17:31 |
| * yvl has some paranoia developed when working on timetables... | 17:31 | |
| th1a | Douglas will be focusing on this too. | 17:32 |
| th1a | I think we can do it. | 17:32 |
| * yvl agrees | 17:32 | |
| yvl | that was plain paranoia | 17:32 |
| th1a | We'll just start from where ever you are. | 17:32 |
| th1a | But you'd better be ready. ;-) | 17:33 |
| yvl | agreed | 17:33 |
| yvl | :) | 17:33 |
| th1a | OK. Good. Thanks yvl. | 17:34 |
| th1a | menesis? | 17:34 |
| menesis | I had three days off last week | 17:35 |
| menesis | was in London | 17:35 |
| menesis | so not much done | 17:35 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:36 |
| menesis | created branches for 1.6 to make trunk ready for development | 17:36 |
| menesis | updated package management scripts | 17:36 |
| menesis | to see the status of lucid, maverick, and natty | 17:37 |
| menesis | added builders for that | 17:37 |
| menesis | also updating scripts for oneiric/unstable | 17:37 |
| menesis | now will start syncing packages between unstable and oneiric | 17:38 |
| menesis | I have to commit my ubuntu changes back to debian | 17:38 |
| menesis | and merge debian changes to ubuntu if that does not happen automatically | 17:39 |
| menesis | this is my main focus for this week | 17:39 |
| menesis | the other one is merging branches | 17:39 |
| menesis | there are still 2 or 3 aelkner's branches I haven't merged | 17:39 |
| menesis | will do now | 17:39 |
| th1a | Yes, we need to make sure we don't lose things in transition. | 17:40 |
| menesis | since a lot of development will be going on now | 17:40 |
| menesis | I personally would prefer not be responsible for merging branches into trunk | 17:41 |
| menesis | that all core developers commit/merge to trunk themselves | 17:41 |
| th1a | hm... | 17:41 |
| th1a | Well... we should have an approval step. | 17:42 |
| th1a | By menesis or yvl. | 17:42 |
| menesis | I will still be reviewing everything, but others would not be stuck waiting on me | 17:42 |
| yvl | I probably should start merging to trunk again | 17:43 |
| menesis | like it has happened this march and april when some finished branches are forgotten for weeks | 17:43 |
| menesis | ok it was a frozen trunk | 17:44 |
| th1a | menesis: You should have fewer other things to do now that we're in Ubuntu. | 17:44 |
| menesis | but now we are in full speed development | 17:44 |
| th1a | Let's maintain the status quo for now. | 17:44 |
| th1a | It is another reason we still need to feature freeze around the same time as Ubuntu. | 17:45 |
| th1a | Leaves us time to get everything reviewed and merged. | 17:45 |
| menesis | ok | 17:45 |
| menesis | I just have to do this job better | 17:45 |
| th1a | If we do merge requests through LP, we won't lose them, right? | 17:45 |
| th1a | Presumably they stay open? | 17:46 |
| menesis | yes, merge requests is very good for tracking unmerged branches | 17:46 |
| th1a | So as long as we do that, we should be fine. | 17:46 |
| th1a | The problem is just silently dropped email or verbal requests. | 17:47 |
| th1a | OK... anything else? | 17:48 |
| th1a | aelkner, send me an April invoice. | 17:48 |
| aelkner | sure | 17:48 |
| menesis | nothing else, don't think | 17:48 |
| th1a | OK. Thanks. | 17:49 |
| menesis | there are problems building PIL on Natty, also with bootstrap.py and zc.buildout | 17:49 |
| menesis | but I have no solutions yet | 17:49 |
| menesis | if `make` does not work, try `make BOOTSTRAP_PYTHON=python2.6` | 17:49 |
| menesis | and since we are not embedding images in PDFs, the PIL problems should not affect schooltool tests or running | 17:51 |
| th1a | I'm looking forward to replaceafill's report from EduJam. | 17:51 |
| th1a | OK, have a great week gentlemen! | 17:52 |
| * th1a drops the bag of gravel. | 17:52 | |
| aelkner | great week everyone | 17:52 |
| yvl | great week to you guys :) | 17:52 |
| *** ignas has quit IRC | 18:57 | |
| *** Douglas has joined #schooltool | 19:25 | |
| Douglas | th1a: just arrived to Panama :) | 19:26 |
| * Douglas reads the log of the meeting | 19:29 | |
| th1a | hey Douglas! | 19:35 |
| Douglas | hey th1a | 19:36 |
| Douglas | scary landing :/ | 19:36 |
| Douglas | wind and rain | 19:36 |
| th1a | Yes... you'll be taking a break from Cambodia for the UI sprint at the end of the month. | 19:36 |
| th1a | Little plane? | 19:36 |
| Douglas | yes | 19:36 |
| Douglas | well medium | 19:36 |
| Douglas | th1a: i wrote some rough comments trying to put together a report | 19:37 |
| Douglas | i'm going to send it to you so you can ask me to add more detail if it's needed, ok? | 19:37 |
| th1a | OK. | 19:38 |
| *** Douglas has quit IRC | 19:45 | |
| *** Douglas has joined #schooltool | 20:01 | |
| Douglas | th1a: sent | 20:01 |
| *** Douglas_ has joined #schooltool | 20:04 | |
| *** Douglas has quit IRC | 20:06 | |
| *** Douglas_ has quit IRC | 20:09 | |
| *** Douglas has joined #schooltool | 20:09 | |
| * Douglas would like to work on jquery stuff :P | 20:12 | |
| Douglas | virtual sprint! :| | 20:12 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:13 |
| th1a | Douglas: By "teachers with lots of work already assigned" you just mean "busy teachers?" | 20:16 |
| *** Douglas has quit IRC | 20:18 | |
| *** menesis has quit IRC | 20:29 | |
| *** menesis has joined #schooltool | 21:25 | |
| *** jelkner has quit IRC | 21:41 | |
| *** menesis has quit IRC | 22:26 | |
| *** Douglas has joined #schooltool | 23:03 | |
| Douglas | aelkner: zyt? | 23:03 |
| *** Douglas has quit IRC | 23:17 | |
| *** Douglas has joined #schooltool | 23:19 | |
| *** Douglas has quit IRC | 23:23 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!