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| aelkner | yvl: ayt? | 16:32 |
|---|---|---|
| yvl | yes, aelkner | 16:32 |
| aelkner | are we not meeting? | 16:33 |
| yvl | ouch, its meeting time | 16:33 |
| *** th1a has joined #schooltool | 16:33 | |
| * yvl runs off for a sec | 16:33 | |
| yvl | hi th1a! :) | 16:34 |
| *** dlobo has joined #schooltool | 16:34 | |
| th1a | good morning yvl, menesis, aelkner, replaceafill. | 16:34 |
| * th1a is running a bit behind today. | 16:34 | |
| replaceafill | good morning | 16:34 |
| aelkner | morning | 16:34 |
| menesis | morning | 16:36 |
| th1a | OK, any sense of when we can get yvl over here? | 16:37 |
| th1a | Flight-wise? | 16:37 |
| yvl | nearest reasonable date would be two weeks from now and roughly cost $ 1000 | 16:39 |
| yvl | if I fly in a month from now it could be $ 100 cheaper | 16:39 |
| yvl | personally I'd like to push the sprint to the latest reasonable time | 16:40 |
| yvl | but it's up to you, th1a | 16:41 |
| th1a | Latest? | 16:42 |
| th1a | When would you like to do it, yvl? | 16:42 |
| yvl | Feb 11th - 18th | 16:42 |
| yvl | that would give us ~ 3 weeks to clean up after sprint | 16:43 |
| yvl | before Lucid Beta | 16:43 |
| th1a | Ah yes, I should start marking those dates. | 16:43 |
| th1a | I could bring aelkner up here next week to keep him busy. | 16:44 |
| th1a | yvl: You'd rather not come up a week earlier? | 16:44 |
| yvl | I lack confidence that I'll have everything I want prepared by then | 16:45 |
| yvl | on my personal agenda, writing schooltool developers book is quite high up the list | 16:45 |
| yvl | and that would affect how tests are written a little bit | 16:45 |
| yvl | so that would be good to work on in a sprint | 16:45 |
| th1a | OK. Certainly the timing should be based on real concerns and not just "as fast as possible." | 16:46 |
| * th1a consults with Jennifer. | 16:48 | |
| th1a | She has a moderate preference for doing this during the week. | 16:48 |
| th1a | aelkner, do you have any feelings about timing? | 16:49 |
| aelkner | any time is good for me | 16:49 |
| aelkner | i don't have any conflicts | 16:49 |
| aelkner | obviously, the SLA conference impacts the timing | 16:50 |
| th1a | Just for you coming up here. | 16:50 |
| th1a | Next week. | 16:50 |
| aelkner | middle of week is fine | 16:50 |
| aelkner | can we not have me return friday? | 16:51 |
| aelkner | i want to be here when jeff arrives | 16:51 |
| th1a | aelkner, you are talking about an entirely different subject. | 16:51 |
| th1a | We'll settle next week later. | 16:52 |
| th1a | The question is the weeklong sprint with yvl. | 16:52 |
| aelkner | again, any week is fine for me | 16:52 |
| yvl | so, Feb 15-19? | 16:53 |
| th1a | Sounds good to me. | 16:53 |
| aelkner | ah, not then (only kidding) | 16:53 |
| th1a | And aelkner: Tue-Wed next week for you? | 16:53 |
| aelkner | right | 16:54 |
| th1a | In other news, replaceafill is weighing his job options -- he has a local offer, and with our increased budget I can pay him for the year. | 16:55 |
| replaceafill | thanks | 16:56 |
| th1a | If he can decide if he's joining us quickly enough I'll fly him up here too. | 16:56 |
| replaceafill | i've been working on a proposal for the vice minister of technology here in el salvador | 16:56 |
| th1a | Excellent. | 16:56 |
| replaceafill | i'll translate it and show it to you for ur comments | 16:57 |
| th1a | OK. Thanks. | 16:57 |
| th1a | How quickly do you have to make this decision? | 16:57 |
| replaceafill | they told me the last week of january | 16:58 |
| th1a | ok | 16:58 |
| replaceafill | but i've been talking to Marcela about it | 16:58 |
| replaceafill | and i'll shoot for the pilot | 16:59 |
| th1a | It is worth seeing if the government is receptive. | 16:59 |
| replaceafill | what if schools are really interested? | 17:00 |
| replaceafill | even if the gov says they pass | 17:00 |
| replaceafill | we can discuss this after the meeting if u want :) | 17:00 |
| th1a | Well, that's a call you'll have to make. | 17:01 |
| th1a | We can discuss it after. | 17:01 |
| replaceafill | ok | 17:01 |
| th1a | All right, let's have some quick reports... | 17:02 |
| yvl | ok | 17:02 |
| th1a | Make sure you've read: http://book.schooltool.org/htmlhelp/2010-proposal.html | 17:02 |
| th1a | yvl: How are things coming? | 17:02 |
| yvl | so, it's been a slow week | 17:02 |
| yvl | I'm still writing the access rights description tutorial | 17:03 |
| yvl | it lead to a small refactoring on security description mechanism | 17:04 |
| yvl | tutorials are good this way - when you start describing why code is the way it is, you start seeing design flaws | 17:04 |
| th1a | Sure. | 17:04 |
| yvl | also, I added small feature to schooltool.testing - you can now execute ZCML directive in your unit tests | 17:05 |
| yvl | * ZCML code | 17:05 |
| yvl | I think this will be helpful for the devbook: | 17:05 |
| yvl | writing the zcml directive to customize a page or some behaviour and have it executed as a test sounds useful | 17:06 |
| yvl | and basically - that's it | 17:07 |
| yvl | oh, and I answered (finally) Miss Thom's question | 17:07 |
| yvl | (and fixed a nasty bug in base.cfg) | 17:07 |
| yvl | easy_install is really annoying, when it comes to internal bugs | 17:08 |
| th1a | yvl: So do you still need an invitation letter to come to the US? | 17:08 |
| yvl | it definitely wouldn't hurt | 17:09 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:09 |
| yvl | thanks! | 17:09 |
| th1a | Just to bring with you or is there someone you need to give it to ahead of time? | 17:10 |
| yvl | just to have on board | 17:10 |
| yvl | but I think I need to submit travel details on-line | 17:10 |
| th1a | You're probably worried more about the US government than your own. | 17:10 |
| yvl | where I'll be staying, etc. | 17:10 |
| th1a | Times have changed! | 17:11 |
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| th1a | Do you remember Soviet days, yvl? | 17:11 |
| yvl | Iron curtain... again. | 17:11 |
| yvl | yes I do :) | 17:11 |
| th1a | You're not *that* young. | 17:11 |
| th1a | By the way, I'm not going to make you and aelkner stay in the motel next to the prison all week. | 17:12 |
| th1a | But I am going to make you share a room. | 17:12 |
| th1a | But unlike Ignas, you'll get to see some non-suburban parts of the US... | 17:12 |
| yvl | please go on?.. | 17:13 |
| th1a | iirc ignas's first visit was the definition of suburban hell, outside Dallas. | 17:13 |
| th1a | For PyCon. | 17:13 |
| aelkner | ignas did see dc once | 17:14 |
| th1a | True. | 17:14 |
| aelkner | after the galludet sprint | 17:14 |
| th1a | Anyhow, I'll put you guys up someplace where you'll be able to see the nice parts of Providence. | 17:14 |
| yvl | thanks, th1a | 17:14 |
| th1a | The only problem with that is that the nice parts of Providence are nice because they're more European. | 17:14 |
| aelkner | i like the sound of that | 17:14 |
| th1a | So it is a little circular for yvl. | 17:14 |
| th1a | Whereas ignas has gotten to see REAL America. | 17:15 |
| th1a | Highways and strip malls! | 17:15 |
| yvl | I heard stories ;) | 17:15 |
| th1a | Unfortunately, it IS what America looks like. | 17:16 |
| yvl | well, you can't cover ALL the land with high-population cities | 17:16 |
| yvl | it's not Japan after all | 17:16 |
| th1a | Well, we can discuss American geography when you're here. | 17:17 |
| th1a | In the meantime... | 17:17 |
| th1a | So before aelkner gets here and in time to discuss it next Monday, I need to sketch out the requirements for what I'm calling for the moment | 17:18 |
| th1a | "enrollment states for people." | 17:18 |
| th1a | or "for a person" | 17:18 |
| th1a | And then we'll break down that task at the sprint. | 17:19 |
| aelkner | what's your eta on that doc? | 17:19 |
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| th1a | I don't know. | 17:19 |
| th1a | When do you want it? | 17:19 |
| aelkner | could you make it a google doc and share it with me? | 17:19 |
| aelkner | whenever you are ready | 17:19 |
| th1a | Yeah, I can do that. | 17:20 |
| aelkner | even if it's not filled in, the scetched out version will give me a place to start thinking about what needs doing | 17:20 |
| th1a | OK. | 17:21 |
| th1a | I can probably just do that tomorrow. | 17:21 |
| yvl | maybe you want to try out Launchpad blueprints? | 17:21 |
| th1a | Actually, I guess we can use blueprints and Google Docs together. | 17:22 |
| th1a | I never knew where to actually put the text of the blueprints for blueprints. | 17:22 |
| th1a | You really want to park the main doc somewhere else -- like Google Docs. | 17:22 |
| th1a | So we can do that. | 17:23 |
| ignas | wave was pretty cool for collective writing... | 17:23 |
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| * yvl twitches :) | 17:23 | |
| th1a | Back in the day. | 17:24 |
| th1a | OK, aelkner, you've still got stuff to keep you busy for a week? | 17:24 |
| aelkner | yes | 17:24 |
| aelkner | i still have some gradebook bugs that are small in scope | 17:25 |
| aelkner | i got rid of two last week | 17:25 |
| aelkner | did you look at the screenshot i sent you | 17:25 |
| aelkner | regarding the report card layout view? | 17:25 |
| th1a | Not yet... I'll look at it now. | 17:25 |
| aelkner | basically, the add and "X" buttons are used to add and remove columns | 17:26 |
| aelkner | and they keep the view around | 17:26 |
| aelkner | the OK button is used to update columns or headings | 17:26 |
| aelkner | and that causes the view to go away | 17:26 |
| aelkner | is that what you were looking for? | 17:26 |
| th1a | That looks good. | 17:26 |
| aelkner | ok, good | 17:26 |
| th1a | Can you make the X box have a red background? | 17:27 |
| aelkner | is there any example in schooltool i can look at? | 17:27 |
| th1a | Are the changes saved before you hit "OK?" | 17:27 |
| aelkner | yes | 17:27 |
| th1a | All the other buttons that have red backgrounds when you're deleting something ;-) | 17:27 |
| aelkner | i can't think of any schooltool examples, and i'd like to be consistent with that | 17:28 |
| th1a | aelkner... probably two thirds of the forms in SchoolTool have red and green buttons. | 17:29 |
| aelkner | oh, that red | 17:29 |
| aelkner | never mind :) | 17:29 |
| th1a | THAT red. | 17:29 |
| aelkner | will do | 17:29 |
| aelkner | i finally got around to making cell ids predictable for your selenium scripts | 17:29 |
| aelkner | i changed it to use the __name__ of the activity rather than the hash | 17:30 |
| aelkner | since your scripts will create activities in a predictable order | 17:30 |
| aelkner | the cell ids will be predictable | 17:30 |
| th1a | Great. | 17:31 |
| th1a | So I just have to re-do those one more time. ;-) | 17:32 |
| aelkner | after you have the code, of course :) | 17:32 |
| aelkner | i've already made the merge request | 17:32 |
| th1a | Cool. | 17:33 |
| th1a | Anything else, aelkner? | 17:33 |
| aelkner | i started looking into catalog creation, using the cantact package as an example | 17:33 |
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| aelkner | this is for the intervention catalog we discussed | 17:34 |
| th1a | Ah, yes. | 17:34 |
| aelkner | i'm still dissecting the contact catalog code | 17:34 |
| th1a | You haven't really done catalogs in SchoolTool before, right? | 17:34 |
| yvl | we could move this to the sprint, aelkner | 17:34 |
| aelkner | right | 17:35 |
| yvl | catalogs really need generic code | 17:35 |
| aelkner | we could wait for the sprint | 17:35 |
| aelkner | amen to that | 17:35 |
| aelkner | but i can still benefit from reading and understanding what we have now | 17:35 |
| th1a | OK... | 17:35 |
| th1a | Does that mean that I have to give you something else to do? | 17:36 |
| aelkner | looking at bug list... | 17:36 |
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| aelkner | adding a request page for report cards is an obvious one | 17:38 |
| Lumiere | I did downtown dallas a month ago | 17:38 |
| Lumiere | I want to say sorry to anyone | 17:39 |
| th1a | Lumiere: Was it enchanting? | 17:39 |
| Lumiere | who has ever visited that place | 17:39 |
| aelkner | brb | 17:39 |
| th1a | OK... let's call an end to the "official" part of the meeting. | 17:39 |
| th1a | Have a great week, gentlemen! | 17:39 |
| * th1a drops the bag of gravel. | 17:40 | |
| th1a | replaceafill: Do you want to talk here or in private? | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | here's ok | 17:40 |
| replaceafill | ooohhhh little shake in here! | 17:41 |
| replaceafill | brb | 17:41 |
| replaceafill | wow! | 17:41 |
| replaceafill | that wasnt so little :| | 17:42 |
| th1a | What? | 17:42 |
| th1a | Earthquake? | 17:42 |
| replaceafill | yes | 17:42 |
| aelkner | just now? | 17:42 |
| replaceafill | little one | 17:42 |
| th1a | Does that happen often? | 17:42 |
| replaceafill | medium | 17:42 |
| replaceafill | small ones yes | 17:43 |
| replaceafill | but this one was mediums size | 17:43 |
| th1a | Scary. | 17:43 |
| Lumiere | aftershock from the Haiti quake? | 17:43 |
| replaceafill | you can tell is not normal if people leave their buildings | 17:43 |
| replaceafill | that crossed my mind | 17:43 |
| th1a | And they did? | 17:44 |
| replaceafill | yes | 17:44 |
| replaceafill | we have a huge building next to our appartment | 17:44 |
| replaceafill | and they always use the emergency stairs | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | that tells me is not a small one | 17:45 |
| th1a | Everything seems to be ok though? | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | anyway, it passed already :) | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | yes | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | th1a, can i work in some other small bugs? | 17:45 |
| replaceafill | yvl, is the zope.html 2.0 bug still relevant | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | the CK editor one? | 17:46 |
| th1a | Sure. Although you can work on dwelsh's CanDo feature too. | 17:46 |
| yvl | yes, replaceafill | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | th1a, ah! | 17:46 |
| th1a | I spoke to him about that yesterday. | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | yvl, i ask because of the changes in ZTK and all that :) | 17:46 |
| replaceafill | th1a, i should talk to dwelsh then | 17:47 |
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| yvl | well, it should work with ZTK we use now | 17:47 |
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| yvl | don't know if it is 100% compatible with ST | 17:48 |
| th1a | replaceafill: Unless there are still translation-related issues in SchoolTool. | 17:48 |
| yvl | and it would be nice to loose the F from CK | 17:48 |
| th1a | I'm kind of relying on you to smoke out as many translation bugs as possible. | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | th1a, yes | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | th1a, i've tested almost everything and translations look ok | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | in spanish | 17:48 |
| replaceafill | th1a, dwelsh just sent me an email to skype today | 17:49 |
| th1a | kk | 17:49 |
| th1a | So anyhow, getting back to working with schools in El Salvador. | 17:51 |
| th1a | I'm still working on the criteria, but larger government support will be a factor in deciding who gets grants. | 17:51 |
| th1a | (of which I expect there to be two). | 17:51 |
| replaceafill | ah ok | 17:52 |
| th1a | There of course are other criteria as well. | 17:52 |
| th1a | Like local technical capacity -- having a local Zope 3 developer will help. ;-) | 17:52 |
| th1a | Having the capacity to train teachers. | 17:53 |
| th1a | Or, at least users. | 17:53 |
| replaceafill | would it be possible for you to send a letter to the vice minister telling her "you're interested in deploying schooltool in el salvador"? | 17:53 |
| replaceafill | or something like that | 17:53 |
| th1a | I could. | 17:54 |
| th1a | Email me the relevant info. | 17:54 |
| replaceafill | i think that would make my case stronger | 17:54 |
| th1a | Sure. | 17:55 |
| replaceafill | th1a, the vice minister says she supports free software | 17:56 |
| replaceafill | but they have a proprietary SIS | 17:56 |
| replaceafill | in use | 17:56 |
| replaceafill | but schools are free to use any SIS in their day to day work | 17:57 |
| replaceafill | but they have to use the ministry SIS to report grades back | 17:57 |
| th1a | Yes. | 17:58 |
| replaceafill | but i know for facts that most of them still use spreadsheets to send their grades | 17:59 |
| replaceafill | not all of them use that SIS | 17:59 |
| replaceafill | and one thing that they lack is tech support | 17:59 |
| replaceafill | i also know she's interested in competency tracking! | 18:00 |
| replaceafill | and their SIS doesn't do that | 18:00 |
| replaceafill | they were evaluating proprietary software a while back | 18:00 |
| th1a | That helps | 18:01 |
| replaceafill | th1a, will cando be taken into account in the pilots? | 18:02 |
| replaceafill | i mean all the plugins | 18:02 |
| replaceafill | like interventions | 18:02 |
| th1a | Well... it will be a factor. | 18:02 |
| th1a | I mean, in Cambodia, we'll probably have a wide deployment that uses very little functionality. | 18:02 |
| th1a | Which is good in one way. | 18:03 |
| th1a | A small deployment that uses a lot of functionality is good in a different way. | 18:03 |
| th1a | A big deployment that uses a lot of functionality would be perfect -- and probably also kill us. | 18:03 |
| th1a | So it is a balance. | 18:04 |
| replaceafill | ah ok | 18:05 |
| *** Aiste has quit IRC | 18:07 | |
| th1a | In your case, a government backed pilot focusing on competency tracking might make the most sense. | 18:07 |
| th1a | And then also pitching SchoolTool in general to the schools that would like it. | 18:08 |
| th1a | replaceafill, Does that make sense? | 18:14 |
| replaceafill | yes | 18:14 |
| replaceafill | i still think that if the gov is not interested, schools will | 18:15 |
| replaceafill | but obviously that'd hurt our grant proposal :/ | 18:15 |
| th1a | It would be better with it. | 18:15 |
| th1a | Having focused goals is good though too -- I'd think you'd be more specific about what you were trying to do on a CanDo focused pilot. | 18:16 |
| replaceafill | my fear in a cando based pilot is teachers | 18:17 |
| th1a | Oh... yes... | 18:17 |
| replaceafill | some of them fear changes | 18:17 |
| th1a | Do you have enough computers for them to enter competencies? | 18:18 |
| replaceafill | well, most schools have computer labs | 18:18 |
| th1a | Anyhow, I have to go make lunch -- Jennifer's aunt and uncle are stopping for lunch, and it is a holiday here. | 18:18 |
| replaceafill | is not like every teacher has his/her own computer | 18:18 |
| replaceafill | ah ok | 18:18 |
| replaceafill | i'll send you an email with my thoughts, ok? | 18:18 |
| th1a | So think about whether you're aiming at something that's really going to have teachers entering things or whether this is still primarily used in the main office. | 18:19 |
| th1a | Yes, send me an email. | 18:19 |
| th1a | Talk to you later. | 18:19 |
| replaceafill | thanks th1a | 18:19 |
| replaceafill | it wasn't small... 6.0 :S http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/Quakes/us2010rqb3.php | 18:23 |
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| th1a_ | aelkner: ayt? | 22:33 |
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