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| Bert_2 | Hi, can I find a demo version of schooltool somewhere, I'd like to have a look at it without installing yet | 12:50 |
|---|---|---|
| Bert_2 | ??? | 12:57 |
| ignas | Bert_2: nope | 13:33 |
| ignas | there aren't any i am afraid | 13:33 |
| Bert_2 | too bad :( | 13:47 |
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| Lumiere | hi jelkner | 19:54 |
| jelkner | Lumiere: i'm in a meeting on #sugar-meeting | 19:58 |
| Lumiere | k | 20:00 |
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| th1a | replaceafill: ayt? | 20:18 |
| replaceafill | th1a, yes | 20:18 |
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| th1a | has moquist spoken to you? | 20:18 |
| th1a | Or emailed you? | 20:18 |
| replaceafill | no, not yet | 20:19 |
| th1a | OK. I should probably try to get you in the loop here... | 20:19 |
| th1a | I have to go afk for about five minutes. | 20:19 |
| th1a | Will you be around. | 20:20 |
| th1a | ? | 20:20 |
| replaceafill | yes | 20:20 |
| th1a | OK brb. | 20:20 |
| replaceafill | ok | 20:20 |
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| * menesis successfully upgraded schooltool.org server to hardy | 20:24 | |
| Lumiere | menesis: lol | 20:27 |
| Lumiere | menesis: are you available for a couple minutes tomorrow morning my time ( about the time the monday dev meeting would happen ) | 20:28 |
| Lumiere | menesis: so I can do the svn tweaks I need to with you | 20:28 |
| th1a | replaceafill: OK, so here's the situation. | 20:32 |
| replaceafill | yes? | 20:33 |
| th1a | moquist has been talking to this school in Escondido, California about some SchoolTool/Moodle integration. | 20:33 |
| th1a | He had some kind of vague discussions with them and then yesterday they suddenly realized that they had to spend all their remaining grant money before the end of the month, and that the deliverables would be due July 1. | 20:34 |
| th1a | So moquist has to come up with a contract, like, tomorrow. | 20:34 |
| th1a | Not to mention trying to even figure out what the requirements actually are. | 20:34 |
| Lumiere | oO | 20:34 |
| Lumiere | th1a: nuts... totally nuts | 20:35 |
| th1a | But, they have $10,000 - $16,000 to spend (still working on exactly how much). | 20:35 |
| th1a | SCHOOLS! | 20:35 |
| replaceafill | :) | 20:35 |
| th1a | Also, moquist has a regular job, so I'm trying to help pull this together. | 20:35 |
| th1a | So this would be involving mnet, which is Moodle's XML-RPC system. | 20:36 |
| replaceafill | i read the moodle + mahara integration doc that moquist sent on monday | 20:36 |
| replaceafill | i guess something like that is needed for schooltool, right? | 20:36 |
| th1a | The current plan is that another friend of moquist's will implement the weirdnesses that Moodle uses on top of XML-RPC as WSGI middleware. | 20:37 |
| th1a | So SchoolTool will just be doing XML-RPC and the middleware will be doing some kind of crazy SSL key juggling that mnet requires. | 20:37 |
| th1a | The actual functionality will involve moving enrollment (who is in what section), gradebook and attendance information between the two. | 20:39 |
| replaceafill | hhmm attendance, that's the journal, right? | 20:39 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:39 |
| th1a | So the big question is how busy you are next month? | 20:40 |
| replaceafill | well, i'll be working in cando | 20:40 |
| replaceafill | but i'm thinking of leaving my current job here at cdc | 20:41 |
| replaceafill | if this moodle task comes up | 20:41 |
| replaceafill | so, i think i'll have time | 20:41 |
| th1a | OK... | 20:41 |
| replaceafill | and if it's just xmlrpc from schooltool | 20:42 |
| replaceafill | i'm familiar with it | 20:42 |
| th1a | And to. | 20:42 |
| replaceafill | ah yes | 20:42 |
| replaceafill | back and forth | 20:42 |
| th1a | It is unclear how much of this is just triggered by cron jobs. | 20:42 |
| th1a | Also the tricker parts become the extra steps to make sure that the messages are received and successfully completed. | 20:43 |
| th1a | Right now the main users of mnet are Moodle and a portfolio system, so at some point someone is going to have to figure out exactly what they're doing. | 20:44 |
| replaceafill | is that system mahara? | 20:44 |
| th1a | Yes. | 20:44 |
| th1a | Do you know it? | 20:44 |
| replaceafill | i read the 37 pages doc moquist sent on monday | 20:45 |
| th1a | Ah. | 20:45 |
| replaceafill | it's about how to integrate both of them | 20:45 |
| th1a | Perhaps I did not read the right document. | 20:45 |
| replaceafill | why? | 20:46 |
| th1a | Do you know what triggers an exchange of messages? | 20:46 |
| replaceafill | no, the doc is mostly for users | 20:47 |
| th1a | Ah, ok. | 20:47 |
| th1a | Perhaps I did skim through it. | 20:47 |
| replaceafill | check here, fill this, enable that | 20:47 |
| menesis | Lumiere: yes, will be available tomorrow after 13:00 UTC | 20:47 |
| th1a | Well, if SchoolTool has to send a message whenever an event occurs in SchoolTool, that can be a pain. | 20:47 |
| th1a | It is easier to have another process deal with that. | 20:48 |
| replaceafill | you mean a pain in performance? | 20:48 |
| replaceafill | or to code it? | 20:49 |
| moquist | th1a: about to send an email | 20:49 |
| th1a | Well, you need to spawn a new thread or something. | 20:49 |
| th1a | I'm not saying it is impossible, but it is more fiddly than you'd hope. | 20:50 |
| th1a | replaceafill: I forwarded moquist's email to you. | 20:59 |
| replaceafill | yes, reading it right now | 20:59 |
| replaceafill | (o) get enrollment data from SchoolTool | 20:59 |
| replaceafill | (_) send enrollment data to SchoolTool | 21:00 |
| replaceafill | that would be cool :) | 21:00 |
| th1a | moquist: To get this done in a month it will be a bit less of a general, easy for anyone to install solution than you'd like. | 21:01 |
| Lumiere | deliver basic app and charge the fees then spend a month adding to it? | 21:19 |
| th1a | More, instead of writing something that moves data both ways, find out which data they need to go which way and implement that first. | 21:20 |
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| Lumiere | bbl | 21:28 |
| replaceafill | brb | 21:40 |
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| moquist | th1a: OK. I'm pretty comfortable with the Moodle side of the enrollment data part, and I think a totally basic exchange (user 1234 is a student in course 5678, user 4321 is a teacher in course 8765) should be sufficient to start. | 22:16 |
| moquist | That prepopulates the system with the two most important roles, and those two types of two-element tuples (or that one three-element tuple type) is enough to do it. | 22:17 |
| moquist | I also suspect that for the first deliverable, Moodle->SchoolTool enrollment exchange would be enough. | 22:18 |
| moquist | Heck, SSO could also be one-way to start with, and that may be the way to go. | 22:18 |
| moquist | Moodle->SchoolTool. *shrug* | 22:18 |
| moquist | Penny pointed out to me in private conversation that each direction of SSO needs to be implemented by each side, of course, so just doing one way to start with is probably a better idea since we've got a time/money crunch. | 22:19 |
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| moquist | th1a: Moodle's external DB stuff really is super, and quite easy to set up. If we're not doing mnet in the next month then I think that's the way to go (at least from a Moodle perspective). | 22:48 |
| moquist | plus I have extensive experience with it. :) | 22:49 |
| th1a | moquist: Does it require a SQL database? | 23:27 |
| th1a | I guess we'd have to create a plug-in of some kind. | 23:29 |
| th1a | Web services are better if we can do it. | 23:30 |
| moquist | th1a: yes. What I would want from/in schooltool is a dump of relational-looking stuff. | 23:33 |
| moquist | I don't think this is a good long-term solution, so it's not one I would recommend to become supported or "released", really. | 23:33 |
| moquist | I'd be happy to do it as glue for the temporary external-ish solution. | 23:33 |
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| moquist | th1a: we can talk again after I speak with joe. | 23:34 |
| th1a | moquist: Yep. | 23:36 |
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