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| *** mgallagh is now known as mattva01 | 17:08 | |
| mattva01 | weird issue, cando crashes without an error | 17:09 |
|---|---|---|
| mattva01 | anyone else had an issue like that recently | 17:09 |
| mattva01 | anyone here? | 17:20 |
| *** ignas has joined #schooltool | 17:31 | |
| mattva01 | ignas | 17:31 |
| ignas | yes | 17:32 |
| mattva01 | weird issue, cando is crashing without an error when students try to use it | 17:32 |
| ignas | the crash is visible as what? | 17:33 |
| mattva01 | well the instance dies | 17:34 |
| ignas | whoah | 17:34 |
| ignas | any user trying to access cando on any IP crashes the system? | 17:35 |
| mattva01 | I have not had an opportunity to check what specific user behavior causes this behavior | 17:35 |
| mattva01 | not not exactly | 17:35 |
| ignas | i see | 17:35 |
| ignas | any information in access.log for example? | 17:36 |
| mattva01 | basically, it crashes every day at arount 9:50 , when students are using the journalling system | 17:36 |
| mattva01 | no | 17:36 |
| mattva01 | alot of connections per second though | 17:36 |
| ignas | it still should be visible, like - the last url requested | 17:37 |
| ignas | the output of the application into the console | 17:37 |
| ignas | before craching | 17:37 |
| mattva01 | nope just last url | 17:37 |
| ignas | what kind of sandbox is it? | 17:38 |
| ignas | cando-buildout | 17:38 |
| ignas | or something else? | 17:38 |
| ignas | is there an "instance/" directory | 17:38 |
| mattva01 | no | 17:38 |
| mattva01 | its trunk :( | 17:39 |
| ignas | cando trunk | 17:39 |
| mattva01 | 1312 | 17:39 |
| ignas | hmm | 17:40 |
| ignas | and how are you daemonizing the thing? | 17:40 |
| mattva01 | well since it crashed the first time "make run &" | 17:41 |
| ignas | emm, that does not give us any output | 17:42 |
| ignas | that was being written to stdout | 17:42 |
| ignas | and stderr | 17:42 |
| mattva01 | yeah I know | 17:42 |
| ignas | which kind of limits my ability to diagnose the issue :/ | 17:42 |
| mattva01 | how would you prefer I start it | 17:43 |
| aelkner | is it the app that's crashing or the machine? | 17:43 |
| mattva01 | app | 17:43 |
| mattva01 | machines been up a while | 17:43 |
| aelkner | one thing to try is make run > /dev/null & | 17:43 |
| ignas | hmm, your options are - using screen | 17:43 |
| ignas | and not /dev/null | 17:44 |
| ignas | /some/text_file | 17:44 |
| aelkner | yes | 17:44 |
| mattva01 | yeah | 17:44 |
| ignas | maybe use "tee" | 17:44 |
| mattva01 | yep | 17:44 |
| ignas | to get both stdout and stderr | 17:44 |
| ignas | in there | 17:44 |
| ignas | and write me an email as soon as you get something | 17:44 |
| ignas | like - is it a segfault | 17:45 |
| ignas | or is it a traceback from zope | 17:45 |
| mattva01 | kk | 17:45 |
| mgedmin | nohup might help too | 17:47 |
| mgedmin | 'nohup command &' will put all stdout & stderr into a file called nohup.out | 17:48 |
| mattva01 | yes | 17:48 |
| mattva01 | hmm it got a lock error but did not die | 17:56 |
| ignas | lock error? | 18:01 |
| ignas | there is a chance that cando was dying because it tried outputing stuff to stdout or stderr and could not "find" one... | 18:03 |
| mattva01 | hmm | 18:04 |
| mattva01 | ZODB.lock_file.LockError: Couldn't lock 'var/Data.fs.lock' | 18:07 |
| ignas | hmm, which means that last time zope crashed | 18:12 |
| ignas | and left Data.fs.lock file | 18:12 |
| ignas | in there | 18:13 |
| ignas | probably | 18:13 |
| ignas | i don't know for sure | 18:13 |
| mattva01 | could be | 18:16 |
| aelkner | could it be that the machine is having a problem obtaining locks in general | 18:17 |
| aelkner | that would explain it having problems with stdout | 18:17 |
| aelkner | like it couldn't lock it, so it crashes | 18:18 |
| aelkner | leaving no output as evidence | 18:18 |
| mattva01 | thats an interesting idea | 18:20 |
| ignas | not sure whether locks and stdout that is not there work the same way | 18:21 |
| mattva01 | it does write to stdout though | 18:21 |
| ignas | could you give me the full outupt | 18:23 |
| ignas | and the full error | 18:23 |
| mattva01 | yeah | 18:24 |
| ignas | and try removing the lock after you shutdown the server | 18:25 |
| ignas | and starting it up then | 18:25 |
| mattva01 | hmm your pastebot seems to be down | 18:26 |
| mattva01 | using pastebin | 18:26 |
| ignas | it's not mine ;) but yeah, it seems to be having problems lately | 18:26 |
| mattva01 | http://pastebin.org/38002 | 18:26 |
| ignas | rm the lock file | 18:27 |
| ignas | and start the server again | 18:27 |
| ignas | and check if the server is not running | 18:27 |
| mattva01 | kk | 18:27 |
| ignas | becuse it might be that the server is up already | 18:27 |
| ignas | and is using the Data.fs | 18:27 |
| mattva01 | server was down | 18:30 |
| ignas | then remove the lock and start it up | 18:30 |
| mattva01 | k no lock error | 18:34 |
| mattva01 | well we'll have to wait till tuesday to see if that worked | 18:36 |
| th1a | Can't we test it somehow? | 19:20 |
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| th1a | ignas: Is SchoolTool (Zope) performance slower under devmode? | 19:45 |
| ignas | th1a: not sure really, it should not be affected from what i know | 19:56 |
| th1a | ignas: Thanks. | 19:56 |
| th1a | I assume it is required to stop SchoolTool to back up the Data.fs? | 20:19 |
| ignas | hmm, not really sure you can "stop" schooltool, i think you have to /etc/init.d/schooltool-2008 stop | 20:33 |
| ignas | on ubuntu | 20:33 |
| ignas | and Ctrl+C in development | 20:33 |
| ignas | packing of the database | 20:33 |
| ignas | is in schooltool without devmode from what i can recall | 20:33 |
| ignas | though you might want to check | 20:33 |
| ignas | if you can see "Application Control" link | 20:34 |
| ignas | in the Manage tab | 20:34 |
| ignas | without devmode | 20:34 |
| th1a | ignas: OK. | 20:36 |
| aelkner | th1a: something interesting came up this wed | 20:37 |
| aelkner | marcie wanted to add a student to all of his sections | 20:37 |
| aelkner | and she wondered if there was one screen to do that | 20:37 |
| th1a | Right. | 20:37 |
| aelkner | i only knew of the way of going to each section and adding the student there | 20:37 |
| aelkner | but i could write the other way pretty easily | 20:38 |
| ignas | there was, the link is hidden though, and the view is not very convenient | 20:38 |
| th1a | Does the "schedule" action still exist? | 20:38 |
| ignas | yes, with all the conflicts, and all the timetabling stuff | 20:38 |
| aelkner | i never heard of this one | 20:38 |
| th1a | It is tricker than it seems. | 20:38 |
| ignas | though - probably a new "membership" based view might be a bit more convenient | 20:38 |
| ignas | because it would work without timetables in sections | 20:38 |
| aelkner | that's what i was thinking | 20:38 |
| th1a | But... essential in the next year. | 20:38 |
| aelkner | the membership views are excellent | 20:39 |
| aelkner | easy to use | 20:39 |
| aelkner | and covering the whole search logic | 20:39 |
| aelkner | so if i just create a new view that does the same thing | 20:39 |
| ignas | yeah, they will do for now pretty well | 20:39 |
| ignas | we can add conflict handling later | 20:39 |
| aelkner | conflicts? | 20:39 |
| ignas | and it will be better than the timetabling based views i think | 20:39 |
| ignas | aelkner: scheduling conflicts among sections | 20:40 |
| th1a | Ideally you want to have a grid of the school week and plug sections in and immediately see when all the sections meet. | 20:40 |
| aelkner | oh, you're thinking time | 20:40 |
| ignas | adding a person to 2 sections that are both scheduled on the same day | 20:40 |
| th1a | Ajax would help a lot with that. | 20:40 |
| th1a | But doing it right is genuinely difficult. | 20:40 |
| th1a | So if you can do something easier that works, fine. | 20:41 |
| aelkner | i wouldn't want to lose the view that we have for membership | 20:41 |
| aelkner | it's really clean | 20:41 |
| ignas | so you can just use that, because it's a part of functionality that is missing at the moment | 20:41 |
| aelkner | we could discuss the conflict issue ay europython | 20:42 |
| th1a | Basically, there are two levels of views here: | 20:42 |
| ignas | because the old solution is quite unusable in the usual case | 20:42 |
| th1a | *) I know what sections Jimmy will be in and I want to add them quickly; | 20:42 |
| th1a | *) I don't know what sections Jimmy will be in and I'd like SchoolTool to help me figure it out. | 20:42 |
| th1a | In real life, the second one comes down to working out a timetable without conflicts. | 20:43 |
| ignas | and working it out using a single sudent centric view | 20:44 |
| ignas | is pretty much impossible | 20:44 |
| th1a | Not really. | 20:44 |
| th1a | But it is probably more difficult than any other view we have, except the calendars. | 20:45 |
| aelkner | practically speaking, marcie isn't gong to schedule a kid for conflicting schedules | 20:45 |
| th1a | That view could take weeks. | 20:45 |
| aelkner | so for short term, i'm ok | 20:45 |
| aelkner | i just need to create the first view you mentioned | 20:45 |
| th1a | Well, at this point she's going to figure out the schedule by hand and then enter it. | 20:45 |
| aelkner | right | 20:46 |
| th1a | Not use ST to figure it out. | 20:46 |
| aelkner | so for now, we're cool | 20:46 |
| aelkner | i'll just create the membership view | 20:46 |
| aelkner | should that go in schooltool.course or schooltool.basicperson? | 20:46 |
| th1a | If Marcy is happy, I'm happy. | 20:46 |
| ignas | aelkner: course | 20:46 |
| aelkner | ok | 20:47 |
| aelkner | makes sense | 20:47 |
| ignas | it might be a bit more tricky that you'd expect though | 20:47 |
| th1a | Oh... let's meet Tuesday next week. | 20:48 |
| th1a | Monday is a holiday here. | 20:48 |
| ignas | the section -> member relationship is a bit messed up | 20:48 |
| ignas | th1a: ok | 20:48 |
| aelkner | ignas: how's that? | 20:48 |
| aelkner | it works nicely from the user perspective | 20:48 |
| ignas | aelkner: you will have to keep in mind the fact that if you are trying to list all the objects that a person is a "member" of | 20:48 |
| ignas | you will get both - groups and sections | 20:48 |
| aelkner | i just need to filter by object type | 20:49 |
| ignas | and i can't recall how it should be dealt with in membership views | 20:49 |
| ignas | maybe, can't recall now | 20:49 |
| aelkner | i can subclass the view | 20:49 |
| ignas | just warning you | 20:49 |
| aelkner | that's fine | 20:49 |
| aelkner | thanks | 20:49 |
| ignas | about a possible bug that you should test for | 20:49 |
| aelkner | so i should create a menu link at the student view, right? | 20:50 |
| aelkner | i figure that would make sense | 20:50 |
| aelkner | "Sections"? | 20:50 |
| aelkner | i prefer one work | 20:50 |
| aelkner | word | 20:50 |
| aelkner | as we are running out of space | 20:50 |
| aelkner | but we need the menu item | 20:50 |
| ignas | yeah, we have "groups" so "sections" makes sense | 20:51 |
| aelkner | cool | 20:53 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: how do they figure out how each student goes into classes | 21:05 |
| Lumiere | to go backward | 21:05 |
| aelkner | everything works with the schooltool.relationship package | 21:05 |
| aelkner | relationships are kept on both the objects that relate to each other | 21:06 |
| aelkner | it's a handy package | 21:06 |
| aelkner | it uses annotations | 21:06 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: not quite what I meant | 21:23 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: how does SLA place a student into sections (with 300 students) | 21:24 |
| Lumiere | all 300 need to be put in | 21:24 |
| aelkner | that's what we're working on | 21:24 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: how do you get all of em in at once | 21:25 |
| aelkner | you don't | 21:25 |
| aelkner | but i will create a new view that let's you put a student in all of his sections in one place | 21:25 |
| aelkner | existingt view for adding students to one section is already there | 21:25 |
| aelkner | also, there's an import | 21:26 |
| aelkner | at least there is for SLA | 21:26 |
| aelkner | i wrote it | 21:26 |
| aelkner | and there's one for schooltool, but it wasn't sufficient for SLA's needs | 21:26 |
| aelkner | because they have ore than one teacher per section | 21:28 |
| Lumiere | well, how do you resolve conflicts on 300 schedules | 21:29 |
| Lumiere | or does it run like college | 21:29 |
| Lumiere | where first come first serve on next year's classes | 21:29 |
| Lumiere | brb | 21:29 |
| aelkner | that's the whole issue that we have before us | 21:30 |
| aelkner | we need to get schooltool's use of time in order | 21:30 |
| aelkner | and scheduling conflicts is part of that | 21:30 |
| Lumiere | ah | 21:33 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: at some point you should be able to say "student x needs courses 1,5,20,400" | 21:33 |
| Lumiere | for all students | 21:33 |
| Lumiere | and then say "create schedule | 21:33 |
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| aelkner | yes | 21:42 |
| aelkner | back after a shower | 21:42 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: jeff | 21:42 |
| Lumiere | did SOME work on that problem | 21:42 |
| Lumiere | I think | 21:42 |
| aelkner | oh? | 21:42 |
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| aelkner | Lumiere: student x needs courses 1,5, etc will be handled by the new view i'm going to create | 21:43 |
| Lumiere | aelkner: I am saying doesn't need section | 21:47 |
| Lumiere | I am saying you tell the system what courses and it figures all the sectons for all the students at the same time | 21:47 |
| Lumiere | (which is how HS do scheduling usually) | 21:52 |
| th1a | Lumiere: There are some open source timetable generation packages. | 21:53 |
| th1a | Eventually we'll interface with them. | 21:53 |
| Lumiere | th1a: like where we can ship them our data | 21:55 |
| Lumiere | and they ship back schedules? | 21:55 |
| th1a | Yes. | 21:56 |
| Lumiere | I guess that works | 21:56 |
| th1a | The software (FET and Tablix) is better at figuring out what classes meet in which room, when. | 21:56 |
| th1a | But FET at least can be coerced into putting students in sections, I believe. | 21:56 |
| Lumiere | sounds like a decent requirement to add to the schooltool package | 21:56 |
| th1a | Also, FET is still under pretty active development (probably Tablix, too) so we can probably get some features added if necessary. | 21:57 |
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| Lumiere | ah | 21:57 |
| Lumiere | th1a: I should look at em I guess | 21:57 |
| th1a | No rush. | 21:58 |
| Lumiere | yea | 22:00 |
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