| smalekgh | what does <tr>, <td>, and <th> do in page templates again? | 00:02 |
|---|---|---|
| pcardune | nothing in particular... those are all just html tags | 00:10 |
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| smalekgh | do they actually mean anything or represent something or are they all equivalent to 'haha, I'm a tag, and I confuse you!'? | 00:11 |
| pcardune | well, tr is a table tow, td is an entry in that row, and th is a table header | 00:12 |
| smalekgh | oh, yay, so it's organization on a page | 00:12 |
| smalekgh | thank you >.< | 00:12 |
| pcardune | you should look it up in an html reference | 00:12 |
| smalekgh | okey | 00:12 |
| pcardune | ignas: did someone ever get around to writing that document for helping people write setup scripts for schooltool? | 00:13 |
| pcardune | hi jelkner | 00:13 |
| jelkner | hi pcardune! | 00:20 |
| jelkner | i'm about to give you a call | 00:20 |
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| pcardune | jelkner: i'm in the library | 00:21 |
| pcardune | so give me a second to leave the library, then you can call. | 00:21 |
| jelkner | ok | 00:22 |
| pcardune | more seconds please | 00:23 |
| jelkner | would it be better to chat? | 00:23 |
| jelkner | so you don't have to leave... | 00:23 |
| jelkner | i could really just talk to you here | 00:23 |
| pcardune | ok you can call now | 00:24 |
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| ignas | pcardune, hmm, don't think so | 02:07 |
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| Lumiere | ah crap | 03:37 |
| Lumiere | missed ignas | 03:38 |
| * Lumiere sends memos | 03:41 | |
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| Lumiere | morning all | 15:56 |
| Lumiere | th1a: ayt? | 16:22 |
| th1a | Lumiere: Good morning. | 16:25 |
| Lumiere | morning | 16:25 |
| Lumiere | seems quiet for the morning meeting... | 16:25 |
| Lumiere | my schedule has changed slightly | 16:26 |
| th1a | It starts in 1 minute. | 16:26 |
| Lumiere | I'm here for the meeting | 16:26 |
| Lumiere | then I go into work | 16:26 |
| * th1a shuffles some papers around. | 16:26 | |
| Fujitsu | A meeting starting at 27 past the hour? How strange. | 16:26 |
| Lumiere | lol | 16:26 |
| th1a | Hm. | 16:26 |
| Lumiere | I was about to say | 16:26 |
| Lumiere | Mon Apr 9 13:26:50 UTC 2007 | 16:26 |
| th1a | I guess my clock is not properly synchonized. | 16:27 |
| Lumiere | mine otoh is | 16:27 |
| Lumiere | I have 4 peers | 16:27 |
| th1a | Ah. NTP support is not installed. | 16:27 |
| th1a | Lumiere: I guess Virginia is getting pretty enthusiastic about CanDo. | 16:29 |
| Lumiere | yes | 16:29 |
| Fujitsu | Now it's half past. | 16:30 |
| Lumiere | I was there for that meeting | 16:30 |
| Lumiere | they have a huge need for it | 16:30 |
| th1a | Tell me more. | 16:30 |
| th1a | Hm... no ignas? | 16:30 |
| Lumiere | to the point where they want to run a test on cando-07 in classrooms | 16:30 |
| Lumiere | minimum 2 teachers in each of the 8 VA Superintendents Regions | 16:31 |
| th1a | Hi jfroche. | 16:31 |
| th1a | Perhaps today is still a holiday in Lithuania. | 16:31 |
| Lumiere | well | 16:31 |
| Lumiere | I have a couple memos in for ignas when he returns | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | not that it's anything important | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | just reminding him that I do have 1 copy of the resource scheduling branch in 'production' | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | but the people who are using it | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | know it's a beta server | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | and devmode is still on | 16:32 |
| Lumiere | so it should be pretty obvious to the users | 16:32 |
| * Lumiere moves back to talking about va+cando | 16:33 | |
| th1a | I saw him doing checkins related to that. | 16:33 |
| Lumiere | yes | 16:33 |
| Lumiere | it should be ok | 16:33 |
| Lumiere | anyways, the plan as it was left in the meeting was to put an RFP out for teachers to sign up during the summer | 16:34 |
| Lumiere | they'd get training in october and start on it at semester break | 16:34 |
| th1a | Sounds like a good timeframe. | 16:34 |
| Lumiere | all the times and trainings would be done by the VA CTE Resource Center | 16:34 |
| th1a | Nice. | 16:35 |
| Lumiere | until they start using it at which point it would move to being joint meetings | 16:35 |
| Lumiere | although I am sure we'll be at some of the trainings | 16:35 |
| Lumiere | at this point, I am trying to get as much user data as I can from these so we can continue to focus development | 16:36 |
| th1a | CTE = Career Technical Something? | 16:36 |
| Lumiere | education | 16:36 |
| th1a | Right. | 16:36 |
| Lumiere | the other big thing from the meeting was that they want to be able to have an administrator lock certain comps into a course | 16:36 |
| th1a | That makes sense. | 16:38 |
| Lumiere | they have certain comps that are tied to national standards that for their acreddidation stuff have to be in the curriculum | 16:38 |
| Lumiere | and they want to be sure that those cannot be removed by a teacher who doesn't agree with them | 16:39 |
| Lumiere | the final plus from the meeting is that we're going to be able to get VA's Standards of Learning from their database | 16:40 |
| th1a | That should be helpful. | 16:40 |
| Lumiere | so we'll finally have all the va comps easily imported (one of the high priority tasks is import and export) | 16:40 |
| Lumiere | It will be a XML format that I'm writing now | 16:41 |
| Lumiere | (it's high on my list for today to finish) | 16:41 |
| th1a | Are you writing a schema? | 16:41 |
| Lumiere | yes | 16:41 |
| Lumiere | I've written a few schema before | 16:42 |
| th1a | What language? | 16:42 |
| Lumiere | so I at least understand the syntax | 16:42 |
| Lumiere | none, just xml-schema | 16:42 |
| th1a | Isn't that a language? | 16:43 |
| Lumiere | it's an xml namespace | 16:43 |
| Lumiere | <xsd:schema xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema" targetNamespace="http://schooltool.org/schema"> | 16:43 |
| th1a | Close enough. | 16:44 |
| Lumiere | comps are pretty much implemented in it, but the rest of it will take a little longer | 16:44 |
| th1a | Rest of what? | 16:44 |
| Lumiere | it needs to work on a 'person' and a section of a course | 16:44 |
| th1a | Hm? | 16:45 |
| th1a | I wrote an RDF Schema to cover all this stuff a few years ago. | 16:45 |
| th1a | I don't know if I could even find it now. | 16:45 |
| Lumiere | it would be useful | 16:45 |
| Lumiere | maybe I could just add comp and complist to that | 16:46 |
| Lumiere | and we'd be done | 16:46 |
| Lumiere | the idea is | 16:46 |
| th1a | Why do you need people and sections? | 16:46 |
| Lumiere | we want to give people compentency lists to import | 16:46 |
| Lumiere | but we need to be able to move people between cando instances | 16:46 |
| Lumiere | and carry as much of the data as we can | 16:46 |
| th1a | We should really just use SIF for this. | 16:47 |
| Lumiere | sif is good for inside zone | 16:47 |
| th1a | You make a zone for the state. | 16:48 |
| Lumiere | and we plan on using sif with multiple zones for that sort of thing | 16:48 |
| Lumiere | we will be | 16:48 |
| th1a | OK... this is a temporary solution? | 16:48 |
| Lumiere | it's half temporary and half for outside zone transfer/validated resume | 16:49 |
| Lumiere | one of the big things the administration at Arlington Career Center likes is the idea of being able to give a company | 16:49 |
| Lumiere | a validated list of compentcies that show what bob learned in school | 16:50 |
| Lumiere | and what we think he can do and how well | 16:50 |
| Lumiere | I can't see that being a sif application | 16:50 |
| th1a | Have you seen this http://xml.coverpages.org/PESC-HS-Transcript2006.html ? | 16:50 |
| Lumiere | it could be used | 16:53 |
| Lumiere | but it's way way overkill | 16:53 |
| Lumiere | we won't have 99.999% of the data I see there at first glance | 16:53 |
| Lumiere | and we'll have tons of extensions | 16:53 |
| Lumiere | the other thing that VA has to have is that the _only_ thing identifying a student in cando for them needs to be their testing number | 16:54 |
| Lumiere | (and schooltool) | 16:54 |
| th1a | Lumiere: Do you see competencies (or standards) in the schema? | 16:55 |
| th1a | I haven't looked at this before. | 16:55 |
| Lumiere | no | 16:56 |
| Lumiere | I only see courses | 16:56 |
| Lumiere | (which seems right for a 'transcript' | 16:56 |
| Lumiere | it looks like a data-interchange format for sending a student's transcript to a college electronically | 16:57 |
| th1a | There is a "Proficiency" which can be attached to a Course. | 16:57 |
| Lumiere | -_- core-main is crashing my browser | 16:59 |
| th1a | I suppose it isn't really sufficient. | 16:59 |
| th1a | I'm just trying to avoid making up our own schemas. | 16:59 |
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| Lumiere | I don't really see it as an issue, I also like it for being able to pull data out of the system for backup and long term storage | 17:00 |
| march | hi@all | 17:00 |
| Lumiere | hi march | 17:00 |
| th1a | hi march. | 17:01 |
| th1a | Lumiere: I'm not saying it is a bad idea in general. It is always nice to use a generally recognized schema though. | 17:02 |
| Lumiere | yes | 17:02 |
| march | Does anyone know if there exists a website with a howto for schooltool? I'm trying to write an article for our wiki - but I've found only a few informations. | 17:02 |
| th1a | Whose wiki? | 17:03 |
| march | ubuntuusers.de | 17:03 |
| march | http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Baustelle/SchoolTool | 17:03 |
| march | but there isn't much in it at the moment ;) | 17:03 |
| th1a | Well... the reason we're kind of low-profile on that kind of thing is that the best advice we can give to Ubuntu users is wait until Feisty+1. | 17:04 |
| Fujitsu | It really should be removed from Feisty, but nobody has got around to it yet. | 17:04 |
| th1a | The version on Ubuntu is out of date, and it is going to take a lot of work over the next six months to get it ready. | 17:04 |
| th1a | I'm not sure it should literally be removed... | 17:05 |
| th1a | I don't know. | 17:05 |
| Fujitsu | th1a: It's uninstallable and in main... | 17:05 |
| th1a | I'd prefer if it was fixed, but I don't think the problem is in our package. | 17:06 |
| Fujitsu | Getting SVN up and running is pretty easy, with just a couple of changes necessary (making it all build/run with python 2.4) | 17:06 |
| th1a | Or at least it didn't used to be. | 17:06 |
| Fujitsu | The problem is that we have a newer Zope. | 17:06 |
| march | Thanks for your informations. :) | 17:06 |
| th1a | march: As you can see, it is a little complicated. | 17:08 |
| Lumiere | th1a: yes, a recognized schema is good, but for our purposes I think getting schooltool/cando import/export solved | 17:08 |
| march | Yes | 17:08 |
| th1a | Fujitsu: A newer Zope than the old SchoolTool can handle. | 17:08 |
| Fujitsu | th1a: That's right. | 17:08 |
| Lumiere | will create a de-facto compentencies standard | 17:09 |
| Lumiere | (my other qualm is that all these school standards have support from policy groups but not sane implementation stuff) | 17:09 |
| th1a | OK, I'll yield. | 17:10 |
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| march | So the article has to wait for a while. Doesn't matter. :) | 17:10 |
| th1a | march: Come back in six months ;-) | 17:10 |
| Lumiere | I yield to jinty for his update and request that the speaker reserve a period of 3 minutes for me afterward | 17:11 |
| Lumiere | XD | 17:11 |
| march | th1a: I'll come back :) | 17:11 |
| Lumiere | happy monday jinty | 17:12 |
| th1a | Hi jinty. | 17:12 |
| * jinty congratulates himself on a happy and very relaxing public holiday | 17:12 | |
| jinty | Hi all! | 17:13 |
| th1a | Is today a holiday in Europe as well? | 17:13 |
| th1a | I mean, as well as Sunday is. | 17:13 |
| jinty | th1a: btw, I'll see if I can get the tickets organized soon next week for europython | 17:13 |
| th1a | jinty: Good. I just got mine. | 17:13 |
| jinty | th1a: In catalunia it's a holiday | 17:14 |
| jinty | but not the rest of spain... | 17:14 |
| march | th1a: In Germany it's holiday | 17:14 |
| march | +a | 17:15 |
| * jinty reads the logs to find out what his update should be | 17:15 | |
| th1a | jinty: Whatever is on your mind. | 17:16 |
| th1a | It looks like it is a holiday in Lithuania: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_holidays_in_Lithuania | 17:16 |
| march | Happy Easter by the way :) | 17:16 |
| th1a | And Belgium: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_holidays_in_Belgium | 17:16 |
| jinty | then that's mostly a change I'm trying to push through in zope, rather than schooltool | 17:17 |
| th1a | march: Same to you. | 17:17 |
| march | thx | 17:17 |
| th1a | Yes... your no ZODB Zope? | 17:17 |
| jinty | Ah, yeah | 17:17 |
| jinty | nice that it was given a more or less green light | 17:18 |
| th1a | I wondered why that came up last week. | 17:18 |
| th1a | What's the motivation? | 17:18 |
| jinty | well, we mostly do SQL in my company, and it's much cleaner if you don't have a ZODB | 17:19 |
| jinty | you can reduce the compexity of the app by a lot | 17:19 |
| jinty | so we've been using a solution, but with a lot of zope3 code duplicated to just change a few lines | 17:20 |
| th1a | Cleaner to not have to keep the ZODB around just to manage the application object or whatever? | 17:21 |
| th1a | Lumiere: There's this too: http://specification.sifinfo.org/Implementation/2.0/StudentRecordExchangeTaskForce.html#StudentRecordExchangeTaskForce | 17:21 |
| th1a | But it doesn't mention standards/competencies. | 17:21 |
| th1a | The fact of the matter is that this would all be easier in RDF. | 17:22 |
| jinty | th1a: we normally run with multiple application servers, so having the ZODB means you need a ZEO server in addition to a RDB server if you want to have a sane environment. | 17:23 |
| Lumiere | link me to a 'howto write RDF schema' | 17:23 |
| Lumiere | and I'll look at it | 17:23 |
| th1a | jinty: Yes, I can see how that would be a problem. | 17:23 |
| th1a | Lumiere: Well, it would be easier if EVERYONE used RDF Schemas, but just writing one for an individual purpose is harder. | 17:24 |
| th1a | Which is why they may never catch on :-( | 17:24 |
| * Lumiere drops his own personal bag of bricks | 17:28 | |
| th1a | OK... I guess that's it for this holiday version of the weekly SchoolTool meeting. | 17:28 |
| th1a | Have a good week! | 17:28 |
| Lumiere | I'm on my way to shower/work | 17:28 |
| * th1a drops the bag of gravel. | 17:28 | |
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| Lumiere | hi pcardune_mac | 18:25 |
| pcardune_mac | hi Lumiere | 18:25 |
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| march | have a nice day :) | 19:08 |
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| Lumiere | hi pcardune | 20:51 |
| Lumiere | looks like cando-05 won't run on dapper at all | 20:52 |
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| ignas | th1a: ping | 22:28 |
| jfroche | hello th1a | 22:28 |
| th1a | Hi ignas. | 22:28 |
| ignas | th1a: i was in a plane flying to brussels when the meeting was happening | 22:28 |
| th1a | Hi jfroche. | 22:28 |
| th1a | OH... | 22:28 |
| th1a | I hadn't realized we'd gotten to that point already. | 22:29 |
| ignas | :) 2007 April 09 | 22:30 |
| th1a | What I need is some kind of software to help keep my calendar organized! | 22:32 |
| ignas | th1a: you killed it | 22:33 |
| ignas | ;) | 22:33 |
| th1a | So what are you guys going to work on anyhow? | 22:34 |
| ignas | thinking at the moment | 22:34 |
| ignas | one idea is to work on zc.catalog integration with our batching/tables | 22:35 |
| ignas | because jfroche is having some speed problems | 22:35 |
| ignas | with 1000+ persons in the list | 22:35 |
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| th1a | ignas: That sounds like a good idea. | 22:35 |
| Lumiere | hi ignas | 22:35 |
| ignas | Lumiere: hi | 22:35 |
| th1a | Hi pcardune. | 22:35 |
| Lumiere | ignas: see my memos? | 22:37 |
| ignas | looking at it | 22:38 |
| ignas | can't "extract" the memos ;) | 22:38 |
| Lumiere | lol | 22:38 |
| Lumiere | I have 1 copy of resource scheduling in production. I can/will reset them... (although getting the person/group data exported would be useful) | 22:38 |
| Lumiere | ... But I can ask pcardune to help me with that if it becomes needed | 22:38 |
| ignas | i see | 22:39 |
| ignas | and the other memo? | 22:39 |
| Lumiere | the ... one | 22:39 |
| ignas | oh | 22:40 |
| ignas | ok | 22:40 |
| ignas | :) | 22:40 |
| Lumiere | don't let this one instance get in the way of what's best for the long term | 22:40 |
| ignas | i'll look at it | 22:42 |
| pcardune_mac | hi th1a | 22:42 |
| pcardune_mac | th1a: you are actually going to need to book that plane ticket for me :) | 22:42 |
| pcardune_mac | I don't have enough credit to do it myself :) | 22:42 |
| th1a | pcardune_mac: OK. Email me the itinerary you'll need. | 22:43 |
| pcardune_mac | ok, I should have that in the next 2 days or so | 22:43 |
| th1a | jfroche: You need to send me an invoice. | 22:46 |
| jfroche | th1a: got your mail, doing it atm | 22:47 |
| th1a | atm? | 22:47 |
| Lumiere | at the moment | 22:47 |
| ignas | jfroche: http://mg.pov.lt/profilehooks.py | 22:48 |
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| Lumiere | back | 23:17 |
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