| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 21 13:33:37 2004 | ||
| -->You are now talking on #schooltool | 13:33 | |
| ---Topic for #schooltool is www.schooltool.org || IRC logs at http://stone.tuttlesvc.org:880/logbot/ | 13:33 | |
| ---Topic for #schooltool set by mgedmin at Fri Jul 16 18:15:52 | 13:33 | |
| -TomLogging-This channel is logged - http://stone.tuttlesvc.org:880/logbot/ | 13:33 | |
| -->gintas (~gintas@office.pov.lt) has joined #schooltool | 13:35 | |
| gintas | there might be some useful info wrt. calendaring in this page: http://www.osdl.org/projects/cmptblclndrng/results/ | 13:36 |
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| -->th1a|way (~hoffman@pool-64-222-39-13.prov.east.verizon.net) has joined #schooltool | 15:09 | |
| ---th1a|way is now known as th1a | 17:53 | |
| th1a | Good evening gentlemen. My sleeping pattern tends to slip even more out of sync with your time zone than it is to start with. | 17:55 |
| th1a | From yesterday's checkins it looks like milestone 6 is almost done. What's the status? | 17:57 |
| -->alga (~alga@office.pov.lt) has joined #SchoolTool | 18:05 | |
| alga | hi | 18:05 |
| th1a | Hi. | 18:05 |
| alga | yes, Marius and Gintas have almost released the milestone | 18:05 |
| alga | but I felt that the app log functionality was not quite ready | 18:06 |
| th1a | Cool. | 18:06 |
| alga | so it is delayed for a day or two.. | 18:06 |
| alga | you know, spitting out the whole log file in a wx window is not too user friendy | 18:07 |
| alga | imagine if the log is 15MB long | 18:07 |
| th1a | Sure. | 18:07 |
| alga | so now we're working on functionality to limit and filter the log contents | 18:07 |
| th1a | Sounds good. | 18:08 |
| alga | unfortunately, this involves the yucky wx work | 18:08 |
| th1a | Yes. It can be yucky. | 18:08 |
| th1a | We should be able to switch to the new website for the m6 release. It will almost look like we planned it that way. | 18:09 |
| th1a | So Mark and I have agreed to fund a second team to finalize schooltool's "platform" nature while the calendaring work goes on. | 18:11 |
| th1a | That is integrating schemas and other Zope 3 stuff, doing a "Simple Product" and generally having everything clearly specified for how extensions will work. | 18:13 |
| th1a | So the question turns to who will do it... Any suggestions? | 18:20 |
| *mgedmin thinks that "platform" work is more interesting | 18:29 | |
| *mgedmin did not like the iCalendar spec when he had to read and understand it | 18:30 | |
| th1a | Than calendaring? | 18:30 |
| th1a | It might make more sense to look for another team to do the calendaring... | 18:30 |
| th1a | There's just a strong imperative to get calendaring done quickly, too. | 18:31 |
| th1a | I'm going to work on the specs for calendaring. According to my "Extreme Programming Pocket Guide" I should be writing a series of stories that are one or two sentences from the user's perspective, each one describing a single feature. | 18:39 |
| th1a | Is that the way you would like it done? | 18:39 |
| th1a | OK. That's what I'm going to do then. | 18:54 |
| alga | but those sentences are just titles, markers. XP implies verbal communication about the details of what the customer wants | 19:01 |
| alga | whereas we might do a paragraph of elaboration (like in the past proposals) | 19:01 |
| th1a | OK. | 19:02 |
| alga | or "verbal" communication on IRC | 19:02 |
| th1a | I can do that, too. | 19:02 |
| th1a | Would it be helpful if I got up earlier, btw? Am I starting these discussions too late in the day? | 19:03 |
| mgedmin | sure, we can communicate with verbs on IRC | 19:03 |
| *mgedmin ducks and runs | 19:04 | |
| th1a | verb-bots. | 19:04 |
| th1a | I was considering last night that you guys could very easily be bots. | 19:04 |
| th1a | Clever bots, of course... | 19:05 |
| alga | Why do you say you were considering last night that you guys could very easily be bots? | 19:12 |
| mgedmin | Is it because I guys could very easily be bots clever bots of course | 19:12 |
| mgedmin | that you came to me? | 19:12 |
| th1a | Precisely. | 19:12 |
| th1a | :D | 19:13 |
| alga | seriously though, we get up late | 19:13 |
| mgedmin | my ideal work day ends at 19:00 UTC+0300 | 19:13 |
| alga | and usually leave work after 07:00Z | 19:13 |
| mgedmin | this has never happened so far | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | I usually leave about 19:00 UTC | 19:14 |
| alga | uh | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | alga apparently leaves at 7 am ;) | 19:14 |
| alga | that's what I meant | 19:14 |
| alga | no | 19:14 |
| alga | 19:00 is what I meant | 19:14 |
| mgedmin | uhh I meant 18:00 UTC | 19:14 |
| th1a | So we all run late in our respective timezones. | 19:14 |
| alga | right | 19:15 |
| mgedmin | between 20:00 and 22:00 UTC+0300, and I cannot do simple arithmetics now for some reason | 19:15 |
| alga | th1a: I don't think it's much of a problem | 19:15 |
| th1a | Does it make more sense for me to look for a separate team to do calendaring than to do the core platform work? | 19:16 |
| alga | hard to say | 19:16 |
| alga | Marius has a lot of momentum on calendaring | 19:16 |
| *mgedmin prepares an axe | 19:17 | |
| th1a | Momentum but apparently not enthusiasm. | 19:17 |
| alga | but, also, we've got most knowledge on the core platform | 19:17 |
| th1a | Yeah. | 19:17 |
| alga | well, ical sucks and calendaring is boring | 19:17 |
| mgedmin | is it? | 19:18 |
| th1a | Perhaps I could find a team who would work with a school on calendaring. | 19:18 |
| alga | hm | 19:18 |
| alga | OTOH calendaring promises to be much more well-defined | 19:18 |
| mgedmin | actually I do not know if calendaring or platform work would be more interesting | 19:18 |
| th1a | The only other issue is that the hard parts of the calendaring work seem to revolve around permissions, which is pretty much a core thing. | 19:18 |
| mgedmin | but I think we're better qualified to work on core platform | 19:19 |
| th1a | Yeah, I'd agree. | 19:19 |
| mgedmin | otoh if someone else works on the platform, perhaps a fresh look would help clean up the design | 19:19 |
| *mgedmin cannot make up his mind today | 19:19 | |
| th1a | But we'd probably need a Zope 3 hacker, and there aren't many of those. | 19:20 |
| alga | us! us! | 19:21 |
| alga | marius is best in sticking things together | 19:21 |
| alga | he glued twisted, ZODB and interfaces in a day or so | 19:22 |
| th1a | Well, for the moment I'm going to focus my attention more on finding an outside team to do calendaring than finding a new team to do the core work. | 19:27 |
| SteveA | alga, mgedmin: you're not interested in calendaring? | 19:27 |
| *SteveA is somewhat surprised | 19:28 | |
| *mgedmin is surprised that SteveA is suprised | 19:29 | |
| mgedmin | actually I'm not not interested in calendaring (two nots are intentional) | 19:29 |
| mgedmin | I'm just somewhat wary of iCal spec | 19:29 |
| SteveA | "not uninterested" is the idiom | 19:30 |
| mgedmin | thanks | 19:30 |
| SteveA | I think most of the interesting problems with calendaring build upon what you've already done with ical | 19:30 |
| SteveA | did you see that plone product that uses the schooltool ical parser? | 19:31 |
| SteveA | they're using it pretty much as-is. I expect this calendaring project can do the same. | 19:31 |
| th1a | I think it is a matter of making a choice between doing more core stuff or platform stuff. | 19:32 |
| th1a | Or calendaring stuff, I mean. | 19:32 |
| SteveA | mark is extremely keen on the calendaring stuff | 19:35 |
| th1a | That's why they both need to happen soon and at the same time. | 19:36 |
| th1a | Firming up the platform is a bottleneck for everything else. | 19:37 |
| th1a | Notwithstanding the desires of POV, it is also a question of which task it will be easier to find a second team to do. | 19:39 |
| SteveA | see if you can get sidnei da silva interested | 19:39 |
| SteveA | he took the schooltool ical stuff to use with a plone product | 19:39 |
| th1a | OK. Either way you guys have more connections in the Zope world than I do. | 19:40 |
| th1a | So let me know if you have ideas. | 19:40 |
| *SteveA sends sidnei and tom an introductory email | 19:42 | |
| th1a | Thanks. | 19:42 |
| ---th1a is now known as th1a|showering | 19:49 | |
| <--alga has quit ("rebooting") | 20:02 | |
| ---th1a|showering is now known as th1a | 20:07 | |
| th1a | I'm 90% certain we're going to have Oren Sreebny from the University of Washington here tomorrow at 1900 Vilnius time to talk about calendaring issues. | 20:10 |
| <--gintas has quit ("Bye") | 20:39 | |
| ---Disconnected (). | 20:41 | |
| **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jul 21 20:41:09 2004 | ||
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